April 2, 20197 yr Moncada has looked fine at third if not elite defensively. Once he learns to stop double clutching and making better throws, he should be an elite defensive 3rd baseman
April 2, 20197 yr Just now, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said: What would it take to lock this guy up thru the 2025 season? He already got his life changing money. He doesn't need the guarantee, so not gonna happen.
April 2, 20197 yr 2 minutes ago, mqr said: He already got his life changing money. He doesn't need the guarantee, so not gonna happen. Why not? It’s happened with others.
April 2, 20197 yr 3 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said: Why not? It’s happened with others. He's not going to take a sweetheart deal like Anderson and Eloy because he already has 25 million in the bank. If he's not going to take a team friendly deal, it's not worth the risk. Acuna was only given a $100,000 bonus when he signed. There's a world of difference in their situations. Edited April 2, 20197 yr by mqr
April 2, 20197 yr 4 minutes ago, mqr said: He's not going to take a sweetheart deal like Anderson and Eloy because he already has 25 million in the bank. If he's not going to take a team friendly deal, it's not worth the risk. Acuna was only given a $100,000 bonus when he signed. There's a world of difference in their situations. Why then would Bogearts, Goldy, Altuve, Hicks, etc. accept long term extensions? They all earned life changing money before signing their extensions.
April 2, 20197 yr 6 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said: Why then would Bogearts, Goldy, Altuve, Hicks, etc. accept long term extensions? They all earned life changing money before signing their extensions. All of those guys are/were proven assets on contract years and were given market rate-ish deals. Again, completely different different situation. If you want to through Moncada 120 million fully guaranteed I'm sure he'd take it, but the Sox aren't going to do that, and they would be really dumb to. Edited April 2, 20197 yr by mqr
April 2, 20197 yr 8 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said: Why then would Bogearts, Goldy, Altuve, Hicks, etc. accept long term extensions? They all earned life changing money before signing their extensions. Because all of those were nearing FA when they signed their deals, and FA is an absolute clusterfuck right now for the players. Very different. Edited April 2, 20197 yr by ChiSox59
April 2, 20197 yr 2 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said: Because 3/4 were nearing FA when they signed their deals, and FA is an absolute clusterfuck right now for the players. Jean Segura, Wil Myers, Brandon Belt, Mike Trout, plenty of guys have signed extensions before hitting free agency even though they made millions prior to the extension. What amount of money thru 2025 season would be enticing enough for Moncada to sign while not exposing the WS to a risky contract?
April 2, 20197 yr 2 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said: Jean Segura, Wil Myers, Brandon Belt, Mike Trout, plenty of guys have signed extensions before hitting free agency even though they made millions prior to the extension. What amount of money thru 2025 season would be enticing enough for Moncada to sign while not exposing the WS to a risky contract? Who knows, but I think Moncada would prefer to bet on himself via the arbitration process than take a team friendly team. He's already a wealthy man.
April 2, 20197 yr 14 minutes ago, mqr said: All of those guys are/were proven assets on contract years and were given market rate-ish deals. Again, completely different different situation. If you want to through Moncada 120 million fully guaranteed I'm sure he'd take it, but the Sox aren't going to do that, and they would be really dumb to. That was my question, not whether he’d accept a sweetheart deal. What would it take to sign him thru 2025? $120M guaranteed? Seems a bit high to me. I was thinking $60M guaranteed with team options of $18-$20M in 2024 and 2025.
April 2, 20197 yr Just now, ChiSox59 said: Who knows, but I think Moncada would prefer to bet on himself via the arbitration process than take a team friendly team. He's already a wealthy man. Maybe but if someone dangled another $60-70M guaranteed in front of me it would be awfully difficult to pass up even if I already had $25M in the bank (probably far less than that after accounting for taxes but that’s besides the point)...
April 2, 20197 yr Just now, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said: Maybe but if someone dangled another $60-70M guaranteed in front of me it would be awfully difficult to pass up even if I already had $25M in the bank (probably far less than that after accounting for taxes but that’s besides the point)... Say the Sox offered him a 7 year $60M extension. That would buy out his remaining two pre-arb years, 3 arb years, and 2 FA years. Structure is something like this: $4M signing bonus 2019: $650k 2020: $2.5M 2021: $6M 2022: $8M 2023: $10M 2024: $13M 2025: $16M Does Yoan take that? Do the Sox gain enough by getting 2 more FA years at $15M AAV? Maybe that would be of interest for him, maybe not. Who knows.
April 2, 20197 yr 1 minute ago, ChiSox59 said: Say the Sox offered him a 7 year $60M extension. That would buy out his remaining two pre-arb years, 3 arb years, and 2 FA years. Structure is something like this: $4M signing bonus 2019: $650k 2020: $2.5M 2021: $6M 2022: $8M 2023: $10M 2024: $13M 2025: $16M Does Yoan take that? Do the Sox gain enough by getting 2 more FA years at $15M AAV? Maybe that would be of interest for him, maybe not. Who knows. That seems like it’d be a steal for the Sox. I was thinking they’d have to guarantee him ~$60M thru 2023 and then team options in the range of $18-20M. He hits free agency at age 30 if the team picks up both options, age 28 if they don’t.
April 2, 20197 yr At some point the guys who haven't extended have to be thinking that getting the FA market to themselves might be highly profitable with all of the talent locked up.
April 2, 20197 yr 9 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said: That seems like it’d be a steal for the Sox. I was thinking they’d have to guarantee him ~$60M thru 2023 and then team options in the range of $18-20M. He hits free agency at age 30 if the team picks up both options, age 28 if they don’t. I don't see how guaranteeing Moncada $60M over the next 5 would make any sense. He's pretty much guaranteed to make less than that thru the arb process unless he turns into a top 10-15 player in the league.
April 2, 20197 yr 35 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said: Say the Sox offered him a 7 year $60M extension. That would buy out his remaining two pre-arb years, 3 arb years, and 2 FA years. Structure is something like this: $4M signing bonus 2019: $650k 2020: $2.5M 2021: $6M 2022: $8M 2023: $10M 2024: $13M 2025: $16M Does Yoan take that? Do the Sox gain enough by getting 2 more FA years at $15M AAV? Maybe that would be of interest for him, maybe not. Who knows. I'm usually conservative about money matters, but no, I wouldn't take that ever in Yoan's position. Not with $25 million in the bank. If I'm Yoan Moncada, I play out the next season, or several seasons if necessary, and I become willing to talk a 9 figure extension once I've made an all star team, not before. If he does ever break out, he's a guy who could be talking about a long term deal 3-4x as lucrative as the one you just wrote. With everyone else, you're talking about guys who have $2-5 million in the bank, maybe less, so a $25 million guarantee is life-changing money. For Moncada, $25 million is already banked, so you're not giving him enough security with that deal, he can afford to wait until he earns something higher.
April 2, 20197 yr 3 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: I'm usually conservative about money matters, but no, I wouldn't take that ever in Yoan's position. Not with $25 million in the bank. If I'm Yoan Moncada, I play out the next season, or several seasons if necessary, and I become willing to talk a 9 figure extension once I've made an all star team, not before. If he does ever break out, he's a guy who could be talking about a long term deal 3-4x as lucrative as the one you just wrote. With everyone else, you're talking about guys who have $2-5 million in the bank, maybe less, so a $25 million guarantee is life-changing money. For Moncada, $25 million is already banked, so you're not giving him enough security with that deal, he can afford to wait until he earns something higher. I agree. I was just playing along with the question posted by JUSTBELIEVE.
April 2, 20197 yr 8 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: I'm usually conservative about money matters, but no, I wouldn't take that ever in Yoan's position. Not with $25 million in the bank. If I'm Yoan Moncada, I play out the next season, or several seasons if necessary, and I become willing to talk a 9 figure extension once I've made an all star team, not before. If he does ever break out, he's a guy who could be talking about a long term deal 3-4x as lucrative as the one you just wrote. With everyone else, you're talking about guys who have $2-5 million in the bank, maybe less, so a $25 million guarantee is life-changing money. For Moncada, $25 million is already banked, so you're not giving him enough security with that deal, he can afford to wait until he earns something higher. Moncada signed a $31.5M contract with the Red Sox. He has his money. Moncada is one guy that might be hard to keep around. Same with Robert, who has $26M in the bank already as well, should he become everything we hope. Out of the guys that might want security, Eloy and Lopez are the guys. Giolito's family is already wealthy, and Moncada has his money banked. Edited April 2, 20197 yr by Jack Parkman
April 2, 20197 yr Moncada, Tatis Jr., Acuna are all close to the same players. They are not spectacular hitters. Just average hitters who K alot. They can grow but they have had the same stats their entire minor league career. If anything Moncada will pan out to be the best of those 3 players. With that said, I wouldn't pay him yet. Now Soto is a different character, I can see him possibly Hall of Fame worthy. Edited April 2, 20197 yr by Chisox378
April 2, 20197 yr 2 hours ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said: Jean Segura, Wil Myers, Brandon Belt, Mike Trout, plenty of guys have signed extensions before hitting free agency even though they made millions prior to the extension. What amount of money thru 2025 season would be enticing enough for Moncada to sign while not exposing the WS to a risky contract? Of course moncada would sign an extension, but probably not a 5/40 type of team friendly extension.
April 2, 20197 yr 1 hour ago, ChiSox59 said: I don't see how guaranteeing Moncada $60M over the next 5 would make any sense. He's pretty much guaranteed to make less than that thru the arb process unless he turns into a top 10-15 player in the league. Because guaranteeing that money provides the Sox with team options on him in 2024 and 2025. That’s the benefit from the Sox perspective. From Moncada’s perspective it’s $60M guaranteed. Yes, he already has money in the bank but another $60M guaranteed is (1) more than he’d make thru the arb process and (2) more than double the amount of his initial bonus. So even by a rich man’s standards, it’s a significant payday.
April 2, 20197 yr He's at .4 fWAR with a 249 wRC+ and a 16.5% K percentage. A soft contact rate of 7.1%. An incredible start.
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