Eminor3rd

Value depends on the market. We all have a sense of what we feel like a guy “like Cease” would be worth in an average scenario, but realistically the price is going to depend upon how many suitors remain when all the reasonable alternatives to Cease are off the table. I think there’s a good chance that the situation is right for a Cease deal after Yamamoto/Snell sign, because Glasnow should theoretically require a different kind of return — but it’s totally possible that it ends up making more sense to wait until the deadline, accepting the injury risk, since Cease will still have the additional year of control. I wish I had reason to believe that Getz will be able to read the market properly, but we’ll never truly know, since we won’t know what will ultimately be offered. Regardless, I think a deal is really unlikely until the top free agents sign.

It’s worth noting, though, that Shewmake wasn’t rushed whatsoever. He spent one year per level, and has topped out repeating AAA.

I mean, I guess. I see a team perennially crying poor that traded a reliever, which it needed, for a post-hype glove-only player with some upside. Then they immediately spent some of their limited resources getting a 30 year old player with the same strengths and weaknesses except no upside. If you’re rebuilding, Shewmake needs reps at the big league level. If you’re contending, neither Shewmake nor Dejong is good enough, and btw you actually still need Bummer. And if, whats most likely actually true, this is a wasted transition year and someone is just going to hold the position warm for Montgomery, there’s no reason at all for that not to be Shewmake, who could at least turn into something tradable or useful. What are the chances that can trade Dejong for something more valuable than Shewmake anyway? In what world do you need both? This just feels like random move-making

I just can’t imagine the Sox being the team that gets Manaoh back into form.

Sox obtain mlb ready prospects and then immediately block them

Gonna have to see who’s left after the free agents sign, realistically, to find out what the price is for Cease. If two motivated buyers remain with good systems, the price could be quite high. Otherwise, the deadline might be the better time to sell. I tend to think they’ll make a deal this winter, but it’s not impossible to see some small market contenders settle for mid rotation free agents given Cease’s down year.

Idk why, but I could have sworn I saw something that suggested the first syllable was pronounced “show,” and so I’ve been confused ever since.

Alright guys, I’ve been wondering this for years: How do you pronounce “Shewmake”?

Does this mean we don’t have to get Salvador Perez now?

WAT

Same. Dodgers big favorites, Giants in second, Mets a distant third from what I’ve heard.

There isn't REALLY a path to contention in 2024, but I'm guessing that the FO has decided the fanbase isn't ready to hear them utter "rebuild." Because they think we're idiots, it seems like (based on Getz' comments about no one being untouchable + the rumors of them shopping guys like Cease), that they're going to just do it anyway and pretend they aren't -- perhaps believing that it will give them the cover to half-ass it instead of trying again to do it properly. This could be either because Jerry can't handle the wait, or because they've correctly assessed that they aren't in a good position to pivot (with so many of their expensive players currently with no trade value), or both. I predict we're going to see an offseason very similar to what you'd see from the Tigers, in which a lot of money will be spent on short-term veterans that fill holes and be dealt if useful, but won't stop any of the prospects from earning PT along the way. The hope will be that the "core" bounces back to the extent that a run at the division is possible with the stopgaps in place, but they'll settle for merely having a lot of guys to move for more low-upside, close-to-the-majors prospects that can provide similar value for cheap going forward. Was trying to keep the cynicism out but it crept back there toward the end, sorry.

Absolutely — plus it’s a clear sellers’ market now, meaning the upside from the deadline represents less of a premium than in an average year.

India would be a terrible move for the white Sox. Good but not great player with his mlb control already burning away. If they got India, they’d also need a guy like Cease.

Orioles make too much sense, IMO. I like the idea of the Sox getting some of their close-to-the-majors guys, because they can’t really develop the ones far away.

If the Sox get Kiner-Falefa or Rosario at under $10m, I'll be down for it.

I agree, but given the dearth of available shortstops, I don’t see those guys coming at those prices.

Right but who are you going to get on a one-year deal that has a chance to be better? Multiple years for Amed Rosario or Kiner-Falefa coming off 0.2 fWAR seasons? One year for a bit less for Brandon Crawford coming off a 63 wRC+? Didi Gregorious coming off of 58 wRC+? They're still gonna have to spend, it's just going to be a for a worse player, or a more expensive one, or both.

I think I would have picked this option up. It's very likely Tim will bounce back significantly next year (even if only to league average), simply because it's hard to replicate such an abysmal season for a player who still has so much of his peak athleticism remaining. Moreover, one more year of TA is the perfect bridge to Montgomery, without any reasonable short-term alternative elsewhere in the system. Now, if they want to "compete," the only options are to (1) rush Montgomery, or (2) sign a free agent, which will be less talented than TA and cost just as much (or more, in terms of years). Actually, now that I think about it, this gives the Sox a couple options they are quite comfortable with: ruin prospects by rushing them to the majors and/or light money on fire by spending it as inefficiently as possible on middling players in free agency. I guess if I'm steel-manning the move, it may simply be the case that the year was so unbelievably toxic and TA had such a miserable season that there was just no way to expect better results in 2024 without a change of scenery. I can believe this.

If the Dodgers don't get him, I'll be legitimately shocked.

Indeed, that was what I was getting at in the first part of the post.

Oh, I know. I meant that as “good riddance,” not upset that he’s gone.

I literally can't even come up with the rotation right now. I don't think that's ever happened. EDIT: Also f*** Mike Clevinger

Everyone is gonna be fast tracked until they decide the window is closed. They can’t even fathom the concept of developing for sustained competitiveness, let alone execute it.

That doesn’t mean it wasn’t best for him to be down there. I’m certain he wants to grow into a star player who signs a nine figure contract at some point in his career, and I bet you he’d happily trade another year of buses to get there, because right now he’s on track to be a journeyman that runs out of opportunities in his early 30s. Now, that’s not totally fair, because we don’t know that he actually did need another year, or what, if anything, could actually be done with him to help, because we’re not professionals. But again, there’s a sharp contrast between what we can see the Sox are choosing to do and what every other team is doing, and it’s part of a consistent pattern of disappointment, so I think it’s fair to assume the odds are better than a coin flip that there was a more productive path that existed. My entire adult life, the only thing I’ve ever heard any White Sox coach say about a developing hitter is something along the lines of “we want him to be more aggressive/more aggressive in the zone,” and that sure doesn’t seem like something Vaughn would have needed, but strangely does seem like the way he’s changed since arriving. Other teams talk about swing changes to generate lift and pitch selection training, which, for gifted contact hitters with good eyes and discipline that aren’t getting to enough of their raw power (like Baughn), sounds like exactly what is needed. But that takes time, and requires a willingness to accept bumps on the road. And there never any indication that something like that was even on the table from the Sox. Despite the doublespeak about sustainable winning, their treatment of Vaughn reads like a case study of “push all in to win now” at the clear enormous expense of even the near future. Sacrifice Vaughn’s upside to get a passable bat in the OF right now, as if it was the only way to get such a bat. It’s straight from the Mark Teahen-era Sox playbook, and it’s at the center of what made them failures the whole time — unfailingly choosing the most expensive/least efficient way to get something they need. Vaughn may yet figure out how to tap into his upside, but he’s going to have to do it on his own. And both him and the fans deserve better than that.