BamaDoc

I started this thread and if you look, Gardner was a complementary signing to Grandal. If you get a primary bat addition, Grandal in my case, Gardner would hit lower in my lineup to balance handedness and our poor OBP. I agree if RF is your only big bat signing you want more but I don't see it out there this year. If he were younger, he probably wouldn't be on a Yankee roster bubble and may not be. Hell he is batting three for them in the playoffs. His four WAR this year would be third on our team, ahead of everyone but Giolitto and Moncada. The game is not only played with a bat but you also do many other things, which he does better than most options. Since 2015, his WARs are 3.9, 3.2, 3.4, 4.9, 2.8, 4.0 OBP of .327, .343, .351, .350, .322 .325 Father time will get all but with this track record is a WAR of 2.5 unreasonable to expect? For comparison Mazzara has NO seasons with over 1WAR. Nimmo ONE season over 1 WAR. Dickerson 1 season over 2.5 WAR since 2015. Mazzara and Nimmo you have to trade for so you are giving up prospects/players who unless they are scrap I don't wish to do. We need a lot to go right to just contend and I felt Gardner was one of the safest bets out there. It may not mater as the Yankees probably realize his value even as a fourth outfielder for them.

As far as wanting a lot of money and max years, sure. I think his health concerns are much less than Ryu. I think Keuchel is way overvaluing himself. I think the years/value of Strasburg will dwarf the other two. Because they/agent is thinking high values, I was trying to point out they will not be quick signs in my opinion.

Ryu is a Boras client. Boras spinning his bad injury history as a low mileage arm and wants long years at high dollar. Won't be a quick sign. Keuchel also a Boras guy still talks like he thinks he deserves a huge deal. Boras previously inferred he had multi year deals that Boras was okay with but his client said no. Again probably a later signing.

The other point of getting Gardner that I tried to point out is it gives you two options. First it gives time for your non Robert outfield prospects to develop potentially giving you a cheap homegrown replacement. Secondly, Gardner does not keep you from signing someone like Pederson the following year. In that scenario all you have done is spent money and not lost any prospects.

Colinski, thanks for taking the time to present a plan and not bad. I am figuring you are around 125 new money if Abreu comes back so I am doubtful on getting it all done and appreciate the plan B part as well. I agree someone from our relievers steps up and I am not crazy about Colome at 10 million closing as I fear regression. Hopefully Hererra is what he was supposed to be and balances some of it out. As you watch the playoffs, you see little things matter like defense, getting guys over or in from third. Ray Ray awesome stuff. Ive gotta dig into it more. Thanks

It would have been but it does make the assumption that the Dodgers would have accepted it. They actually had a multitude of starting pitching.

He wants to stay but I am hoping he is odd man out. They have big money committed to Stanton, Hicks and Judge is not going anywhere. They wouldn't trade Frazier (young OF) at deadline and found some cheap productive players. They have been up at the tax levels and they seem to want to stay below or around the max. They have to add pitching which will be expensive thus I hope he simply is odd man out. Hell they hit him #3 last night so they do like him.

That is about 120 plus million annual out lay. I would like it a lot (still Gardner over Cast, yes I think his glove is a problem) but I know I am not getting everything I want. My plan was trying to be realistic.

Hate thread hijacked and I am continuing that but I wonder if part of trouble is he is being to fine and getting behind hitters because he doesn't trust stuff. Rather than aiming at corners, missing, then getting crushed could he start pitch over not the middle but six inches from a corner and trust his movement? Between the ears stuff is hard to fix. Maybe a lot of mental work, visualization stuff in offseason. As a competitive golfer in a past life, at higher levels the mental part is more and more important. Yogi was right, "90% of the game is half mental"!

I agree especially with a 26 man roster. Collins is not a absolute guarantee. Yermin could get a try as a bat. Grandal being a switch hitter would allow some mixing and matching. If no Grandal, I would be scared but could you go with Collins and Mercedes being primary DH's (Collins struggles vs LHP) and Collins as your #2 catcher, Yermin emergency catcher?

I could see Fulmer going in a change os scenery trade as you mentioned. That trade worked well for one team!

Part of my rational is they sign Grandal who would hit higher in lineup so Gardner would provide balance and possibly be more in the 6-8 range. You wouldn't require the bat to be as important and the glove (especially compared to other options) would be there even if he does drop slugging a bit. He walks at close to 9% indicative of making a pitcher work like Grandal. Gardner's numbers home and away are similar so it wasn't just hitting them into the short porch in right. He is a stop gap and would not span our window of opportunity but as he winds down I expect one of our prospects to be ready. Plugging a young cheap option in gives financial flexibility as others get to bigger dollar levels. Other free agents would require longer years and many have bad gloves or other risks. His shorter contract length could allow you to fire at a Betts or Springer if everything breaks right although with current FO/O I doubt that is possible. More about putting a solid 3 WAR guy in RF where we were negative WAR last year. In a realistic plan you can't get every top guy but you need solid players also.

Sorry back on page one when I started thread. It is Brett Gardner. Only thing against him is age but he hasn't shown signs of any slowdown. One year and option or two years probably gets it done. I think he would be a great mentor as well. Never heard a bad thing about him with NY writers around everyday. Allows time for our young minor league guys to develop or allows you to go after big FA RF down the road. When I started researching, I was very surprised by his numbers. Keep an open mind and take a look https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/g/gardnbr01.shtml

Why Ozuna? He is not a great glove. Had a real good year in 2017, 6.1 WAR. Last year 2.9, this year 2.1. He is going to require significant years and dollars and probably has a qualifying offer attached. He is a national leaguer, (who knows how he adjusts to AL?), hits right-handed. He will need to move from left to right field. The guy I want has WARs of 4.9, 2.8, 4.0. (Better WAR total and this year). Hits left-handed, played a lot of CF as well as corners. AL bat with no home park inflation of his numbers, no qualifying offer, and will be a lot cheaper.

signing a player because the scrubs want him is perhaps not the best way to build a team.

Willie Calhoun has a interesting bat but another player with a bad glove. Choo has a terrible glove. The short term answer while our prospects develop is Gardner.

Abreu

That is why I proposed cutting Yolmer to about 3.3 million but give him a couple years as a sweetener. I don't see Leury, Yolmer, and Engel all being back. I want better hitting so I left out Engel.

Odorizzi is a fly ball pitcher. Gives up less hr/fb than average. Only pitched one game at the Rate 6ip 5h 2 r 2w 8k, probably benefitted pitching to our lineup! Wood would depend on medicals. May be toast may be ok. When he last pitched he was hurt and ineffective. 11 HRs last 35 IP. I would rather 1-2 million base and incentives if you want to roll the dice but I wouldn't guarantee more.

I thought about Wood because he is left handed. When I saw back injury and shut down in August with a ERA over 6 in August, I lost interest. With our guys coming back from injury, I think you need guys you can count on. If he comes on a minors deal with invite ok but I think he is a total wild card thus doesn't fill any hole because I can't count on him.

Honest question? Wheeler 180 innings at 20 million per year, lose draft pick and pool money, last two years WAR total 7.4 vs Odorizzi and another starter (Nova Level) , 350 innings , 25 million cost, keep pick, last two years combined WAR 8.4

Okay respect your opinion. Mine just different and I wish to hold guys for another year and hope some develop into cheap home grown players. I guess I could see putting a couple together and getting one higher rated player to help with roster issues but doubt other teams are that excited to do that kind of deal. Sheets doesn't require 40 man and if he improves and goes to Charlotte he could but up much better numbers and really improve value. If any non Robert outfielder could progress to .750 OPS eventually at MLB level and all have decent gloves that is a 3 WAR player and not without value. I just don't know which one that might be yet and don't want to miss.

Yeah Moose isn't taking a paycut and becoming a part time player. I think he stays in Milwaukee and they add a year or two to his deal.

I don't know, I think Maddon is to old to play RF! LOL

Here would be a real possibility, McCann reverts to previous form. Collins gets early year experience maybe starting in Charlotte catching Kopech, Dunning, and Lambert. He comes up mid season and the bat gets him additional work at DH/1B. Grandal has a year learning/ developing rapport with staff. 2021, Collins could be #2 if you don't bring McCann back or use the three headed monster at multiple positions. Depends on if Collins glove/defense allows him to be a 2 vs 3. Collins splits in minors significant. .224/.327/.447 .774 ops vs lefties (which I would be fine with) but he crushed righties to .306/.433/.589 1.022ops ! In majors in obviously small size had a nearly .400 ops split difference.