4 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

He wasn’t the pick of the litter, but given how the NBA works he was basically paid the same as the other stars.  Boozer was a bad signing, but not because he was of the cheap variety.

He was a bad signing because when you say you are going to spend money, you almost have to, and the Bulls usually lose the  musical chairs game with the other teams that have room for max contracts, and all that usually gets you is Boozer or Eddie Robinson or Ron Mercer. 2 of them who JR paid to go home.

only thing more depressing than talking about the white sox of the last decade is talking about the bulls

This doesn't feel like good news

19 hours ago, ron883 said:

Sign and trade. He was essentially a FA signing. He was also a 2 time all-star when he signed. He averaged 20, 11, and 3 the season before. He was without question a top free agent. By your logic, Pujols wasn't a top free agent because he sucked throughout his contract with the angels. 

Yet he wasn't. And unlike Pujols, he's not a future HOFer, didn't sign anywhere close to a record contract, A season where legitimate championship caliber free agents did sign. Lebron, Dwayne Wade (not the shitty version your Chicago Bulls signed) and Chris Bosh. But stick with your narrative.

Yes, the Bulls have been a premier Free Agent destination since Jerry gleefully pulled the plug on the Jordan era. The great Carlos Boozer signed here. Such an attractive place to play, Gotta love playing for GarPax and Jerry, why would anyone with a choice play anywhere else. Dear Leader, we thank you for the crumbs you graciously provide.

 

 

 

26 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Yet he wasn't. And unlike Pujols, he's not a future HOFer, didn't sign anywhere close to a record contract, A season where legitimate championship caliber free agents did sign. Lebron, Dwayne Wade (not the shitty version your Chicago Bulls signed) and Chris Bosh. But stick with your narrative.

Yes, the Bulls have been a premier Free Agent destination since Jerry gleefully pulled the plug on the Jordan era. The great Carlos Boozer signed here. Such an attractive place to play, Gotta love playing for GarPax and Jerry, why would anyone with a choice play anywhere else. Dear Leader, we thank you for the crumbs you graciously provide.

 

 

 

Boozer was 100% a free agent signing and if you are arguing otherwise you simply don’t understand how the NBA works.

43 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Boozer was 100% a free agent signing and if you are arguing otherwise you simply don’t understand how the NBA works.

Claiming Boozer or any other free agent signing over the past two decades was a "top" free agent signing doesn't understand how the NBA works. Between the toxic owner and front office, nobody with better options was signing with the Bulls. Period.

As bad as GarPax sucked (466-437 .516), they still managed a better record than

• White Sox Tony La Russa (522-510 .506)
• White Sox GarPax (Hahn/Williams 526-667.440)

This is the toxic history that Michael is attempting to rectify with the Bulls after years of effort and finally being able to clean house. Someone, be it Reinsdorf kids or an external owner will need to undertake with the White Sox once Jerry departs from his role or Earth. I'm hoping for new blood, but anyone is better than the current option.

 

27 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Claiming Boozer or any other free agent signing over the past two decades was a "top" free agent signing doesn't understand how the NBA works. Between the toxic owner and front office, nobody with better options was signing with the Bulls. Period.

As bad as GarPax sucked (466-437 .516), they still managed a better record than

• White Sox Tony La Russa (522-510 .506)
• White Sox GarPax (Hahn/Williams 526-667.440)

This is the toxic history that Michael is attempting to rectify with the Bulls after years of effort and finally being able to clean house. Someone, be it Reinsdorf kids or an external owner will need to undertake with the White Sox once Jerry departs from his role or Earth. I'm hoping for new blood, but anyone is better than the current option.

 

You’re missing the point here.  I’m not arguing that Boozer was a good free agent signing or that GarPax did well in free agency in general, but rather that Boozer isn’t proof of a Reinsdorf run organization going cheap.  They wanted to sign two of the big three that offseason and whiffed, which resulted in them pivoting to a still very expensive Boozer.

2 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said:

You’re missing the point here.  I’m not arguing that Boozer was a good free agent signing or that GarPax did well in free agency in general, but rather that Boozer isn’t proof of a Reinsdorf run organization going cheap.  They wanted to sign two of the big three that offseason and whiffed, which resulted in them pivoting to a still very expensive Boozer.

If that was your point, I agree. I never said the reason FAs passed on the Bulls was due to cheapness. I stated nobody wanted to come here to play for a poorly run franchise, a series of bad coaches and poor prospects for team success. The FO/coaching in place now makes a Bulls offer at least worth listening to, whereas before it was simply for leverage with a team a top FA wanted to play for.

The Sox had a similar problem, but not to that extreme, attracting FAs with no other bids for what they were offering in terms of years and $s. Hendriks is the first Top FA who selected the White Sox with similar competitive bids by other teams. In this instance, La Russa helped due to his previous relationship. $13M / year is a lot, and one can argue it was better to spend the money in RF/SP and use Bummer plus Colome or another FA. However, this deal is more reasonable and not as restrictive as the $18M / year for both Grandal and Keuchel (30% of current payroll).

Grandal and Keuchel did not have similar bids from other teams, would have preferred the Sox offered 2-3 year deals tops with a similar AAV, give the team more flexibility when their core is making substantially more $.

Take care and peace.

Edited March 6, 20215 yr by South Side Hit Men

1 hour ago, South Side Hit Men said:

If that was your point, I agree. I never said the reason FAs passed on the Bulls was due to cheapness. I stated nobody wanted to come here to play for a poorly run franchise, a series of bad coaches and poor prospects for team success. The FO/coaching in place now makes a Bulls offer at least worth listening to, whereas before it was simply for leverage with a team a top FA wanted to play for.

The Sox had a similar problem, but not to that extreme, attracting FAs with no other bids for what they were offering in terms of years and $s. Hendriks is the first Top FA who selected the White Sox with similar competitive bids by other teams. In this instance, La Russa helped due to his previous relationship. $13M / year is a lot, and one can argue it was better to spend the money in RF/SP and use Bummer plus Colome or another FA. However, this deal is more reasonable and not as restrictive as the $18M / year for both Grandal and Keuchel (30% of current payroll).

Grandal and Keuchel did not have similar bids from other teams, would have preferred the Sox offered 2-3 year deals tops with a similar AAV, give the team more flexibility when their core is making substantially more $.

Take care and peace.

You are stating this as fact when you simply don’t know it to be true. 

1 hour ago, Tony said:

You are stating this as fact when you simply don’t know it to be true. 

Any evidence or articles there were? MLB Rumor reporting is robust, especially for "top" free agent signings. Would be interested in any link or quote of any rumor that any other team made an offer or was interested in either of these two even close to a 4 year $18M + AAV. I performed a Google search for both, and couldn't find anything between October and their signing dates other than reports of their signing, and one reference in MLB Trade Rumors (Padres "taking a look" at Keuchel and Bumgarner).

Both were signed like most players acquired over the past two years the early part of free agency. They are good players, the Sox needed pitching, just saying 4 years has already, and will continue to limit other signings, and their production will likely decline the final seasons like a majority of players in their mid 30s.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!

1 hour ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Any evidence or articles there were? MLB Rumor reporting is robust, especially for "top" free agent signings. Would be interested in any link or quote of any rumor that any other team made an offer or was interested in either of these two even close to a 4 year $18M + AAV. I performed a Google search for both, and couldn't find anything between October and their signing dates other than reports of their signing, and one reference in MLB Trade Rumors (Padres "taking a look" at Keuchel and Bumgarner).

Both were signed like most players acquired over the past two years the early part of free agency. They are good players, the Sox needed pitching, just saying 4 years has already, and will continue to limit other signings, and their production will likely decline the final seasons like a majority of players in their mid 30s.

No, but that doesn’t mean your opinion then becomes fact. I’m simply stating you don’t know other offers that were out there for Grandal and Keuchle. Neither do I.