The Beast

This thread is the perfect autopsy of how a political discussion could work on Soxtalk. Aside from the trolls that have appeared at times, this thread didn’t really get derailed and has helped me understand others perspectives in a more civilized manner than anywhere else. This is the kind of discussion I want to have on social media but can’t because it is all about mudslinging and gaslighting. My thought on keeping a thread like this would be one thread for politics, where it can be locked to cool off temperatures and have swift and decisive action for people who get out of hand. In terms of getting back to the discussion, I am really going to be curious how Biden can work with McConnell to get the stimulus package done and pass other pieces of legislation, like a health care public option, immigration reform, criminal justice reform or at the very minimum, an infrastructure bill. And, will moderate republicans like Romney, Murkowski and Collins vote with Democrats on any of these initiatives should they be called for a vote?

So he’s the Mike Madigan of Congress? I guess Biden better hope for a Georgia sweep in January even though it is unlikely.

What? So they can’t convince Murkowski or Collins to vote to narrowly pass legislation, or McConnell just controls all?

I just hope that if McConnell is still the senate majority leader that they can still pass bipartisan legislation or hold moderate Republican senators’ feet to the fire and not see them side with McConnell. I get more pissed off when I see McConnell blocking legislation that is more moderate and less progressive.

When I have posted to Facebook or engaged with Trump supporters, I bring facts to the table, facts that are sourced from different points of view (NY Times to CNN, to the Chicago Tribune, to the Bulwark, to Hugh Hewitt’s the rundown and Meet the Press). I blamed the 2016 loss on not paying attention to solutions for voters in the Rust Belt states and an unlikable Democratic candidate. I researched Russian interference, but I don’t think of it as the reason for Clinton losing. I do wish people wouldn’t make anyone out to be a leftist that is against Trump because I’m certainly not a progressive even though I am left of center. Labels are pointless.

How have communities and businesses reacted? Whose role is it to retrain that 1970s workforce?

When Trump won in 2016, I thought the best way was to retrain workers. Make coal miners change to a trade on alternative energy production, retrain workers in office jobs to work in health care or maybe train truck drivers to code. But then I did some research on retraining programs and questioned how much impact they had and wondered who would be in the best position to pay for retraining. An incentivized tax credit program could work as long as workers seek employment and work in that new industry. UBI would be interesting, although I don’t know how well it would be funded and last over the long term. I don’t know how much the private sector will contribute to upskilling or retraining employees and how short or long term automation will last when it comes to losing jobs.

What ideas do you have to help workers who are impacted by automation?

If he gets Arizona he would be at 264 and would need one of Nevada, Pennsylvania, Georgia, or North Carolina to win. This is based on the CNN math. “We are moving towards 270 votes, but we haven’t won yet.”

Aside from raising taxes or ignoring unfunded liabilities, I’m not sure how legislators improve the state’s finances. I think taxing retirement benefits would be a tough sell but possibly necessary with those collecting pensions leaving the state. Even if people won’t agree with that, there is definitely a spending problem and an issue with revenues in the state. I’d like to see a pension reform measure put on the ballot to have people vote on it with the messaging being that it is to keep pensions and retirement benefits for current employees but reducing pensions for future retirees so that the system works better. Otherwise I fully anticipate getting a property tax increase because of not meeting these liabilities. I often said privately to some moderators my displeasure of closing down the Filibuster because I felt that I learned more here than anywhere else with comments, thoughts and educated opinions with civil conversation. You don’t get that on Facebook and it is something lacking in our society. I have always felt that we should educate ourselves on opposing viewpoints and engage in conversation with people who we disagree with. Soxtalk is the perfect place to do so since personal attacks are minimal and there aren’t snarky memes and mud slinging as there are on Facebook. Thanks to @Chisoxfn and the admins and moderators for allowing conversation for the election. I appreciate it! Can I ask what would you make you excited about them governing or what you aren’t excited about? What messaging could Democrats use to be more appealing, in your opinion? How do you think the Democratic Party could do better with messaging and policies to appeal to Latino voters? I hope so but understand if this is just not possible. If anyone wants to have conversations about politics in a PM thread when this ends, let me know. Like I said, I learn a lot from each of you and think we need more civil discussion to grow as a country. What policies from the liberal wing of the Democratic Party would work for voters, particularly the groups that the party underperformed with in this election?

Looks like Lauren Underwood is in a tight race with Jim Oberweis to keep her seat in Congress, Sean Casten is in a fight with Jeanne Ives to do the same and the Illinois Fair Tax will fail based on the math we are seeing.

What do we know about what is going on on Michigan?

Do you have any suggestions for an alternative with a pandemic and people not being able to early vote in every state? I think it is smart to count separately, especially if Trump takes it to the Supreme Court and they need an accurate count of mail in ballots.

Are they considered received and on time? Could they get thrown out? That’s my concern.

I could be completely wrong and speculative, but the margins and turnout appear to be getting more competitive in states like Texas and Georgia. Add in a possible Trump win and they could be in the wilderness in 2024.

I agree. The votes are moving too slowly to make any definitive statements on the race. It’s too bad Biden isn’t winning convincingly but our country is just so divided. Long term tonight might not be the best for the GOP.

What solution do you propose for workers and current employees whose jobs will be automated away or whose industry is going away because there are more competitive forms of energy (coal miners, for example)? That is one thing I would love to ask blue collar workers since they tend to believe Trump’s statements on bringing these jobs back. UBI might not be the answer but at least Andrew Yang is one of the few political figures I have heard who addressed these problems.

Gary Johnson and Jill Stein both were a factor, along with low turnout and an unpopular candidate in Hillary Clinton.

What policies are the third party candidates proposing that the two major parties aren’t?

I would like to know why people vote for mostly fringe third party candidates that aren’t viable. The closest was Perot (and then Nader?). People I know who complain about a two party system offer no reforms or alternatives to make a third party vote viable.

And yet, none of the blue collar supporters I have read about that support Trump question that it might be automation that took or will be taking their jobs instead of trade or immigration. Trump and Biden wouldn’t know about solutions but at least Yang addressed it in the primary. I hope he addresses it if Biden wins since that will be something that needs to be addressed for lots of Americans.

Cut Wims and elevate Ridley. Give the former fourth round pick a shot instead of running a former seventh round pick out there. They have seen enough of what Wims can do, change up personnel and put Ridley in.

How do you address what happened on the Texas and New Jersey highways?

One of my favorite sites, https://thebulwark.com, had articles declaring Trump as being toast and then other perspectives came on saying otherwise. Where do you think the polls could be wrong and where do you worry that people won’t vote? I’m not saying you’re wrong, just curious.

I guess I would also add that I don’t want to see a majority progressive Democratic Party like I don’t want to see a mostly Trumpian Republican Party. The current Democratic congress is mostly left of center but there are more progressives being elected. It would seem that a party with balance would be better at advancing initiatives we have discussed. I still don’t understand why they didn’t pass that Gang of Eight bill, unless Boehner just didn’t want to give Obama a win.