Chisoxfn

On an unrelated note, I'd prefer to keep Taj (vs. dump him) but I presume they won't be able to move our PG from the Knicks (without including picks), which means it will be MDJ and Taj that get moved. Please, whatever happens, I don't want to see us giving up a 1st round pick (I really hope we can stay away from that) to free up this space. In fact, I hope we are getting something of value (especially for Taj). I don't think we should have any issues moving Taj / MJD, however, in this scenario, the Bulls have a lot less leverage making a deal (given we are forced to have to move them and would need to move them immediately).

By the way, I never think of Woj and him knowing our front office (they generally don't like him). He might get info but I don't think it is coming from the Bulls (it used to come through Thibs...now I don't know where he'd get any data from, at least internally). So as a result, I do put that skepticism on his reports (as it means they are likely from agents / other teams / Wade's reps).

If we sign Wade, than I think the possibility of actually landing a bigger fish a year from now increases. I also think Wade helps ensure that Rondo doesn't totally ruin team chemistry.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 6, 2016 -> 02:43 PM) http://www.blogabull.com/2016/7/6/12105724...hy-not#comments http://www.barstoolsports.com/chicago/upda...ht-got-delayed/ twitter.com You know, places that one could easily find if they followed the bulls. Yes, you have confirmed my point. Whiny fans who have no idea how things operate in the real world.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 6, 2016 -> 02:32 PM) That would be amazing except none of those things happened today, you guys have great hypotheticals. So what exactly happened today?

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 6, 2016 -> 02:26 PM) Great made-up hypothetical! I have another one. What if the Bulls were a well run organization that met with targeted free agents and weren't a PR disaster. These are fun! Dude...what made up hypothetical. What I told you is real and legitimate. You live in a world that planes never get delayed and people never end up being late. Is your only point in this that the Bulls should have lied and just said they had to reschedule vs. anything else? Either way, they aren't directly commenting on this so it would be hard for them to "control" that message. You are to the point where you want to find everything and anything to blame the Bulls for. Its fine, but I'm just telling you there is no rational point behind how far gone you've went.

QUOTE (JenksIsMyHero @ Jul 6, 2016 -> 02:14 PM) You need a hug or something man, Jesus. How do we know that Wade didn't tell the Bulls he had 2 hours to meet in New York before he had to get ready for his show tomorrow AM and the Bulls couldn't make a flight/couldn't make it work so they said nah, we'll see you Thursday if you're serious? Isn't that a plausible scenario that is pretty darn reasonable? Yes, to anyone with logic it is. s*** happens...even to exec's. They could be flying the greatest plane in the world and still be grounded from flying. I'm sure the president misses things due to weather, other events, too. Sometimes stuff happens. And I'm relatively certain Wade had a select window, so unless it could happen during that time, it wasn't happening today. No harm in what the Bulls did, unless you really think they just didn't plan anything, walked to the aiport and were in shock that you can't buy tickets right there or that you don't have availability (I mean, really....really, you seriously believe that). But I'm going to guess Bmags has never been on a flight that has been delayed or better yet, been to an airport which literally had an outage and no flights were going out (chartered & commercial). I don't even know what the circumstances were, but stuff happens.

QUOTE (Harry Chappas @ Jul 6, 2016 -> 01:51 PM) If they were serious you would think they would have gotten in the night before. I think in many cases, these meetings move quite a bit and who knows when Wade decided to tell the Bulls or ask the Bulls to meet? Hard to know since meetings get moved all the time by reporters reports, but who knows in reality what is actually happen. I do agree with you, that in general, you'd go the day before, but you could have had other business to attend, etc. In free agency a lot of stuff is volatile so things aren't going to be perfectly planned.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 6, 2016 -> 01:21 PM) No, I only blame them for their actions. You have possibly 1, maybe 2 meetings like this a year. Everyone is laughing at them for this. They are either lying and adding to their horrendous reputation with agents or telling the truth and look like imbeciles. This is a competitive free agent market and making your meetings is important. Saying your flight was delayed is hysterical. Don't get me wrong, I'm very pleased they were incompetent here, they are better for it. But this probably bumps showing up at the ohare terminal with benny the bull as most LOLworthy moments in Bulls history. J Dumbass fans are laughing, most of whom know nothing about how things work in the real world. Legitimate things can and will happen. Airtravel isn't a teleport and you just get from point A to point B. Things come up and issues happen.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 6, 2016 -> 11:59 AM) Yes, I'm sure they do fly to many things commercial. But when you have access to a private charter because you are part of a league that just handed out billions of dollars and have an important meeting where the likes of Pat Riley who shows up in helicopters on the beach and you have to call the recruit and be like "SORRY SOUTHWEST PUSHED BACK WE ARE TRYING TO GET A FREE VOUCHER WE MAY HAVE TO FLY TO TULSA FIRST WE REALLY VALUE YOU WEVE BEEN MAKING A POWRPOINT WHAT I CAN"T HEAR YOU WHY ARE YOU LAUGHING" Miami isn't Chicago. Weather in one place can be different than weather in another. Even if you flew a charter, you can have equipment issues, etc. It is one thing to blame the Bulls, but you have gone to this really sad extreme where everything and anything is there fault. The sky is blue...f***ing front office. If Wade was seriously considering the Bulls, he'd wait, and if he wasn't, nothing is really lost. s*** happens.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 6, 2016 -> 11:48 AM) LOL are they flying commercial? I don't know if you are aware of this, but the vast majority of executives fly commercial (not sure why the Bulls wouldn't). I presume their team charter is handled by an airline as well (southwest or whomever). Now I'm sure, if things get delayed, they could try to set something else up (charter something), however, if it is weather issues, you could be screwed either way. If Wade waits around, we'll know he's potentially more serious (maybe this was more of the Bulls ploy and next we'll see a picture of Gar and Paxson riding a motorbike dumb and dumber style to New York!!!

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jul 6, 2016 -> 11:47 AM) Iirc he is wanted a cherry pick player, play 4 on defense and have a player hang around mid court for immediate run outs after a rebound Yep and he fired a coach to put in someone who would let him supposedly run his idea (which was the most laughable idea ever). Might have worked in pee-wee, but it didn't work now.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 6, 2016 -> 11:14 AM) I will not beat the dead horse that Rondo is bad because overwhelming evidence suggests that he is bad both on the court as a player and teammate. But, I can't let this stand. He was bad after the ACL in Boston, he was bad in Dallas and he was bad last year. He doesn't try on defense. He hits 50% from the free thrown. He is a bad shooter. He can't drive anymore. He's bad. Yes, he was bad as he was recovering from a very tough injury (ACL tear). Last year was the healthiest he had looked in a while and was improved and physically looked like a much better player, one who was more comfortable with his body. You act like his post ACL sample size was huge, but he has played in 170 games since he tore his ACL (essentially the equivalent of two full season's) and there were significant improvements in his game a year ago (despite the Kings being a awful situation). I don't think it is a surprise that in his first year back from a serious ACL injury (one where he came back pretty quick by all accounts as well), is an indication that he technically stinks. If he was years and years removed, okay, but he isn't. Also, if he is really bad, we aren't tied to him longer term and can kick him to the curb (and if he ruins the chemistry, we cut him or trade him elsewhere). If we signed Mozgov or Deng or gave Rondo a deal like those, I'd be furious. And really, the only deal I'd have preferred would have been the Deron deal (1yr 10M), but I don't think he was leaving Dallas. All the other examples you gave I much preferred Rondo.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 3, 2016 -> 07:46 AM) He is still 12-3 2.33 ERA. Yeah, I laugh my ass off on this, he isn't very good. I do anticipate he will have some form of drop-off. Dude pitched a ton last year (plus extended post-season run). Cubs should be smart and give him some rest.

I believe Wade's meetings with the Nuggets & Bucks are now over and he is suposed to meet with the Heat last (later today), so if he's meeting with the Bulls, you'd think we'd hear something relatively soon. That or we were never serious. KC Johnson now indicating we are in it with Wade until the end (doesn't mean we are aggressive on the pursuit, either).

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 6, 2016 -> 11:06 AM) Those 2 led the Kings to big things. Michael Jordan himself wouldn't solve the Kings. They are such a mess. I know some things about that org that I won't talk about (due to who the info comes from), but man, the stories about them are insane at how dysfunctional they are (ownership / front office / coaches).

Some reports that Fred was the primary pitch-guy in landing Rondo. Whether we like Rondo or not, Fred is a pretty personable guy (who as much as I bash, I hope he actually succeeds because of how good of a dude he is and how generally likeable he is). I am rooting for him to take steps forward and I think the fact that the Bulls are changing things up is a good thing (and I think Butler was humbled a bit this past year as was Hoiberg and that the two of them will work well together). Hopefully we have Rondo bought in cause a bought in Rondo is a pretty big improvement over the Derrick Rose of last year (not saying he will be better than Rose this year or anything of the like, just saying last year, DRose was a really bad player and a downright roster killer).

QUOTE (JenksIsMyHero @ Jul 6, 2016 -> 11:00 AM) Was that on the radio? His twitter doesn't mention anything about that. I read it elsewhere that Friedell said it (think they referenced the radio).

If you want to isolate what happens if we sign Wade, below is a pretty good summary of what it means for next year's cap (and who we would need to keep / who we would have to renounce): You add a Blake Griffin or Westbrook or Paul to that team and you are talking about a pretty darn good team. I'm not saying you are a champion, but you are a contender (depending on how some of the young players develop).

By the way, if the Bulls let Niko & Taj walk and opt out of Rondo's deal, they will have ~$68M in cap space available with the projected max contract for a Westbrook type player being $30.8M per season. Please note that the $68M does not include cap holds on new draft picks, etc, so lets presume they get the Sacremento pick and their pick (for conservative purposes) plus they have a couple roster holds, we still have essentially enough to offer two full max deals as soon as next year (presuming we don't go long-term on anyone). Even if you gave Wade $25M, that still give you enough for one max guy, plus another pretty good size contract (if you opt for that route). Oh and you have Jimmy Butler on a deal on par (on a per annum basis) with guys like Luol Deng, which puts them in a much better spot than a lot of other teams. Hypothetically, Bulls could sign Wade to his big deal and keep Rondo plus find a way to offer a max deal too (if they think Rondo was the attractive piece) and than a year later, they could let Rondo and Wade walk and give big money again to younger players, too. Whether they can actually exit on any of these strategies, who knows, but they aren't in near the dire position so many allude to. Unless of course Butler goes off the reservation and demands out because of Gar / Hoiberg / Pax (which is definitely possible).

Friedell is reporting Bulls have no meeting set with Wade and that front office is in Chicago (contradictory to Woj's report that the Bulls will be meeting with Wade in NY this afternoon). For all we know, the Bulls have literally zero interest in Wade (and were only interested in getting one of him or Rondo).

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 6, 2016 -> 10:23 AM) Just like in dallas Guy was there for like a month. He was in Boston for years. I realize he annoyed Pierce and KG from time to time and there were plenty of rumors of potential trades, but he stayed a long time there and was an extremely good player for them. Carlisle and Rondo didn't mesh and they never even had like an off-season to gel /adjust or anything. Sometimes bad fits happen and Carlisle is suppose to be a notoriously difficult guy to work with (excellent coach, but if you don't see eye to eye, you are in trouble).

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jul 6, 2016 -> 10:10 AM) None of those reasons make it right. He needed help and we all knew it, and he thumbed his nose at the process Even if he did, I don't know if it helped. Drose just isn't charismatic. Buckets is. I have full faith in a Buckets led recruiting process, but I have to imagine having Wade as a pitch-person would help and that is why the Bulls are looking at him (not to mention, given what people are getting, Wade @ 20M (if he's healthy) isn't the worst deal on the planet (he was actually pretty damn good last year).

QUOTE (JenksIsMyHero @ Jul 6, 2016 -> 10:01 AM) I'd like to think he'll be motivated to play really well this year to get another contract. If he has a poor year or has a run in with Hoiberg, is there another team that is going to give him a shot? And like it or not, but in the east, this team will contend, so there is more to play for than there ever was in Sacremento. I agree with you, he has a lot of reasons to be on his best behavior. Than again, you'd have said the same thing last year too.

By the way guys, I'm semi serious, I totally could see Chris Paul, Wade, Lebron and maybe even Melo teaming up at some point to try and be the "good" guys in a battle vs. the hated Warriors. And I actually think Chris Paul, while older, would be a good fit for the Bulls and Hoiberg (and he is the type of guy who should age well, given his tremendous vision). Either way, the big key is Butler going ham and taking another step forward this year (as well as him getting everyone to dig him at the olympics). I see Jimmy as a fantastic pitchman in FA a year from now, but you got to surround him with someone else. And when it comes to Rondo, I realize he has his issues in the lockeroom, but Boogie dug him and Sac fans thought pretty favorably of him. While I don't like a guy padding his stats, I can see why, given they were a loser team with no hope at the playoffs, etc (coaching issues). Yes, the Bulls have issues, but if Hoiberg can't handle it, he can be gone at the end of the year as far as I'm concerned. Rondo is now on a team that should absolutely contend for the playoffs, so that creates less incentive for the "selfish" play, imo. And no, they have zero shot at a title so lets get rid of that delusion. But you don't have to suck to become a champion, in fact, it can be pretty hard when you suck for a while to ever get good. Look at the hot mess that the Lakers are in or how long the Knicks have sucked or the Sixers (who can't even get vets interested in checking them out). I actually think the key is you need to contend and be able to pivot and the Bulls have actually home-grown two stars, one Rose, who is now fading (but could excel again in a new spot) and the other Buckets who is still rising (and who knows, maybe he can emerge as a super star). He was actually third on the freaking team in usage a year ago (which is hard to believe), behind Rose & Pau. I am curious to see how he does with all the extra touches. I presume his efficiency will go down, but I don't know how much (given how proficient he is at getting to the line). I realize Gar is a hard guy to like, but dude, there are a lot worse ran franchises than the Bulls. What went down a year ago with Thibbs, clearly was awful, but I'm not going to sulk and cry and act like we are the worst franchise on the planet, cause we aren't, and Paxson has a pretty strong track-record running this franchise (one that very few GM's in the league can top). He has his faults, sure, but he also brought the Bulls back to contention and a run as one of the better franchises in the game (unfortunately not everyone can win titles and Lebron and now the Warriors are top dogs). But I don't judge front office success purely by championships (and I suppose that is where I differ with some who have these ridiculous extremes of, just suck for forever until we get lucky on a star or win a title, but don't ever be anywhere other than that and it is so unrealistic it is crazy).