LDF

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Aug 1, 2015 -> 11:59 PM) Honestly, there's no way for us fans to know if it was decided that Samardzija would or would not be traded. Same goes for the packages that might have been offered. Without knowing, all we as fans can do is speculate or just move on from in hopes the Sox made the right call. QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Aug 2, 2015 -> 12:57 AM) Semi-logical is not to even waste time arguing about things we'll probably never know it won't know until KW or Hahn write "tell all, this is what really happened" books 10-15 years from now. Semi-logical is to be somewhat skeptical of what this front office's plan is until there's clear evidence of the plan working. well you are both correct and in many times i do say that no one know what is said or being agreed to, unless someone from the group spills the beans. for me, as i have said, the things being said and what the sox have said, doesn't add up. all i did was posted my thoughts and explanation as to why i am saying those things. i just don't like being lied to, or being talk down to, like i can piece things together unless someone does it for me. this is my opinion on this. i am not naive. ultimately i believe this was a bad situation that took the final decision to the deadline. beside my opinion, i wonder what the rest of the league is thinking, so this is my reasoning.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 1, 2015 -> 07:33 PM) He doesn't have #1 stuff, but he's got legit big league rotation stuff. Low to mid 90s fastball, multilple breaking pitches, decent enough control of it all so far, big frame where you look at him and think his body can handle just about anything you throw at it. He's not Chris Sale, but with time you could convince me he's a mid to even upper rotation guy. in addition, when the system is bare and praying for a miracle. a player show up who can possible make the big team.... fans do get excited.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Aug 2, 2015 -> 12:12 AM) The move from AA to AAA has nothing to do with free agency. and maybe i should have said, if or when a player moves up to the majors, his clock starts.

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Aug 1, 2015 -> 11:21 PM) Well, we needed a power hitting right fielder... you know, you got me thinking. thompson was promoted to the majors, leaving a void in the team he is leaving. could it be a simple replacement for thompson??

QUOTE (Joshua Strong @ Aug 1, 2015 -> 11:01 PM) Exactly and the money attached to that comp pick is going to give Rick and co. some flexibility in the draft. the key words is 2 phrases that the sox have stated. 1. rebuilding 2. 3-yr plan. so it is so simple. the rebuilding plan is to fix and field a team that has been improved. so drafting and improving via draft is a good thing, but the problem i am having is a simple attempt to confuse and vindicate themselves... ok, so nothing is done, why the need to tell the masses? so what, unless it is to convince their fan based all is well. furthermore, there are some inconsistency in what is being said, other teams statements and the sox statement.

QUOTE (AustinIllini @ Aug 1, 2015 -> 10:08 PM) I can't wait until this front office is cleared out. and where did that come from???

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Aug 1, 2015 -> 09:02 PM) I was purely sarcastic. ok, but i am being serious. that was a post to no one but a real question. no offense.

really??? i am confuse at this move. why are people happy he is back??? i don't know, can he maybe used for next yr Adam L replacement??

QUOTE (thxfrthmmrs @ Aug 1, 2015 -> 06:53 PM) And he'd have a lot more opportunities and margin of error to work on that pitch in Triple A if given a proper game plan. Personally, I think it's silly to let a pitcher learn a new pitch on the fly in the big leagues, especially if he's only a 2-pitch pitcher so far, it would do damage to his confidence if he struggles, and I think the team will wants to go after the WC spot. whether the sox goes for the WC is not for this discussion. having Rodon up in the majors, well the sox didn't or thought they didn't have a choice. so he is here. is he ready, again he is up and he is getting first hand knowledge and training from coop. if he skips an occasional start to continue to continue in his develop plan. ok, does he need to go down to more development time, why? he is getting the best now, in real time and putting it to real competition, which is the best way to judge and gage his development. now one can say that it might harm his ego or mind set. if the sox thought that, then they would have sent him down. one can say that they need the sport for a skilled pitcher in a WC chase, well the sox didn't get one via trade and sorry, no one is ready to take over. so, i think he is at the best place to get the best kind of training.

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Aug 1, 2015 -> 05:48 PM) Putting a pitch restriction on someone isn't remotely close to shelving a pitcher for the final two months of the season because there is some outlandish chance that the pitcher hurts himself. That is ridiculous if you say so.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 1, 2015 -> 05:40 PM) You mean EJ? Much different problem last year. His fastball mysteriously lost 3-4 mph. nice one. i totally forgot about that. good call.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Aug 1, 2015 -> 05:32 PM) AAA may only mask it, potentially, because you're going to have weaker hitters swinging at more of his crap out of the zone. The question is can you afford to take the lumps at the mlb level right now if you're fighting for a wildcard. Edit: I see Balta beat me to the punch. here is the most important question. do the sox FO still think the sox can make the WC. most of the recent conversation, at least for me, was in the thinking that the sox plays it out. with EJ being called up. what will happen, will happen. i think the non movement on the trade front, was an acknowledgment that the sox gave up the wc chase.

You and I were among the first to question Samardzija's value in his trade thread. His bad start and rental status does not scream huge return, thats for sure. Also remember neither of us wanted to make the trade in the first place when it was first mentioned last November. >>> i understand, but if the sox were in the trade him process, this idea of what is being offered would have been anticipated and been adequately work on. there was a window of decision making that needed to adhere to, and it was done in this period that everything fell apart and the no trade decision was made. I don't buy into the three year window bulls*** as its just another play on words term used by the FO for the fans. But that's just my opinion. >>> i agree. I think that in the end, the offers for Samardzija were much less than what most fans anticipated. Next year's draft is supposed to have more talent so maybe the Sox figured the comp pick has more value than the offers they received. Just a guess. >>> again, the question, for me at least is when was the decision to trade him

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 1, 2015 -> 03:21 PM) Personally, it's just nice to have everyone come around and suddenly agree with me when last offseason I said that expecting Samardzija's value to rise by the trade deadline was silly. Now everyone's switched to the excuse of weak offers, which is what everyone should have expected for a 2 month rental. not everyone.... i am still on the same page i have been since spring training. much to the exasperation feelings of the other posters.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Aug 1, 2015 -> 03:05 PM) Without knowing what the offers for Samardzija were, its tough for me to criticize the FO. Maybe the bids were under, who knows. I'm fine with the comp pick in next year's draft and trust the SOX to grab a nice prospect. Fwiw, Spencer Adams was drafted #44 and Kolek #2. Adams has better numbers so far and they square off today for the third time this season in A- . Just goes to show there will be talent available when the Sox comp pick comes up, they just need to grab the right player. I'm very happy the Sox did not trade top minor league talent for a rental. The SOX have remained committed to building the farm and I have to give them credit for that. excellent point. but the window is 3 yrs. adams will not be ready in the following 2 yrs. since yr 1 is 2015 season. draft is a complete unknown. some players do pan out as hope, some don't. then there is the unknown.... trout, stanton of the mlb world. i too am happy they did not go for the rentals as well.

QUOTE (scs787 @ Aug 1, 2015 -> 03:06 PM) I'm not trying to win an argument here. Yes, I think the Sox will get a better player with their comp pick than what they would have got in a trade. I believe Hahn when he said they were aggressive in trying to make moves, and agree that if the returns weren't up to par then you don't trade just to trade. ok if you say so. again no ones the whole truth to the whole thing. was hahn speaking for the org and was he telling the whole truth. if so, then some one is not telling the truth when it was mention that the sox were undecided in which way they wanted to go. bottom line the not doing anything hurt. if the rtn was not up to par...... when in this whole hectic week was he talking about.... to arbitrarily say that, can be used to throw off many people. another point, using poker here, if they were expecting 4-aces.... and only got 3 and a king, you throw in your hand??? no one is going to tell me that these many teams who were buying was not offering something enticing, that is, if the sox was still hesitant in pulling the trade button.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Aug 1, 2015 -> 03:04 PM) Rodons problem is he has to throw strikes consistently. Does that get solved in AAA as opposed to the Majors? I don't see the difference. then why move a player from AA to AAA. the answer is reps and the clock for fa's.

QUOTE (kitekrazy @ Aug 1, 2015 -> 02:57 PM) This is the most ridiculous thing in professional sports. Athletes are there to compete. Some are at a level where inactivity produces regression. You can't treat these guys like glass. You can't plan around injury. Remember Sale couldn't start the season it wasn't baseball related. then why put a pitch restriction on anyone. why spread out a pitcher starts, why when a game is out of reach, they bring in a player to substitute... the answer is easy.... the fear of the unknown > injury.

QUOTE (scs787 @ Aug 1, 2015 -> 02:53 PM) Then why argue the point? All I know is I will gladly take the comp pick if the return was anywhere near the Kazmir/Leake return. And we just don't know if they found a guy in trade talks that fit that 3 year window. If that guy wasn't there to be had, I would take the comp pick. I remember many a posters using this logic even before the 7 game win streak. the main point is, and again that that into account and trying not finding the little argument to try to win this discussion..... better yet, i make it easier for you, you won. but take into account that 3 yr window you mention, guess what.... tic toc.. tic toc... tic toc. the sox is on the clock. so do you really think the sox would not be better than that comp pick?? do you really think that the sox had the decision not to sell before yesterday??? ref to bold.... bingo.

You're playing what if too though. We don't know whether or not they were in discussions for a near MLB ready bat. >>> ok i will buy that, but the point is no one can say for a certain what the sox would have asked. Just for reference sake, the last 2 players the Sox took in the 2nd round are Tyler Danish and Spencer Adams. Sox will get a pick higher than where those guys were taken. and we are still waiting for their development to be finished. the sox has, according to the fo a window of 3 yrs.

now with some major teams acquiring multi players, the surplus of extra players may become available via waivers. i think some players may help this team. i think some players maybe a better option than boni, some may have some value better than davidson etc.... this is a different definition of dumpster diving i used last yr.

QUOTE (scs787 @ Aug 1, 2015 -> 03:13 PM) I can't see how not trading HURT the "Rebuilding". It didn't help it right now, but it certainly didn't hurt it. Shark was really the only piece that had any sort of value. I imagine a Kazmir like return. A lot of people are high on that return, but was it really better than a potential 25-30 pick? The A's have a worse farm system than the Sox, and Nottingham ranks 8th in that system. I wouldn't be surprised if whoever the Sox take with their comp pick ranks in the top 10 right out the gate. b/c the player, or players the sox could have gotten will be major league ready player or in another option, that rtn would have had ready to move in quicker. now the sox will get a prospect who may be quite some yrs away from helping the parent club. now if he is used as a trade bait, they are still looking at a minimum of 2 yrs. now if the sox had other players in the trade, same as above. ref bolded, who is to say what the sox does with that pick. no one knows who or what will happen tomorrow. can't bet on the what if path.

QUOTE (SCCWS @ Aug 1, 2015 -> 02:34 PM) I wouldn't shelve Sale, I would just try and get him some extra days of rest. Rodon also may need some extra rest as this is his first full season. Bit is also gives an extended view of EJ not a few starts against some teams who may also be out of the race and playing their AAA players in sept. you are prob right. but i would shelve him, i just wouldn't trust faith and take a chance on sale getting hurt. i just see this season as a wasted season.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Aug 1, 2015 -> 02:26 PM) You make it sound like they turned down an entire team's elite propsects for Samrdzija. What was out there? I would think his return would have been similar to Leake's. Is that really a franchise changer vs. the comp pick? i don't know if i agree. the whole thing is / was a decision had to be made. i have a gut feeling that there was a debating going on. at the same time other teams were making moves. i am looking at the price and leake. closer to the price minus. just my opinion.

QUOTE (SCCWS @ Aug 1, 2015 -> 01:44 PM) I am not sure if Rodon is better working at ML level or minors. But I agree Johnson needs to get some experience pitching in August games which most likely will have more significance than September after call-ups. I heard Boston was condsidering going to a 6 man rotation in order to see more of their young pitchers. That might be a way to get Rodon and Sale some extra rest and still get a better evaluation on EJ. I think Danks is still their # 5 next year so I am not convinced they want to move him. i like it. i would shelf sale for the season, if beck was in any condition. time to see how the pitchers performed in aug. some can say, it is a trail run for the majors pitching or another spring training session or something wittier than that.