Gene Honda Civic

I just reread this thread, to see where it all fell apart. AND...Once again you've come off looking like a complete ass... Your first comment in this thread was "WHO THE f*** CARES!!!!! IT IS OVER AND DONE WITH! GET OVER IT!!!!!! ". You then proceeded to reply to something you don't care about and are obviously over, 21 more times... Through the arc of the thread you first claimed, that we shouldn't be discussing former sox here on soxtalk(funny I don't remember you chiming in on those threads where I posted the doctored images of Bartolo Colon), to contesting whether Kip would suceed in the AL, to arguing that PNC park was a pitchers park, (when I showed you the park factor for the past two years has it favoring hitters to neutral), to denying an incredibly simillar career path to Curt Schilling(which shows why you have to be patient with young pitchers). I have only glanced over the trade in one post, saying that I didn't want to send anyone away. I wanted to develope talent from within. You're the one who keeps bringing that back up. I'm over the trade, I was the day after it was made. That doesn't mean that I have to stop following Kip's career. He was an integral part of one of my favorite Sox memories, and a nice guy, so excuse me for wishing the kid well after this organization gave up on him. I like to follow guys on their progression from the minors to the majors and how thier careers develop. It just so happens that I'm a sox fan, and like to see guys who rose through the ranks of our system suceed at the major league level... I'm pulling for Aaron Miles this year in Colorado. Following these players is not dwelling in the past, it's celebrating the present. Thier success or failure is how you grade out a farm system, how much major league talent does it produce, and how good is the quality of talent that it produces.

Yeah it's such a shame that he got traded to a terrible team in a completely lopsided deal, and he's made the best of it... Definitely a Jag Bag..

I'm gonna go start a game thread for tomorrow, a little over 18 hours away

You're definately spending too much time up north then.... I only know 1.

I'm betting on 5 new threads in the next 5 minutes... WHITE SOX WINNER TAKE THAT KC REVENGENCEFUL

Sure but how many moose do you know who steal 142 bases?

You're right... Schilling was a much lower prospect.... Drafted in the second round... and took longer to reach the big leagues (Another reason to have more patience with Kip, He was rushed to the majors)... Kip Wells First major league action in 1999 -- Posted 4.04 ERA-- in the AMERICAN LEAGUE going 4-1 -- stuck in the bigs in 2001 -- started Producing in 02 Curt Schilling did'nt reach the bigs until 1988 -- didn't stick in the bigs until 1992... So kip was drafted higher, made the bigs quicker, stuck earlier, and started producing solid numbers, in a shorter time frame than Curt schilling. Why is this not a fair comparison for developing pitchers? I'm sure if you were a Boston/Baltimore fan would have claimed Schilling was no good because he was only putting up number in the NL.

Josh Paul ---------------- He's a Minny type player and I doubt he stuck w/ the angels

Anyone up for a Chatroom --- Just me and scwibble right now.... http://www.soxtalk.com/chat.html

Here's a very comparable situation.... Curt Schilling broke into the bigs in the AL w/ the orioles... he had a 4.54 ERA in the AL, and and ERA over 7 his first two seasons.... We only saw kip in the AL for 2+ seasons w/ an ERA of around 5... Schilling went to the NL at age 24, Kip @ 25... we know what kind of numbers schilling has put up in the NL, and has now returned to the AL... Do you feel that Schilling will have a hard time converting back to the AL??? I suspect that Kip would have the same results... -------------------------------- To anyone else who actually reads my posts, there's a really interesting read in the last Issue of SI (w/ Wood on the Cover). It speaks of the perception that the NL is a fastball league, and debunks the myth completely. Lots of good articles in that edition, which is surprising for SI.

What a f***ing AB!?!?!?

2002 PNC park So here is the real data for 2002 -- It's a hitters park.... 2003 PNC park And 2003 -- pitcher's park- Though I'd call 99 neutral.

Boy do you have a thick skull -- I knew it was a requirement to work for the government an all -- But that's the third thing you've read wrong, or just plain ignored in this thread... Here it is... One last time... KIP's ERA when adding the .3 to compensate for pitching in the National League is Lower than Mark B's (our #1 pitcher) over that same span... Year Tm Lg W L G GS GF CG IP H R ER HR BB SO HBP ERA *lgERA *ERA+ +--------------+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+--+------+----+----+----+---+----+----+---+---+-----+-----+-----+----+ 2002 PIT NL 12 14 33 33 0 1 198.3 197 92 79 21 71 134 7 3.58 4.32 121 2003 PIT NL 10 9 31 31 0 1 197.3 171 77 72 24 76 147 7 3.28 4.24 129 And the definitions for lgERA and ERA+ TEXAS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And the Texas game was in 2002. I'm not basing my argument on one game vs. the D-rays--- There's 395 innings of work there displayed for you...I used the D-rays game as an example it really doesn't matter what league the players are in... Mussina is 0-2 with an ERA of 11 vs. the D-rays now... Does that mean he can't pitch in the AL? READ.

Here's a clothing line I'm offended by....http://www.tokenclothing.com/... I'll have you know, I have a 13" vertical..

Read much? --- two starts --- two quality outings -- two losses -- that's what you get when you're playing for the Pirates.

Kip took the loss in both games.... vs. Tex and TB I don't know where they were played...

I was way down there with you in the OFFICIAL soxtalk bracket --- Bracket Genie made his picks disappear.

Yes it is the Yank home opener, and I'm sure they'll be none to happy travelling halfway around the world for only a split at best -- Hopefully they'll still be jet lagged. As for garland starting, I think I read on here that It may be Shoeny -- Don't know the reason for that -- I just know I saw that somewhere.

Here's kip's number's: Year Tm Lg W L G GS GF CG IP H R ER HR BB SO HBP ERA *lgERA *ERA+ +--------------+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+--+------+----+----+----+---+----+----+---+---+-----+-----+-----+----+ 2002 PIT NL 12 14 33 33 0 1 198.3 197 92 79 21 71 134 7 3.58 4.32 121 2003 PIT NL 10 9 31 31 0 1 197.3 171 77 72 24 76 147 7 3.28 4.24 129 And the definitions for lgERA and ERA+

Andy Katz's rankings He has Wiscy @#4 -- even I can't believe that, and I think they have a great team -- I don't think devin harris will be back -- I read somewhere during the season that made it seam like he would probably leave early.

I'm probably gonig to get roasted for this, but I love pretty much anything Cameron Crowe touches... Almost all of his movies use music as part of the story... Vanilla Sky -- Jeff Buckley, and REM's Sweetness Follows Almost Famous -- Decent original material, and Everyone remembers the Tiny Dancer scene Jerry Maguire -- Secret Garden-- The boss Say Anything -- Peter Gabriel -- Your eyes -- Plus The Clash was featured prominently throughout the movie on Lloyd's T shirts. Singles -- Trying a little too hard, but I know people who still play that soundtrack Fast times -- Ok the music wasn't great -- It was the 80's

Not even close -- Kazou Matsui has an OPS of 3.667 -- He's gotta be the best.

I'll compare the two since you're looking for a fight and I have the numbers to back it up.... You forget that there are interleague games... Kips ERA in interleague games is even more impressive than the rest of his starts... 15IP 14H 5R 5ER 5BB 10K --- That works out to an ERA of 3.00 a [email protected] and BAA about .250 -------------------------- You'll no doubt argue that pitchers in the national league have a lower ERA, while this is true, It's significantly less than what you think it is... American League Year R/G RA G ERA IP H H/G BB BB/G HR HR/G SO SO/G CG SHO SV pAge +----+-----+-----+----+-----+-----+-----+-----+-----+----+----+----+-----+----+----+---+---+---- 2003 4.86 11061 2270 4.53 20224 20905 9.2 7111 3.1 2500 1.10 13735 6.05 110 109 538 28.7 2002 4.81 10862 2264 4.46 20164 20592 9.1 7290 3.2 2457 1.09 14020 6.19 115 122 558 28.7 National League Year R/G RA G ERA IP H H/G BB BB/G HR HR/G SO SO/G CG SHO SV pAge +----+-----+-----+----+-----+-----+-----+-----+-----+----+----+----+-----+----+----+---+---+---- 2003 4.61 11917 2590 4.28 23110 23152 8.9 8778 3.4 2707 1.05 17066 6.59 99 150 661 28.8 2002 4.45 11546 2588 4.10 23105 22680 8.8 8956 3.5 2602 1.01 17374 6.71 99 153 666 28.8 The average difference between the two leagues is over the two years is 0.3 ER... Applying that to the kippers numbers over the past two years .... Kips ERA over 2002&3 = 3.43 Kips Estimated AL ERA over the same time frame = 3.73 To give that 3.73 number some meaning I'll compare it to Mark Beuhrle's over the same time frame....MB 2002&3 ERA = 4.05

Relax, YAS If he had truly moved on like he said he has, he wouldn't have posted 4 responses in a row in the thread.

he didn't only for a couple weeks he was unknown to most posters here.