hitlesswonder

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Oct 16, 2010 -> 06:30 PM) But Hudson, at least for the moment, has made the entire front office look foolish. There was obviously something there that they failed to identify. A kid doesn't go on that kinda run by accident literally right after you trade him. And lol@Jackson being "all-time" Peavy insurance. That's worse than CQ/Danks being a good enough package to "land anybody." KW has had about one decent move in the last 2 years: picking up Rios for the cost of his contract. This year at least, he played to his contract and gave the Sox their first decent CF since the fire and the passion left. But even the Rios move isn't a pure win, he's really expensive. But the Sox are so bereft of position talent they can't be picky about acquiring anyone that can play. This offseason, at least one of Danks or Floyd has to/will be traded. It's basically all the Sox have to move. But even then I don't think either of those guys will bring anything close to what this board wants. CQ, Danks, Santos, and Morel might be enough to get Rasmus but I don't see CQ and Danks alone being close....

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 10, 2010 -> 05:48 PM) I think we called that back on July 8th. I find it hard to believe that Riley could resist the temptation to be the coach of the best team in NBA history. So, yeah, I think Spoelstra has a very good chance of hitting the bricks. And you can count my vote for the Heat winning 73 games and then resting people...and then winning the championship in 5 games over the Lakers. Oh, and the Bull win 45 games, Bucks take the Central. Neither Rose nor Noah are all-stars this season (though both are good players).

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Oct 10, 2010 -> 05:56 PM) W.T.F.? I'll give you Santos. But the other guys? Danks is about to start making big money, Floyd ended the season hurt, Sale's mechanics apparently scream injury-waiting-to-happen to a lot of baseball people, and Alexei is only under contract through 2012 and can't get on-base. All those guys have value, but it's not like the Sox have someone like Starlin Castro they could trade. The Sox might be able to get a rental like Fielder for one of those guys plus some other weaker stuff, but someone like Matt Kemp....I don't know.

QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Oct 10, 2010 -> 04:27 PM) Mike Stanton is one of the league's best young OFers, and will be under team control for the next 5 years atleast, and has proven that he can hit at the ML level already. There is no way the Sox will get him. I think that's exactly right. The Sox don't have any combination of players that could be packaged for a guy like Stanton. Really, the only things the Sox have to trade that have any significant value are Floyd, Danks, Sale, Santos, and Alexei. And none of those guys is all that valuable. The truth is that the Sox don't have much talent and what talent they do have is either well-paid (Rios) or about to cost a bunch of money (Danks).

QUOTE (thxfrthmmrs @ Oct 4, 2010 -> 03:59 PM) what the? can someone tell me what is going on around here? since when did floyd's value skyrocketed? floyd for fielder and a prospect? if i were the sox, i wouldn't hesitate to trade floyd for fielder alone. Really? Fielder will be a FA after next season, his agent is Boras, and SI says he wants at least $200M. Floyd is under control for 3 more years at $22M total. That's a pretty sweet deal for a pitcher who is 27 and has put together 3 decent seasons in a row in a tough park and league. Trading Floyd for a one year rental seems dicey unless Floyd is hurt worse than is publicly known.

I'd still trade a guy who is essentially the same player as Samuel Dalembert for Carmelo Anthony without hesitation. I think people will look back on the Bulls refusal to trade Noah for Anthony the same way they do on the refusal to give up Deng for Pau Gasol. It's crazy.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Sep 25, 2010 -> 06:18 PM) Well obviously that plays in to it...but quite simply, if I'm the Nuggets and I'm sitting there looking at Deng + Noah + a late first round pick, and comparing it to AK47's expiring contract + Favors + Golden State's late-Lottery pick and I get to choose which one I take because Melo would accept either...I take the Nets offer. Wouldn't you? I would take the Nets offer as well. The Bulls would have to go with Deng, Noah, Gibson, the CHA first and a first of their own...and even then that's a pretty poor haul. Really, for all the optimism about the Bulls being a top 4 team in the East next season, their roster is actually pretty depressing. The don't have a player outside of Rose that really has any significant trade value.

QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 25, 2010 -> 04:57 PM) Couldn't agree more, especially if the plantar fas flares up again. I agree as well...It's pathetic that once again Pax chose a glorified hustle player over elite basketball talent. Noah gets destroyed by anyone bigger than he is...he's really a PF that can't score and lived off boarding his own misses to post some rebounding stats. Unbelievable. Way to think small.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Sep 24, 2010 -> 08:03 PM) Why would Denver want Noah since he's not signed for next year either? I don't see Denver as a place Joakim would like to be. I think its just more NBA rumor BS. I don't think Denver would trade for Noah unless HE agreed to an extension first, and I don't see that happening. Noah is a restricted FA. He'd be under control for, what...2 more years after this season? A package of Noah, Gibson, Deng, and some first round picks wouldn't be bad for Denver (if it works under the cap). I have to say, Noah isn't worth anywhere near a max contract...or even Deng's contract. Trading Noah in a package for a top 15 NBA player like Anthony should be an easy decision. But once again, Paxson will probably prefer hustle to talent,

QUOTE (whitesoxfan101 @ Sep 22, 2010 -> 11:09 AM) I don't see how you can say 2005 wasn't a fluke at this point. I don't get why people get mad at those of us who call it a fluke. It doesn't make 2005 not feel great, it doesn't change the fact that the championship was earned, and it doesn't cheapen what happened at all. But 2005 was still a fluke. A fluke in what sense? Since 2005 the Sox won 90 games in 2006, sucked in 2007, and won 89 games in 2008, and these last two years will have muddled around .500. It seems like the Sox had a pretty good team 2005-2008 with 2007 being a fluke. KW and Ozzie have fairly consistently put good but not great teams on the field. So, I agree that 2005 was a fluke in that it is an outlier, but I don't think that they are total incompetents that got extraordinarily lucky one year. They are a decent organization that got lucky one year.

QUOTE (kitekrazy @ Sep 21, 2010 -> 12:19 PM) If he doesn't botch that up, he'll fill that need only to make another hole elsewhere. Getting a career DH sure cost a lot of money to fix that hole made in CF. Rowand has .642 OPS this season (following a .738 OPS last season). Even if KW hadn't traded for Thome, there would have been a hole in CF by this season if not before....and unless they had held on to Chris Young, it would have cost them a lot of money to fill that hole.

QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 17, 2010 -> 09:15 PM) Kotsay with a fantastic game tonight! If Viciedo really is the 1b of the future, then put him in the f***ing lineup. There's absolutely no reason to be playing Kotsay the rest of this season. You have to show the veteran respect...can't just sit him down.....ugh. I'd like to know the odds of Kotsay being back next season. I bet it's higher than a lot of people think. It's not impossible that he'll be the starting first baseman in 2011....

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Sep 15, 2010 -> 10:33 PM) It's a shame that in a major market like Chicago that 87/88 wins is somewhat acceptable to some folks. I the previous post was simple saying that an 88-win team is not necessarily one that needs to be blown up. Nothing was said about it being somewhat acceptable. At 88 wins, it's possible to argue that instead of blowing it up, slight improvement is needed. I don't know if that's the case, but I do think it's not rational to want AAA Charlotte playing in Chicago next season because the 2010 Sox lost to the Twins. It's a shame that in a major market like Chicago people want to see a 70(?) win team next season.

QUOTE (BearingPro @ Sep 15, 2010 -> 09:58 PM) I want kids drafted and taught to play baseball the correct way...bunting, fielding, situational hitting, running bases. It's difficult to teach castoffs the "White Sox Way" when they bring baggage with them. Individual talent exists but the players need to become a team, doing whats right when its required. Why, when the Sox lose, do so many people think things would be better if the Sox could just bunt more (or better)? The Sox already bunt way too much. The Sox lost tonight because the pitching got shelled. If Gavin pitches like an ace, the Sox win. It also would help if the Sox had one or two more players that could hit the snot out of the ball on a semi-regular basis. I'd rather see that than a bunch of homegrown Nick Puntos. As far as teaching the "White Sox Way" and fielding, the best gloves on the field tonight for the Sox were Rios and Ramirez neither of which learned to field in the Sox minor league system. The Sox need better players. From anywhere.

QUOTE (daggins @ Sep 15, 2010 -> 12:20 AM) The Sox have done better on that front lately, although the 2010 haul was a bit of a disappointment. If you look at a team like Boston, they rarely have high draft position, but they manage to build a solid farm because they are always willing to pay for the right player. The Sox MO for the last decade has been mid-to-low draft placement but no money for anyone. You can't build a solid farm without spending the cash, and that has always been a weakness of the current regime. That's compounded by not having any significant presence in Latin America. The Sox attempt at increasing their signings in that region ended with the Wilder fiasco.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Sep 15, 2010 -> 12:00 AM) I've agreed with just about everything you've said all night until this little doozy. Where the hell did this come from? He can't play the field. So he's a DH and his OBP is going to be bad. Is Jeff Francouer an average major league player at DH? Not in my opinion. Average major league players are actually valuable players, so I'm not saying Viciedo is never going to be more than replacement level, or won't play in the bigs for a few years. I am saying that I expect him to be about as valuable as a Francouer that can't field. I'd be happy to be proven wrong, and maybe someone that has access to better minor league/scouting info can post and correct me if I'm wrong. But I don't think Dayan is in anyone's top 100 prospect list.

QUOTE (CQMVP @ Sep 14, 2010 -> 11:41 PM) Not just spending money to FILL SEATS, which is what Dollar Bill did, and what JR does with the Sox, but spending money to WIN. You really think the White Sox made moves like Griffey, Peavy, Manny, etc to WIN? No, they made big splash moves like that to SELL TICKETS and MERCHANDISE. Peavy is awesome, for the 1/4 of the season he is healthy. Griffey was awesome, ten years ago. Manny was awesome, five years ago. They make these moves for the hype, and because it sells tickets. Nothing more, nothing less. JR is a snake oil salesman. Griffey and Manny were desperation moves to fill holes at the end of seasons with the Sox competing for the playoffs. They made the playoffs in 2008 with Griffey, I'd consider that winning. Neither of those moves mortgaged the future of the team, and they certainly didn't sell much extra merchandise or fill seats. People knew/know that Griffey and Manram are no longer stars. As for Peavy, KW thought he was acquiring a guy who would compete for a Cy Young award. That was not a crazy thought, and those guys are hard to acquire. His previous injuries were not arm-related, so I don't know if there were any huge red flags that would make that deal seem idiotic at the time. Peavy wasn't just hype or snake-oil, he was a guy you could project to be a legit good pitcher for several years. The White Sox haven't won in 2009 and 2010 because KW made some truly awful moves, not because the Sox relied on expensive over-hyped veterans. They didn't really rely on aging over-hyped veterans any more than they did in 2005. In fact, if the Sox had signed the aging veteran DH Jim Thome to bring fans in to watch him hit historic home runs they would have been better off.

QUOTE (BearingPro @ Sep 14, 2010 -> 10:52 PM) The WS had better turn back to drafting, developing and promoting. This half-assed piecemeal approach is not working. It's time to bring up the young guys and build for the future. I want Morel, Flowers, Jordan Danks, Jared Mitchell and Viciedo playing full time next year. I don't mean for this to sound harsh, but I think that's ridiculous. Mitchell will be coming off an injury and lost season having played what, a half-season of pro ball? Promoting him to the majors sounds like a good way to ruin any career he might have. Danks can't hit in AAA. Flowers can't hit in AAA. Viciedo has no plate discipline and right now doesn't project as even an average major-league player at any point in his career. Morel is the one guy on that list that might be able to be an average major league player someday. But he won't be good his first season in the majors. Your approach makes the Sox the Pittsburgh Pirates, and for what return? It's not like these guys have a chance of turning into all-stars. The Sox minor league system is awful, so going with youth is simply punting away seasons to get high draft choices. Giving up on 5 or more seasons until the Sox accumulate enough top 5 picks to have decent cheap talent isn't anything I want to watch. The Sox have some talent at the major league level. They need a GM who can make a few decent moves and put them in a position to challenge again next season. Giving up on competing the next several years because the Sox will finish second this season seems like an over-reaction to me.

QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 14, 2010 -> 08:27 PM) Yep, KW has been TERRIBLE at his job ever since the 2008 season ended. I don't really know how anyone could do worse. The returns on the Swisher and Vazquez trade really couldn't have been more mediocre, and has killed the depth in this franchise. KW cost the Sox the division this year. The litany of bad moves is ridiculous: Swisher trade to NYY Vazquez trade Teahen acquisition and extension Kotsay over Thome Hudson for Jackson I know some of those moves were pre-2010, but they still affect this year's club. Those are all truly awful trades (or FA choices). Even the Pierre trade was bad, IMO. Pierre managed an OK OBP this season, but the Sox are still locking up $8M in a left fielder with a sub-.700 OPS. Next year looks awful. They have too much money locked up in junk like Teahen, Pierre, Linebrink to go with an overpaid Edwin Jackson and Jake Peavy...there's no money or minor league talent to fill the holes on the team.

This ESPN story on Pearl is ridiculous. A "whistleblower" is someone who reports violations in their own organization. Pearl did not do that -- he alleged that violations occurred in a RIVAL program. That was not altruism. Moreover, the fact that Pearl's claims could not be substantiated make his efforts seem less like a crusade to cleanup basketball and more a way to achieve a competitive advantage. So, his getting busted is not ironic. It is in fact what one would expect from someone who will do whatever they believe is necessary to build a winning program. I find that interpretation of events a lot more plausible than the portrait painted here of a virtuous coach falling from grace. I'm not an apologist for the Illinois basketball program either. I'm sure they were dirty. It's just galling that an ESPN writer has no clue WTF a whistleblower really is.

QUOTE (SoxFan562004 @ Sep 4, 2010 -> 06:11 PM) I don't think it's a copout, thanks for using wonderful language to spice up your argument too, it's an easier league, flat-out.. Using "It's an easier league" to dismiss Hudson's success is a copout. Not having to pitch to a DH is an advantage, but people have looked at projecting an ERA moving from the NL to AL and it's around a 0.4 difference in ERA. Even if you tack that onto Hudson's NL ERA, he'd have something like a 3.70 ERA in the AL. Moreover, Jackson was getting his ass handed to him in the NL...Hudson has significantly outperformed what Jackson did in AZ just to confuse matters. Jackson looks like a good pitcher who is under control for one more year at $8M. Hudson looks like a good pitcher under control for 5 more years and very cheap for 2 of those. It was not good trade. Probably not the worst that KW has made over the last decade, but it just wasn't a good trade.

QUOTE (WHITESOXRANDY @ Sep 3, 2010 -> 07:08 AM) How did you like giving up Gio Gonzalez for Swisher ? Better than giving up Swisher for Marquez.

QUOTE (fathom @ Aug 25, 2010 -> 11:28 AM) Didn't the Tribune article say that KW went as far as to show the text messages he got from Ozzie to prove they didn't believe they needed another reliever? Ugh, I'm so sick of the bulls*** between the GM and Manager. Yeah, I missed that part. I agree it's ridiculous that this is a story. I've enjoyed Ozzie's tenure as manager but it's too bad he has a year left on his contract.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Aug 25, 2010 -> 10:30 AM) Which is funny, because in the Trib today Kenny said he asked Ozzie if he wanted another pitcher, and he told him no, and that he had one too many already. It's possible that KW wasn't exactly telling the truth to the Trib. I wouldn't be surprised if he was flat-out lying and that he vetoed Ozzie's request. I have to think at least one of Ozzie or KW is gone after this season and then both after 2011....

It will be interesting to see how much talent the Sox lose and how much money they take on just because they picked Kotsay over Thome this offseason.