No team wants to trade for a reliever WITH A KNOWN BUM BACK

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Are you sure? (applies to both arm and back, btw)

Are you sure? (applies to both arm and back, btw)

 

You make me laff.

Another decent option would be Juan Cruz.  He's probably not going to make the A's bullpen and KW and Beane have dealt quite a bit with each other.

 

Juan Cruz can pitch in the majors. That's a bit more realistic than Osuna

Juan Cruz can pitch in the majors. That's a bit more realistic than Osuna

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Don't be so sure...

 

Juan Cruz (career stats): 4.36 ERA | 1.44 WHIP | .250 BAA | 8.45 K/9

Antonio Osuna (career stats): 3.68 ERA | 1.31 WHIP | .238 BAA | 9.23 K/9

 

Obviously the stats are a bit skewed because Cruz started 23 games for the Cubs. Cruz has a lot more upside but I wouldn't exactly put my money on him to outperform Osuna. If Cruz is throwing strikes he's fine but he is known to have trouble with his command at times and then he's pretty much worthless.

Edited March 17, 200620 yr by SSH2005

I wouldn't mind Juan Cruz. He's a hardthrowing righthander who can't possibly post numbers worst than a Backless Hermanson. I still recall his first game in the major leagues--I believe it was Dave Otto whom used the term "Little Pedro" to describe his explosiveness.

 

It all depends on what Beane is willing to accept for Cruz. Cruz has talent and has atleast proven in Atlanta the ability to be a reliable setup man. What would he want for someone like that?

Wasn't there rumors last season that KW was close to acquiring Cruz?

QUOTE(Dick Allen @ Mar 17, 2006 -> 07:26 AM)

Wasn't there rumors last season that KW was close to acquiring Cruz?

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No, people on the board were thinking we would be able to get him after DFA Shingo.

Don't be so sure...

 

Juan Cruz (career stats):  4.36 ERA  |  1.44 WHIP  |  .250 BAA  |  8.45 K/9

Antonio Osuna (career stats):  3.68 ERA  |  1.31 WHIP  |  .238 BAA  |  9.23 K/9

 

Obviously the stats are a bit skewed because Cruz started 23 games for the Cubs.  Cruz has a lot more upside but I wouldn't exactly put my money on him to outperform Osuna.  If Cruz is throwing strikes he's fine but he is known to have trouble with his command at times and then he's pretty much worthless.

 

Osuna is like 40 isn't he. If this was 2002 maybe. But the 2006 Osuna should be nowhere near a playoff contender, stats be damned. He hasn't thrown many innings the last few yrs.

 

Cruz could give the sox some innings. He threw 107 2/3 last yr [with 75 in AAA as a SP]. He threw 74 IP's in '04 with ATL. The sox need someone to eat innings, ala Vizcaino. I could see Cruz throwing a lot of mop up innings. Whoever the sox get should be able to do both--eat innings and have some upside/ talent.

Edited March 18, 200620 yr by beck72

Osuna is like 40 isn't he. If this was 2002 maybe. But the 2006 Osuna should be nowhere near a playoff contender, stats be damned. He hasn't thrown many innings the last few yrs.

 

Cruz could give the sox some innings. He threw 107 2/3 last yr [with 75 in AAA as a SP]. He threw 74 IP's in '04 with ATL. The sox need someone to eat innings, ala Vizcaino. I could see Cruz throwing a lot of mop up innings. Whoever the sox get should be able to do both--eat innings and have some upside/ talent.

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Antonio Osuna is 32 years old. He's the same age as Politte and a year younger than Hermanson. Osuna's last good season was with the Padres in 2004 (37.2 IP, 2.45 ERA). He also pitched well with the Yankees in 2003 (50.2 IP, 3.73 ERA). I'm not saying that he's a GREAT option but he's damn sure better than Tim Redding as a replacement for Hermanson. I wouldn't mind Juan Cruz either but who knows if he's available and who knows what Kenny would have to give up for him? Osuna is a free agent and could be acquired for next to nothing (a minor league deal).

The Newark Stark Ledger reported a while back that the A's have been dangling Cruz in trade talks for a while now. And why wouldn't they, they've got 7 starters (8 if you include Cruz), and an incredible amount of depth.

 

So if we're going to trade for Cruz, we'll probably have to give up a fairly good prospect I'd say, since Oakland don't have a great need for anything else at this stage.

The Newark Stark Ledger reported a while back that the A's have been dangling Cruz in trade talks for a while now. And why wouldn't they, they've got 7 starters (8 if you include Cruz), and an incredible amount of depth.

 

So if we're going to trade for Cruz, we'll probably have to give up a fairly good prospect I'd say, since Oakland don't have a great need for anything else at this stage.

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That's my point. Beane isn't going to give Cruz up for some scrubs. Relievers are at a premium right now. Everyone wants them. The Nationals just lost their great setup man Luis Ayala for the season after he got injured pitching in the WBC. Even a guy like Cruz won't be cheap.

Antonio Osuna is 32 years old.  He's the same age as Politte and a year younger than Hermanson.  Osuna's last good season was with the Padres in 2004 (37.2 IP, 2.45 ERA).  He also pitched well with the Yankees in 2003 (50.2 IP, 3.73 ERA).  I'm not saying that he's a GREAT option but he's damn sure better than Tim Redding as a replacement for Hermanson.  I wouldn't mind Juan Cruz either but who knows if he's available and who knows what Kenny would have to give up for him?  Osuna is a free agent and could be acquired for next to nothing (a minor league deal).

 

The sox need a guy who can give them innings, and go more than 1 inning at a time, esp. during mop up time. Osuna isn't that guy

The sox need a guy who can give them innings, and go more than 1 inning at a time, esp. during mop up time. Osuna isn't that guy

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I thought that we needed a guy to replace Hermanson and pitch one maybe two innings at a time? McCarthy is replacing Vizcaino. Hermanson pretty much pitched an inning per outing last season (57 games, 57.1 IP).

Edited March 18, 200620 yr by SSH2005

I thought that we needed a guy to replace Hermanson and pitch one maybe two innings at a time?  McCarthy is replacing Vizcaino.  Hermanson pretty much pitched an inning per outing last season (57 games, 57.1 IP).

 

Bmac will see a lot of time with the game on the line--6, 7, 8th innings. He shouldn't be doing Vizcaino mop up duty. But having a guy who can go more than an inning each time out would be very important. Osuna barely saw two innings last year

Bmac will see a lot of time with the game on the line--6, 7, 8th innings. He shouldn't be doing Vizcaino mop up duty. But having a guy who can go more than an inning each time out would be very important. Osuna barely saw two innings last year

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The point is that McCarthy will be eating up innings, isn't it? That was Vizcaino's role last season. Hermanson pitched an inning per outing last season and he's the one we have to replace. Afterall, he's the guy who's injured right?

 

By the way, Juan Cruz pitched 32.2 innings last season and was shellacked to the tune of a 7.44 ERA AND he would cost talent to acquire.

The point is that McCarthy will be eating up innings, isn't it?  That was Vizcaino's role last season.  Hermanson pitched an inning per outing last season and he's the one we have to replace.  Afterall, he's the guy who's injured right?

 

By the way, Juan Cruz pitched 32.2 innings last season and was shellacked to the tune of a 7.44 ERA AND he would cost talent to acquire.

 

BMac isn't just going to eat innings. He'll play an important role during key parts of games. Viz often was one of the last guys called. Bmac won't be in that same Viz role.

 

BTW, Cruz threw over 100 innings last yr--75 in AAA as a SP. And the 32 with the A's.

 

My point is Cruz may not be the guy the sox get. But he's a hellava lot better option than a guy like Osuna you've been advocating on virtually every thread. Enough.

BMac isn't just going to eat innings. He'll play an important role during key parts of games. Viz often was one of the last guys called. Bmac won't be in that same Viz role.

 

BTW, Cruz threw over 100 innings last yr--75 in AAA as a SP. And the 32 with the A's.

 

My point is Cruz may not be the guy the sox get. But he's a hellava lot better option than a guy like Osuna you've been advocating on virtually every thread. Enough.

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Okay, but I never said that Osuna was a great option. I said that he was better than Redding. And read through the thread again. Almost every one of your comments regarding Osuna was wrong so I had to correct them.

And read through the thread again.  Almost every one of your comments regarding Osuna was wrong so I had to correct them.

 

If you read through it again, slight exaggerations are used to poke fun at your man love for Antonio

I don't think people are expecting Osuna to jump right in and perform for the Sox if we did sign him. I'd sign him on a MLC, let him start the year in Charlotte, and if he performs well there and if there is a need on our bullpen to upgrade still, you've got an option in Osuna.

 

Always good to cover your bases and have extra options, as we've seen for Hermy's injury.

If you read through it again, slight exaggerations are used to poke fun at your man love for Antonio

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Nope, I just think that you were ill-informed.

 

I don't think people are expecting Osuna to jump right in and perform for the Sox if we did sign him. I'd sign him on a MLC, let him start the year in Charlotte, and if he performs well there and if there is a need on our bullpen to upgrade still, you've got an option in Osuna.

 

Always good to cover your bases and have extra options, as we've seen for Hermy's injury.

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Thanks, exactly my point.

Nope, I just think that you were ill-informed.

Thanks, exactly my point.

Same old Jabroni

I don't think people are expecting Osuna to jump right in and perform for the Sox if we did sign him. I'd sign him on a MLC, let him start the year in Charlotte, and if he performs well there and if there is a need on our bullpen to upgrade still, you've got an option in Osuna.

 

Always good to cover your bases and have extra options, as we've seen for Hermy's injury.

 

Most people are expecting the sox to pick up a guy who could start the yr with the sox though.

 

IMO, the sox got Nomo for the same things people are expecting from a guy like Osuna--help for AAA and an outside shot at helping this yr.

Same old Jabroni

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Read the thread again. I'm not the one telling you to stop talking about a certain player or poking fun at your "man-love" for Juan Cruz.

Jim, what no comments?

Well the LH derby has been cut to three, it's down to Boone Logan, Javier Lopez, and Armando Almanza. Paulino Reynoso was optioned out today. So was Jerry Owens by the way.

Well the LH derby has been cut to three, it's down to Boone Logan, Javier Lopez, and Armando Almanza.  Paulino Reynoso was optioned out today.  So was Jerry Owens by the way.

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Reynoso really has good stuff. He really (obviously) needs to hone his control.