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How did you feel about Tim Anderson before he broke out at age 26 ? I remember that Jack. A lot of the board disagreed with your stance on Anderson because he had the tools and he was our guy but his 1st 3 seasons weren't exactly stellar. And in fairness to you plenty of thsi board were super down on Giolito and Moncada after just 1 year in the league. It's super easy to say someone sucks and that's all they will ever be even when they are young. David Ortiz had over 1500 ABs for the Twins before they released him and he went on to become a legend starting with the Red Sox at age 27.

Because players are always who we think they are at the age of 25 . My God I actually used to think you were smart about baseball but to pursue this line of BS you are beyond hope. Tons of guys turn into more than the sum of their stats after age 25. Of course more stay exactly the same and some get worse. How do I know that ? because teams , yes actual major league teams take chances on guys like that and successful teams too like the Dodgers, Oakland , Rays and many more. Or teams just keep them rather than discarding them. Anyone can say someone sucks and be right most of the time. Most of this board said it when the Sox SIGNED McCann and he was older and worse than Mazara. Hell you could have said Tim Anderson sucks after his 1st 3 years until he broke out at age 26.

Ok whats your point ?I know it was a trade. Yes I put signed instead of traded, my temp. insanity. There's really no need to rehash that trade > i did it over and over at the time.

I'm always for low risk high reward types who have already, at a young age, had several promising seasons although cut short by injuries a lot. It's the reason I was fine with Mazara . I never considered him as the primary move because from the beginning of the 5 or 6 posts I made on the subject I knew he wouldn't be ready to actually passed a physical until he was recovered from his latest injury which won't be until February.' I love the guys stroke. He's not even close to a dead pull hitter . He just rolls with the pitch much like we saw McCann and Timmy learn to do and how we've seen Abreu do it from the start of his career. Plus he has no problem elevating the ball which was always the concern with Mazara.

Look smart guy. My arguments are well thought out. LeMahieu was one example I used. The articles I posted used other players in support of my arguments and the Coors effect that you probably didn't bother to read. As far as Mazara goes. Yes I liked the signing as a possible low risk high reward approach. The Sox apparently saw it my way and it didn't work out and it didn't cost much money. Big deal. As for Puig, no I didn't want to sign him and you did and apparently still do. Every single major league team agreed with me and not you. I also didn't want EE and the Sox disagreed with me and it cost them a twice as much as signing Mazara. I would make those choices about Mazara , EE and Puig every time in the same situation. I did present the type of contract I would sign Dahl to but only as a last resort and admitted in every post that his current injury and probable signing in February ruled him out as the main RF target. Stop twisting everything I say to feed your closed minded narrative.

He's a hot hothead and refuses to be educated. Nothing we can do.I took the time to do the research and present a reasonable argument that fangraphs backs up which he probably didn't even read judging by him posting the same thing he did before. I had already admitted numerous times Dahl might not be a good choice because of his numerous injuries and the current one he is recovering from.

Sorry Poppy it's my pet peeve .Could've should've is correct and when pronounced sounds like should of and could of, so is very very often written that way. Don't hate me. Learning contractions in 5th grade just stuck with me.

To continue how the Reverse Coor Effect works all you really have to look at is the BB% and K % The theory goes that pitches move less at Coors Field. This makes it a lot easier to see where the pitches are going to end up. You end up judging balls better meaning you walk more and K less. You also hit the ball a lot better. LeMahieu's walks went way down on the road as and his K's went way up. See it better hit it better. Pretty simple. It's really a more significant factor than the altitude. Now when these same players go on the road all of a sudden the ball is moving all over the place so the adjustment to Road baseball is a lot harder than going from all other Home fields to all other away fields.

Thanks for that. I think the whole Coors Effect is overblown. I did answer him using several articles from fangraphs and Hardball Times about how players do after leaving Coors and the hangover Effect. LeMahieu got better after he left Coors . I can see how he answered you that he thinks Dahl's Rockie road stats would follow him to GRF because GRF is "away" from Coors and created a number only slightly higher to fit his narrative. I don't expect the Sox to sign him because they will make a decision on RF long before Dahl can pass a physical and sign. But I truly believe that someone will get quite the steal on him if he can stay on the field . However staying healthy is a HUGE factor even more so than trying to convince someone that the guy can rake and play his position well and for that reason alone he isn't much of an option.

I expect a lot of concern over his injuries. I can understand that. But I looked at DJ Lemahieu's numbers from 2016, his best year with the Rockies at age 27, before he went to the Yankees. Before and after 2016 his highest OPS was .786 with the Rockies. Going to Yankee Stadium didn't hurt him at all. In fact he's had the best 2 seasons of his career. It's pretty simplistic to say we'd get more of his away stats because we are away from Coors. I think you know enough about baseball to know that Home stats are often much better than Road stats for many many players. You can see below how vastly different Lemahieu's stats were in his best season pre Yankees. I also looked at Dahl's defense on Baseball Savant which uses Statcasts Outs Above Average. 2019 he played more games than he ever had so I view it as the best year to look at his defensive stats. He played all OF positions but had the most attempts in CF. He was a 2 in Runs Prevented and a 2 in Outs Above Average which is a positive. If you're going to use the Coors Effect be aware there is also a Reverse Coors affect: Mike Petriello at MLB.com, for example, looked at several players with substantial careers both in Colorado and elsewhere, and found the ex-Rockies’ performance on the road rebounding once Coors wasn’t their home field. https://tht.fangraphs.com/the-other-coors-effect/ There is also this older article at Fangraphs that talks about when position players get away from Coors in which ,again, you shouldn't be expecting terrible thins once a player leaves Coors. https://blogs.fangraphs.com/when-position-players-get-away-from-coors-field/ Anyway these are Lemaheiu's Home/Road stats in his best season at Coors. Season Home / Away BB% K% BB/K AVG OBP SLG OPS ISO BABIP wRC wRAA wOBA wRC+ 2016 Home 13.7% 9.9% 1.39 .391 .473 .591 1.064 .199 .420 76 36.4 .450 154 2016 Away 6.7% 15.7% 0.43 .303 .353 .395 .747 .092 .351 37 1.9 .326 101

I think I can agree with this list mostly. I'm higher on Dahl as a player over Pederson but the injuries are a big concern . I doubt anyone signs him til he is fully recovered from his surgery and that might not be till February . Plus the surgery was on his right shoulder which is his throwing arm even though he bats LH ,so not ideal for RF. This place will be a mess if we wait that long for a RF .

I don't think so. Dahls OPS was .867 for his career until the injury year in 2020 and he can hit lefties. When he's playing healthy he could be one of our best hitters with both batting average and power.

They are worse than his home stats but that's not unusual for many hitters. I'd call them pretty fair away from Coors . The guy can flat out hit when healthy, goes the other way very nicely. Oppo power too.

Right so he might last on the market til some time in February. But I'd be showing his agent that we are interested for sure before then .

Dodgers took a chance on a 31yr. old AJ Pollock and he's done well for them . Pollock is the better fielder but Dahl's OPS when he played before last year was .867 (2016-2019) which is better than Pollock and also very good.

I'd be all over Dahl. He can play all 3 OF positions, if not well, then competently. Hits for power and average,hits the ball everywhere , LH, splits are fine against LH's. Home/Away splits not that lopsided. He's injury prone sure, but when he is healthy he is an All Star type, plus he won't be 27 till April. His surgery was in late September and he should be ready to go for spring training. It required repairing fraying in the labrum, fixing a small area of the rotator cuff, and removing a bone spur and bursa sac , which were causing the impingement that created the pain. I don't know how teams will approach him since he might not be able to pass a physical until February. I'd either offer him a 3 or 4 year contract with an escalating base AAV with teams options after 2 years and also throw in incentive clauses for performance . No just games played clauses because then players ignore their injuries. He was due $2.5-$2.7M in arb. this year . So perhaps a 2 year contact for $6-7M but incentives giving him a chance to earn $1M more in 2021 and $3M more in 2022 plus team options for a 3rd and 4th year with a higher pay scale or buyout .

Just for the record I don't agree with the Springer thread being closed just because people were discussing optimism, hope, expectations ,reality, and pessimism. No one was getting all that belligerent . Don't tell me not to live Just sit and putter Life's candy and the sun's A ball of butter Don't bring around a cloud To rain on my parade Don't tell me not to fly I've simply got to If someone takes a spill It's me and not you Who told you you're allowed To rain on my parade There's actually a baseball reference in that old Broadway tune.

See Jack, that's what happens when you're in a panning kind of mood. Even when you want to say something positive it came out negative.

Well that's just silly. It's physically impossible. What's the point of raining on everyone parade ?

Just so you know Jack, you cannot be "panned" as one of the best in the game since panned means "criticized">

Nah its just called hope and I think the majority of people you think are falling for it don't really care enough to be devastated, (temporarily upset, yes) when things go sour. It's not life or death , we aren't getting fooled here but we all can't be grouches.

I don't fall for it but hope for the best. Sometimes that's enough for me like in the off season. Sometimes it isn't like during the season. I totally wanted Lynn at the trade deadline because was hoping we'd have him for 2 playoffs. It didn't happen and I got over it in short time. ANd most people are generally optimistic here like thinking Vaughn can be a major contributer next year , Oscar Colas not only will be signed but be ready to play RF in short order or me thinking EE was a bad idea and hoping Yermin got a shot. Fantasy land is a good place every so often when you know most of what you want to happen aint happenin'.

My general approach is its early and the smart teams are snatching up starters and the Sox would be wise to get in on the early action for 1 SP asap.Outside of that my wish is for Bauer and we all know that is a long shot. Springer doesn't matter to me since pitching should be 1st and foremost and I think most would agree. I expect at least one significant trade involving some prospects.

I don't feel abused. My eyes are wide open to what this franchise is. However, they are my favorite team in the world so for better or worse I will continue being fine that they are now in a position of competing and whatever that brings. I reserve the right to continue to hope ,be positive, to gripe and be negative. I don't feel like an idiot at all.

Already with the Dodgers. Last minute trade,Dodgers give up PTNL and cash.