caulfield12 Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 (edited) We're back to the same problem with Delgado, on multiple occasions he hasn't waived no trade clauses or has basically shown no desire to come here. As someone brought up earlier, I'm sure there is nothing contractual about standing for the playing of that song. It's one of these silly arguments, like candidates for political office have to wear American flag pins to prove they're patriotic. What would be interesting for me to see would be if an American baseball player playing winter ball or in the World Baseball Classic refused to stand for the Puerto Rican national anthem at a game in San Juan...would Delgado also be receptive to that? It's kind of like the "King's Anthem" which is played before movies here in Thailand...even if I am the only person in the theatre, I stand out of respect, even though he's not my king. If I remember correctly, wasn't there something going on with the bombing grounds in Puerto Rico for US planes? I can't remember if the specific event which precipitated Delgado's actions was the war in Iraq or something more specific to PR. In the end, I don't mind his actions, as long as he's consistent. Roberto Clemente is my favorite player of all-time and he was never afraid to throw himself into the middle of any argument or to speak his mind. In the end, it's what got him killed...as he boarded a dangerously-overloaded old plane just because he was so determined to ensure that earthquake relief supplies got to their intended recipients. Edited December 21, 2009 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 I think the Mets are more likely to bring Delgado back on an incentive laden deal. Was a key part of their resurgance of 2008 when Manuel took over, and if they can sign Bay and get Delgado to rebound, their offense will look a lot better going forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 QUOTE (DBAHO @ Dec 21, 2009 -> 08:42 AM) I think the Mets are more likely to bring Delgado back on an incentive laden deal. Was a key part of their resurgance of 2008 when Manuel took over, and if they can sign Bay and get Delgado to rebound, their offense will look a lot better going forward. The question is...do the Metropolitans think that he can come back and stay nearly 100% healthy playing 1b rather than moving to the DH slot like he would in the AL? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
False Alarm Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 QUOTE (justBLAZE @ Dec 21, 2009 -> 02:13 PM) Pretty sure it started with the whole Beckham would lead of (before Pierre acquisition), and Ozzie said he would rather have Beckham lower in the order not to take away his RBI opportunities, where people got 6th I have no idea. "A lot of people are saying that, and he's the one right now, in the lineup, I have right now," said Guillen of Beckham at leadoff. "That's the only guy really I have. I really would like to have someone out there. I think Beckham is a good RBI man. I don't want to take the bat away from him." Ideally, Guillen would like to have Beckham hit sixth or seventh and start a better-suited player in the lineup's top slot. http://scottmerkin.mlblogs.com/archives/20..._of_wisdom.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Dec 21, 2009 -> 04:36 AM) I dont remember Ozzie ever saying he wants Beckham batting 6th, thats just stupid There are a lot of really bad reasons tossed around on this site to "fire Ozzie." Batting Beckham 6th would actually merit termination. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justBLAZE Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 QUOTE (False Alarm @ Dec 21, 2009 -> 08:45 AM) http://scottmerkin.mlblogs.com/archives/20..._of_wisdom.html Good find. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 Batting Beckham 6th or 7th would've made sense on the 2006 or 2008 teams. But right now, I only see four players who would reasonably be expected to put up an .800 OPS, and only two or three of them with an OBP of .350 or higher. Unless Kenny goes on an offensive spending spree, Beckham has to hit in the top half of the lineup. Ozzie's rationale of "protecting" Beckham makes little sense, given that they batted him 2nd and forced him to learn 3B on the fly in his freaking rookie year. (And, of course, Beckham succeeded with flying colors.) Of course, Ozzie also introduces the idea of Vizquel at DH in this same interview, so my feeling is that he's blowing smoke up Merkin's posterior. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSideSox72 Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 QUOTE (WCSox @ Dec 21, 2009 -> 09:09 AM) There are a lot of really bad reasons tossed around on this site to "fire Ozzie." Batting Beckham 6th would actually merit termination. What? Beckham in the heart of the order at 6 actually makes some sense. I'd rather have him there, and Ramirez at 2. Not only is it not a firing offense, its an idea a lot of people like, myself included. Now, eventually, Beckham may be a #3 hitter. But not to start the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Dec 21, 2009 -> 10:55 AM) What? Beckham in the heart of the order at 6 actually makes some sense. I'd rather have him there, and Ramirez at 2. Not only is it not a firing offense, its an idea a lot of people like, myself included. Now, eventually, Beckham may be a #3 hitter. But not to start the season. I could tolerate Becks hitting 6th, but that's if we sign a DH like Thome who's hitting 5th, and we're ready to move Becks up if he gets going. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Dec 21, 2009 -> 07:55 AM) What? Beckham in the heart of the order at 6 actually makes some sense. I'd rather have him there, and Ramirez at 2. Not only is it not a firing offense, its an idea a lot of people like, myself included. Now, eventually, Beckham may be a #3 hitter. But not to start the season. On many other teams, I'd agree. But this lineup currently has a serious OBP problem. Maybe I'm in a minority, but I want my high-OBP players hitting in the top half of the lineup. I contrast to what Ozzie thinks, I'd much rather that Beckham be used as an on-base guy (hitting in front of CQ and PK) with some power than an RBI guy right now. That means staying in the 2-hole (or possibly hitting 3rd at some point). If Kenny signs somebody like Thome or Delgado, I'd be more comfortable with Beckham hitting 6th temporarily. Edited December 21, 2009 by WCSox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiguy79 Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 Delgado was part of two of the biggest "loser" mets teams ever....Thome is an easy decision over Delgado, that being said I would prefer someone who is not nearing 40 and have a rotation at DH. How many singles will Thome hit off the wall in 2010? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 QUOTE (WCSox @ Dec 21, 2009 -> 10:56 AM) On many other teams, I'd agree. But this lineup currently has a serious OBP problem. Maybe I'm in a minority, but I want my high-OBP players hitting in the top half of the lineup. I contrast to what Ozzie thinks, I'd much rather that Beckham be used as an on-base guy (hitting in front of CQ and PK) with some power than an RBI guy right now. That means staying in the 2-hole (or possibly hitting 3rd at some point). If Kenny signs somebody like Thome or Delgado, I'd be more comfortable with Beckham hitting 6th temporarily. I agree whole-heartedly. IMO, the absolute #1 need for 1 and 2 spots is OBP. Alexei could be 2 hitter if he walked more, but he doesn't. At least the start of this season, Beckham has to bring his OBP to the two spot. Putting him at 6th (instead of 2nd) robs him of something like 72 at bats over the course of the season and reduces RBI from PK/CQ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Dec 21, 2009 -> 12:06 PM) I agree whole-heartedly. IMO, the absolute #1 need for 1 and 2 spots is OBP. Alexei could be 2 hitter if he walked more, but he doesn't. At least the start of this season, Beckham has to bring his OBP to the two spot. Putting him at 6th (instead of 2nd) robs him of something like 72 at bats over the course of the season and reduces RBI from PK/CQ. Alexei actually did really well at drawing walks last year, he drew 49 over the course of the full year. That's really not terrible. If it wasn't for his awful April, he hit .286 with a .342 OBP. His numbers for OBP are down because of how godawful he was in April. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 21, 2009 -> 09:19 AM) Alexei actually did really well at drawing walks last year, he drew 49 over the course of the full year. That's really not terrible. If it wasn't for his awful April, he hit .286 with a .342 OBP. His numbers for OBP are down because of how godawful he was in April. This is true. If this trend continues, he could be a legit #2 hitter (which would be nice, as Beckham is better off as an eventual #3, IMO). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dyuen Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 20, 2009 -> 08:21 PM) I dislike both of those lineups. You've stuck Beckham so low in the order it will cost him AB's. I want him hitting either 2 or 3. AJ really doesn't belong as a # 3 hitter, he's just not an RBI/power guy like I want in that spot. And it's going to take a step forwards from Teahen for him to be an adequate option for #5. ANd in either case, you have a stretch where 5 of 6 hitters are RH and they're only broken apart by Teahen, that sets up quite well to have a RHP rip through the lineup. I dislike any lineup where Rios is hitting 2nd. Lexi is a better hitter than he is and shouldn't be hitting 9th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 QUOTE (docsox24 @ Dec 21, 2009 -> 09:37 AM) I dislike any lineup where Rios is hitting 2nd. Lexi is a better hitter than he is and shouldn't be hitting 9th. 2009 Alexei was a better hitter than 2009 Rios. Prior to that, Rios' hitting and base-stealing numbers are superior. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dyuen Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 QUOTE (WCSox @ Dec 21, 2009 -> 12:10 PM) 2009 Alexei was a better hitter than 2009 Rios. Prior to that, Rios' hitting and base-stealing numbers are superior. Prior to that he wasnt in the league. Shouldn't the lineup be based on their current hitting abilities rather than 3 years ago? Base stealing numbers have nothing to do with where someone should hit in the order. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 QUOTE (docsox24 @ Dec 21, 2009 -> 10:23 AM) Prior to that he wasnt in the league. Shouldn't the lineup be based on their current hitting abilities rather than 3 years ago? Even one year ago, Rios was a better hitter than Alexei. Base stealing numbers have nothing to do with where someone should hit in the order. Not true. See: Rollins, Jimmy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simba43 Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 Oh god no to Delgado Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Springfield Soxfan Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 I really think Delgado is coming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyDo Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 Meh, I can handle Delgado. Remember when Jurassic Carl roamed the...uhhh...where do DH's roam? We'll just say Pangaea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Springfield Soxfan Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 QUOTE (1977 sox fan @ Dec 22, 2009 -> 09:24 AM) Oh god no to Delgado QUOTE (ScottyDo @ Dec 22, 2009 -> 07:19 PM) Meh, I can handle Delgado. Remember when Jurassic Carl roamed the...uhhh...where do DH's roam? We'll just say Pangaea. I can too, would actually be pretty pumped about a marginal salary with a lot of incentives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderBolt Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 I don't think Delgado's done and i do agree he fits a need here. I don't want him before a lot of other guys, but if it comes down to it, bring him in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderBolt Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 QUOTE (chiguy79 @ Dec 21, 2009 -> 12:06 PM) Delgado was part of two of the biggest "loser" mets teams ever.... I've seen a lot of Mets games out here, he was hardly the biggest factor in their collapses. It had more to do with the pen and a disturbing lack of depth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan-kwman Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Dec 20, 2009 -> 01:14 PM) I think Joe Crede would be a great pick up, but then that's just me I agree, Crede as DH would be good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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