nitetrain8601

QUOTE(whitesoxfan99 @ Oct 13, 2006 -> 02:56 PM) Tell me all of the talented players from central Illinois in Weber's tenure. Livingston, Jamar, Cole, and ???. The talent from Illinois has been down big time. Making Weber's misses much worse than Self's. Self missed on Andre Iguodola, Dockery, Thompson, among others but still was able to get Dee and Augie. Besides if you are going to give credit to self for recruiting Head then Weber gets credit for Brock who was just as highly regarded as a recruit. Carlwell was a more highly regarded big man than anyone Self brought in. Pruitt is from the Chicagoland area as is McCamey. I'm done discussing this. Lol, you're done discussing because you're lying. Livingston, Scheyer, Wright, Frasor, McNeal, Collins, Will Walker, Jerome Randle, Rose, Koshwal(whom IL fans were raving about until he was lost), Even Turner, Brandon McGee. Keep in mind, these are all 4 star prospects or higher in Illionis during Weber's tenure here that he's lost. The guy can't recruit in-state for crap.

QUOTE(whitesoxfan99 @ Oct 13, 2006 -> 02:52 PM) Brown was from Maywood. Its a suburb of Chicagoland. And Weber got Carlwell from the same school. Self did a great job getting Deron out of Texas and getting Dee. His other recruiting wins at Illinois were nothing special (unless you count Villanueva who didn't sign a LOI). Randle and McBride were from central Illinois, Illinois was the biggest school on their lists and they likely would have been Illini no matter what. Head wasn't a top 100 recruit. Blandon Ferguson was awful. Spears was a late decommit. Kyle Wilson wasn't top 100. Augustine was between Illinois and Purdue. Warren Carter wasn't a top 100 recruit. Weber needs to change his recruiting philosophy I agree, but Self was no recruiting god at Illinois. Okay, Chicagoland area if you want to get technical, which Weber still can't recruit from. Spears came to the school and decomitted after one year with Weber IIRC. As far as guys like Brian Randle, you have to be kidding me. Teams on his list were Illinois, Duke, Kansas, Michigan State, Notre Dame and Stanford. I guess schools like Duke aren't above Illinois. Warren Carter was a top 100 recruit. #83 according to scout.com.

QUOTE(Jimbo @ Oct 13, 2006 -> 02:50 PM) Still kind of sad that he could not get scheyer, hell his brother was his coach. Exactly. That's another guy who should've been a shoe-in. Weber is the type of coach who belongs at an SIU. QUOTE(Jimbo @ Oct 13, 2006 -> 02:51 PM) Still kind of sad that he could not get scheyer, hell his brother was his coach. last year's class sucked also. Exactly my point. He's been pretty much sucking it up recruiting wise since he got here.

QUOTE(whitesoxfan99 @ Oct 13, 2006 -> 02:42 PM) Chicago hasn't been friendly to Illinois since Deon Thomas. Kruger couldn't recruit Chicago for s***, and Self didn't do well in Chicago either till he left Illinois. There's a difference though, Kruger was able to get guys like Brian Cook, Sergia McClain, and Frank Williams that were in-state. Plus he got Corey Bradford who was a promising recruit from out of state. Weber's recruiting class pretty much depended on Gordon and it fell through big.

QUOTE(whitesoxfan99 @ Oct 13, 2006 -> 02:38 PM) Self never had Chicago while he was at Illinois. He didn't have Chicago till he moved to KU. His Chicago recruits were Head who wasn't at top 100 player and Aaron Spears who wasn't good. He lost out on Dockery and Thompson who were the two big recruits from Chicago. Illinois hasn't been able to recruit Chicago since the Deon Thomas affair. Proviso East isn't the CPL and Weber has already landed a pretty big recruit from there in Brian Carlwell. Julian Wright (who would've gone here if Self stayed), Luther Head, Aaron Spears(who was #75 recruit), Dee Brown to name a few. Also, Self never went after Dockey. It was mainly DePaul, Duke, and Michigan State. Thompson was always set on Duke because he's one of those guys who always wanted to play for Coach K. James Augustine is from the Chicagoland area. You could say he lost Rick Cornett, Shannon Brown, and Dameon Mason, but he was also recruiting guys like Charlie Villanueva. These are guys that Weber is losing to teams like Depaul.

QUOTE(CanOfCorn @ Oct 13, 2006 -> 02:37 PM) Don't say that until Derrick Rose commits elsewhere, if he does. He's a Simeon product. If he commits elsewhere, THEN you can say he's lost Chicago. He's not a great recruiter, that's for sure...he needs to hire someone from Chicago, either a well-thought of high school coach or someone off Jimmy Collins staff...or for that matter, Jimmy Collins, if he'll come back. You know for damn sure Rose isn't committing to Illinois. That's not even a question. He'll probably committ to Indiana since all I've been hearing is that if Gordon committs to Indiana, he would like to as well. And yes, they need to start picking guys off other staffs from Chicago because they are losing guys left and right.

QUOTE(Jimbo @ Oct 13, 2006 -> 02:34 PM) my point exactly...bravo to you, great post. Weber has lost Chicago, which Self won back for Illinois, and is now taking for himself .Sampson and Izzo and Motta are going to eat up the midwest. Diamonds in a rough only come once in a while. Exactly. If Illinois is going to stay a top team, they have to be able to recruit in their own state. They're losing guys left and right, especially from Chicago to Self and Izzo and Coach K, amongst others. Weber is a great coach, but that will only take Illinois to SIU status which is tournament status, but probably won't get out of the first weekend of the big tourney.

Why do people call Eric Gordon EJ? Also, are people still going to tell me Bruce Weber is a good recruiter? The only prize he had from the Championship Game from 2 years ago, just decided to go against a verbal committment and go to a rival. Like I have been saying, Weber can't recruit, the end. That type of coach doesn't last long, especially if they can't recruit based off a national championship appearance.

QUOTE(Heads22 @ Oct 12, 2006 -> 07:07 PM) Good thing Kansas got hit with probation today. For what and how many years?

People wouldn't give up Brandon McCarthy for A-Rod? Wow. This guy better turn out so good that they change the Cy Young Award into the Brandon McCarthy Award. JMO, just another example of people way overrating Brandon McCarthy beyond belief.

A-Rod isn't coming to the White Sox folks. Get over it. Boras and KW don't like each other. I also can't see Ozzie and A-Rod getting along.

QUOTE(redandwhite @ Oct 9, 2006 -> 10:10 PM) This seems to be the White Sox Catch All-Thread at the moment, so I'll post this here. The White Sox went from 9th to 3rd in Runs and 1st to 10th in ERA from 2005 to 2006. It's clear that the pitching was a major problem, so I am in no way placing much blame on the offensive side of things, however... When you have a line-up with Konerko, Thome, and Dye would you rather surround them with players who get on base or guys who play all or nothing style baseball as the White Sox had. I ask this because everybody seems so high on Crede here, but if the White Sox 7-8-9 hadn't gotten on base at such a low clip (.323, .290, .257 respectively) I happen to believe that this team would have been a better all around baseball team. Rally Crede, his great defense, I'm trying not to be close minded here, I just happen to think in a line-up full of big boppers, you need the table setters to, and the demise of the 2006 White Sox could be somewhat credited to the lack of the Bill Mueller's for the Red Sox in '04, the Castillo's and Lowell's of the '03 Marlins, the David Eckstein's and Scott Spiezio's of the '02 Angels and so on.. Thoughts. Pods, Iguchi, Uribe, and Anderson need to be table setters. Same with AJ in my mind.

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ Oct 9, 2006 -> 08:16 AM) Let's have a look at the Yanks current rotation; Wang - He's a keeper. Mussina - Free Agent I think. Could decide to bolt, cos he's had enough. Johnson - Almost becoming a liability. Wright - The Yanks have a $7M option, and a $3M buy-out. It's been mooted they'll trade him, I'd expect a team like Baltimore or the Braves to try hard to acquire him. Lidle - A Free Agent IIRC. Not sure if he'll be back. Pavano - Who knows what's going to happen with him, Cashman may try to trade him or buy him out. So that's 2 definite they've got coming back in Wang and Randy Johnson, albeit RJ ain't that good anymore. But that's 3 other spots they've got to fill still. They'll get one of Zito or Matzusuka I'd imagine, so that's 3. One of Mussina or Lidle, more likely Mussina will probably be back so that's 4. So it could very well depend on what they do with Pavano. Phillip Hughes will probably be ready mid-season next year, so Garcia makes sense for them in the sense that he's only got 1 year left on his deal, which gives Cashman the flexibility to trade him at the deadline to fill another need possibly. So I certainly think a Crede and Garcia for A-Rod package is feasible. And I like the idea, because it lets Josh Fields develop at Charlotte for another season (don't want to rush him), and you can let A-Rod take over SS in 2008 when Uribe's contract finishes in 2007. They don't want a pitcher who's lost velocity and if someone dares blame it on the WBC, I will throw a tirade. Ask any of their fans. Think of it this way, Ken Griffey Jr. now won't net you the same package he would've a couple of years ago. Things change in a matter of a couple of years. Every team wanted Freddy a couple of years ago because he still looked very good, was having a great year(despite win/loss) and was the best pitcher available on the market that year.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Oct 9, 2006 -> 03:30 AM) Any deal involving Brandon McCarthy is a no go. His presence is the key to our whole offseason. By the way I didn't sour on Brandon at all. Anyways, I wouldn't be surprised at all if the Yankees would want Freddy. The Yankees are still going to want a proven starter and Freddy is just that. It's going to take a nice package to get Alex, no doubt but I think it'd be doable with out Brandon. EDIT: Well thought out post though RJ, I just disagree about Freddy, I think he'd interest them. Nah, the Yankees don't want Freddy unless they could get him for a middle of the road prospect or get rid of Pavano's contract.

QUOTE(BobDylan @ Oct 8, 2006 -> 09:35 PM) I'm sorry, but if you get two solid major leaguers and a top prospect, you're not "dumping" a player. There isn't a player in this league I'd trade 4 pivotal pieces of my team for just one "star" in return. They might get a better offer than Garcia + Crede + Broadway/McCarthy, but it's not going to be much better. And whichever team offers that had better have one hell of a plan to replace all that lost talent. A-Rod might be a great player but when you look at the total package I'm not even sure he's worth Garcia, Crede and a prospect. Again, there's no way I would do that deal either which makes him virtually untradeable for the Yankees.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Oct 8, 2006 -> 09:28 PM) The fans dont pay the bills. You have to think Big George is not happy with A-rod right now, and someone has to be shown the door. Out of all the marquee players that you let go, he is the first. Plus you know they are going to make a run at pitching next year, why dont we offer up some clutch playoff pitchers (Garcia, Mark, Count) and see if they bite on one of them. I wouldn't say Mark is a clutch playoff pitcher. Same probably for Garcia and Yankee fans don't think Contreras can handle the NY pressure. And yes, the fans do pay the bills. If the fans don't come, you wouldn't see that big payroll.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Oct 8, 2006 -> 09:16 PM) Fact is, you have to think A-rod is done in NY. He disappeared in the playoffs again, and he has to be out the door. Also the Yanks found out they need better pitching to compete in the postseason. We package Buehrle with someone for A-rod, I can see it happening. He plays SS for us though, not 3B isnt that an ironic statement..... I don't see that he has to be out the door. There are some Yankee fans who defend him and know that the rest of the lineup minus Jorge Posada and Jeter I believe it was, did horrible in the playoffs.

QUOTE(santo=dorf @ Oct 8, 2006 -> 08:28 PM) I can imagine the Yanks trying to package worthless Pavano with A-Rod just to save some money. Perhaps they would send some cahs, but only if you take on some damaged goods like Pavano or Wright. It would probably take that as well. I could see the Yankees dropping at least one of those players off, if they suckered a team into paying the rest of Pavano's contract. QUOTE(Felix @ Oct 8, 2006 -> 08:33 PM) Lets put it this way. The Rangers got Alfonso Soriano and Joaquin Arias from the Yankees for him, and still had to pay a boatload of money. This was when A-Rod was in his prime, and coming off some of his best seasons while playing spectacular defense at shortstop. Now, A-Rod is 30+, and is coming off a couple of horrible seasons with the media while playing poor defense at third. If they get more quality major leaguers now than they gave up then, it just doesn't make sense to me. That being said, this is a pretty bad comparison since they are different situations and timing If those are horrible, I hate to see what you would call a Juan Uribe year.

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Oct 8, 2006 -> 08:09 PM) If you translate Buehrle, Crede, McCarthy, Thornton and a prospect into an Angels package you basically get Lackey, Figgins, Santana, Shields and a prospect for A-Rod. It just doesn't seem very plausible now does it? Which is exactly what the Yankees would look for if they were going to trade him. A very good starter, someone to somewhat replace production at 3B(which I think Crede would do much better of), a future 2/3 to go along with Phillip Hughes I think his name is, and a bridge to get to Rivera. QUOTE(sircaffey @ Oct 8, 2006 -> 08:14 PM) Has any player brought in that much Major League talent before (4 solid players)? It's going to be extremely hard for the Yanks to get 3 solid major leaguers let alone 4 for Arod. No team is going to shed themselves that badly. At best, I could see a SP, 3B, and RP for Arod. Definitely not 2 SP. This is a buy low situation. I'd like to see the Sox jump all over it. I wouldn't put anything by Big Stein. No, but no team has tried to trade a player of A-Rod's calibur either. I mean, at SS, the guy was a legit GG. And as a SS, he's probably the best ever to play the position. It may be a buy low situation, but the Yankees aren't stupid when it comes to A-Rod production apparently. Trust me, I tried telling them to look at Crede's numbers, especially his defense and they weren't having any of it. They love Crede, but they know what they want. Steinbrenner is just like the fans too, it just depends on if someone like Cashman(who I believe is a good friend of KW's) decides that he'll go against the boss. Again, I want A-Rod badly. Someone should get Cashman and Steinbrenner really drunk.

QUOTE(witesoxfan @ Oct 8, 2006 -> 08:01 PM) Buehrle, Crede, McCarthy, Thornton, and a prospect? Should the Sox just include the entire Birmingham Barons roster too? I don't buy that at all. As far as I can tell, ARod is completely hated by New York in general, be it fans or the organization. Considering how much he makes(because even with money included, it is a ton), his value isn't high enough that he would net 2 all-stars(Crede's not an all-star, but he was about #33 on the 32 man), a very solid reliever, a very good looking and cheap young starting pitcher, as well as another prospect. I obviously don't have inside sources into the Yankees FO, but if they are asking that much for 1 player who has a bad reputation for not being clutch, they aren't going to get rid of him. They may not want to get rid of him, so if not, they have all the right in the world to ask for that. George and company will get laughed at, but they can do so if they wish. They won't try to get rid of him. Are they going to shop him? Of course, but they're not looking to "dump" him. "Dumping" and "trading" are two very different things. Unless someone wows them, they're not going to trade A-Rod, much less pay any of his contract.

QUOTE(whitesox1976 @ Oct 7, 2006 -> 06:43 PM) Next up for the Tigers is the Oakland A's and Frank Thomas. Congratulations Tigers. Looks to me like Alex Rodriguez will be gone from the Yankees next season. If the rumors are true, and they hire Lou Pinella, A-Rod won't be gone.

A-Rod would be a great acquisition at SS, but the White Sox would have to give up so much, I'm not sure they would want to acquire him. I asked a couple of Yankee fans if a Crede, Garcia, Fields and a mid-level prospect would get it done, and they basically said it wouldn't take more, just better. Keep in mind, these are guys who don't care for A-Rod. Most brought up names: Buehrle, Crede, McCarthy, Thornton/Sweeney/Fields, and another mid level prospect. I want A-Rod here as bad as anyone, but I think it's beyond a pipedream to think about him coming here.

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ Oct 3, 2006 -> 11:00 PM) Do you think Brian Sabean would have made that deal, if he had realized how good those 3 players have become now? That's the reason why you need great scouts which the Sox don't depend on from what it seems.

QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ Sep 29, 2006 -> 01:15 PM) Don't worry. Continually trading prospects to reinforce a "win-now" philosophy will pay off with annual playoff births. Oh wait.... Well, atleast you can count on our stellar Latin American scouts finding a potential MLB utility player. Oh yeah, they can't even do that... If we had decent ones, we would be talking about a Liriano type at least. We have no one like that in the system.

Anyone know anything about him? Is it a loss or someone we really don't know much about. He's supposed to be the next pitching coach for that team.