QUOTE(RockRaines @ Nov 15, 2005 -> 11:54 AM)

Pfffffff!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Wow, spit all over my screen.

 

So, lets get this straight, on offense, A-rod had better numbers right?

So...You think if Ortiz played the field then he would have won, because he would be about the same value in the field as A-rod?

 

Well, then A-rod would be more valuable because he would still be better offensively, right?

Now, lets stop smoking crack for a second.  Ortiz only plays one side of the ball.  He has no chance to help, or hurt his team when they are in the field.  A-rod helps his team by being a good fielder at 3B and plays twice as much as Ortiz.  If they had identical numbers on offense, which they dont, and A-rod helps out his team twice as much as Ortiz does, wouldnt he be more valuable?

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jayson stark solidifed my argument in balta's link provided above. how do you say... you got owned?

This award was all about offense, unless you think A-Rod's bad defense is more valuable than Ortiz never playing defense.

 

I don't believe that somebody that doesn't play other than 4 or 5 AB's a game should win MVP, but Ortiz definitely had a strong case in these circumstances...

Those two are west of the Hudson.  They don't count.

 

How does that make sense.... the MVP has come out of the West division for soo long.

How does that make sense.... the MVP has come out of the West division for soo long.

 

It doesn't. I thought of that myself after some time had passed.

Those two are west of the Hudson.  They don't count.

 

subtle, that was very nice.

jayson stark solidifed my argument in balta's link provided above.  how do you say... you got owned?

Yes, because he is the end all be all of sports knowledge. Why dont you back up that argument with a Gammons quote and I will give you a penny.

 

A-rod=better offensive stats-plays defense

Ortiz=worse stats in the only position he plays

 

A-rod is more valuable to his team. If you like I will build a nice business case around the actual worth of a resource to a company (team) and someone who is productive 100 percent more often will always come out on top. Thanks anyway.

give me a break, rock. you're making yourself look like a fool.

 

it could be argued, and most Yankee fans would agree, that Rivera, Jeter, and Matsui are all more important pieces to that Yankee team than Alex Rodriguez.

 

stop with the bitterness, Ortiz could just have easily won that award and in my opinion without question should have. if its so farfetched to have that same mindset as i, why did he recieve so many first place votes?

The masses are asses. That's a good reason.

The masses are asses.  That's a good reason.

 

 

LMAO..

give me a break, rock.  you're making yourself look like a fool.

 

it could be argued, and most Yankee fans would agree, that Rivera, Jeter, and Matsui are all more important pieces to that Yankee team than Alex Rodriguez. 

 

stop with the bitterness, Ortiz could just have easily won that award and in my opinion without question should have.  if its so farfetched to have that same mindset as i, why did he recieve so many first place votes?

How am I making myseld look like a fool?

A-rod is more valuable than Ortiz, look at the numbers, he is better offensively and defensively than Ortiz. How is that unclear?

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Nov 16, 2005 -> 04:13 PM)

How am I making myseld look like a fool?

A-rod is more valuable than Ortiz, look at the numbers, he is better offensively and defensively than Ortiz.  How is that unclear?

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you were miffed that I or anyone for that matter could even consider Ortiz the Most Valuable Player in the American League. Thats how your making yourself look foolish.

 

It's unclear for many reasons, you're just to ignorant to realize it.

you were miffed that I or anyone for that matter could even consider Ortiz the Most Valuable Player in the American League.  Thats how your making yourself look foolish.

 

It's unclear for many reasons, you're just to ignorant to realize it.

Im not miffed, nor do I care who wins. I just find it hard to believe that anyone can make a case for a DH, with worse offensive stats, winning the MVP over a position player. It just doesnt make logical sense. Im not attacking you, just that position.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Nov 16, 2005 -> 04:25 PM)

Im not miffed, nor do I care who wins.  I just find it hard to believe that anyone can make a case for a DH, with worse offensive stats, winning the MVP over a position player.  It just doesnt make logical sense.  Im not attacking you, just that position.

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Yea, I really don't care who wins either, but with that mindset, I don't get the voting process as a whole.

 

If a DH can't win the MVP, why can he be voted second? Ortiz, Hafner, etc. should have either won it slash been where they are, or not have been in the running at all. There is no inbetween.

Yea, I really don't care who wins either, but with that mindset, I don't get the voting process as a whole.

 

If a DH can't win the MVP, why can he be voted second?  Ortiz, Hafner, etc. should have either won it slash been where they are, or not have been in the running at all.  There is no inbetween.

Hey, I said it before, it should be the player who is most valuable to his TEAM, not by the numbers. But since they have made it by the numbers, A-rod is your clear winner because he plays both sides, he has superior offense, and he has put outs.

 

I still think the whole system is messed up, because they dont take into account who is on the team, how good the team would be without them, and what they have done as far as winning games for their teams.

The New York media not impressed with A-Fraud's MVP

 

Bill Gallo NY Daily News

 

A-Fraud's

You are so clever.

Arod is a pretty darn good 3rd baseman and range factor and zone rating won't convince me otherwise.

Thats the way I see it. I just know in the games I've watched he's looked very good over at the hot corner. I think sometimes those stats can be skewed. I can't say how in this case, but for all I know there weren't that many balls hit to 3rd base due to some odditiy by Yankee pitching (maybe they all throw really hard so not as many guys pull the ball???).

Who said DH's cant win the MVP? It was just said a guy who plays defense and has similar and in this case overall better offensive stats will have the advantage. Where are you coming with this crap that DH's cant win MVP's. Its understandable you wanted Ortiz to win since your a Red Sox fan but why make up s***?

Who said DH's cant win the MVP?  It was just said a guy who plays defense and has similar and in this case overall better offensive stats will have the advantage.  Where are you coming with this crap that DH's cant win MVP's.  Its understandable you wanted Ortiz to win since your a Red Sox fan but why make up s***?

 

Yep, I'd say R&W's MVP preference was rather, well, predictable.

QUOTE(SoxFan101 @ Nov 17, 2005 -> 12:19 AM)

Who said DH's cant win the MVP?  It was just said a guy who plays defense and has similar and in this case overall better offensive stats will have the advantage.  Where are you coming with this crap that DH's cant win MVP's.  Its understandable you wanted Ortiz to win since your a Red Sox fan but why make up s***?

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all of espn, all of the people who didn't vote for Ortiz. basically everyone who didnt vote for Ortiz that had a say in who won this award believed that a dh could not win it.

 

QUOTE(YASNY @ Nov 17, 2005 -> 05:48 AM)

Yep, I'd say R&W's MVP preference was rather, well, predictable.

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just as predictable as it was for you to make up an excuse of why Ortiz and Rodriguez were in the running to begin with.

 

QUOTE(YASNY @ Nov 15, 2005 -> 01:07 PM)

Those two are west of the Hudson.  They don't count.

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all of espn, all of the people who didn't vote for Ortiz.  basically everyone who didnt vote for Ortiz that had a say in who won this award believed that a dh could not win it.

 

 

I think that's probably a gross generalization.

 

Maybe, just maybe, they voted for A-rod because he had better stats, along with the fact that he played defense and was on the team that won the division.

all of espn, all of the people who didn't vote for Ortiz.  basically everyone who didnt vote for Ortiz that had a say in who won this award believed that a dh could not win it.

 

I think, even though your preference is understood, you make a good point on who was more valuable as far as the offensive side of things. Ortiz probably had more to do with wins with his bat than A-rod. BUt this has turned into a numbers game, and A-rods numbers were better, and he plays btoh sides of the ball which gives him an advantage. But a DH can win it. Frank has 2 (3) MVP's.

I agree with RNW, and hes nowhere to be found to read it?

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Nov 17, 2005 -> 09:18 AM)

I think, even though your preference is understood, you make a good point on who was more valuable as far as the offensive side of things.  Ortiz probably had more to do with wins with his bat than A-rod.  BUt this has turned into a numbers game, and A-rods numbers were better, and he plays btoh sides of the ball which gives him an advantage.  But a DH can win it.  Frank has 2 (3) MVP's.

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stop the presses! Rock and I agree on something? haha. I agree with what your saying, my freind, and we'll end it at that.