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QUOTE (TheFutureIsNear @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 09:53 PM) Micah is actually the one I think we could end up regretting trading, more so Semien. Agreed. Potential switch hitting 3B.

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 08:44 PM) Plus if Hahn does get to trade Danks to say PIT, that saves money for a guy like Masterson or a bullpen piece. Sale Quintana Samardzija Masterson Bassitt/Noesi My previous scenario was based on Noesi going in the trade as someone speculated.

QUOTE (shipps @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 08:42 PM) Couldn't we still sign a guy like Masterson? Shark will not take up much of payroll unless we sign him long term. That works too. I was just stating it, if the sox put the rest of their resources into the pen or LF

QUOTE (Alexeihyeess @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 08:37 PM) Dealing Noesi doesn't do much for us. You do upgrade that spot in the rotation A LOT, but now the Sox would have a major hole at the #5 Sale Q JS Danks Bassitt/rodon I'm good with that.

QUOTE (Baron @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 08:33 PM) Sounds good...we'll have to stop for food though. Getting pretty hungry right about now. Deal. Now if we can get Beane to fall for this deal. Hopefully we can keep bassitt. I was impressed when I saw one of his starts in person

QUOTE (Baron @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 08:30 PM) My new Ford Focus doesnt have a windshield I can see through right now unfortunately I'll pick you up on the way if you really want to help.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 08:21 PM) They can hop in my Impala, and I will have them to ORD in no time. Got the brand new Cadillac cts on remote start ready to go.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 06:25 PM) If John Danks were a free agent, what would you expect him to sign for? He hasn't thrown 200 innings since 2010. He hasn't had an era under 4.00 since 2010, even in the partial seasons. His velocity never has recovered. His 2014 was actually lower for average velocity than the year after his surgery. I was on the Danks bandwagon for a while, but the guy has no value, at all. He had the nice flash at the end of the season after some mechanical changes, but I sure wouldn't be willing to pay anything of significance for that after his last four years. I think this was due to the increased volume of innings and he wore down. I fully expect all of this to increase. However, as a GM I wouldn't offer much because there is no guarantee.

Otherwise it can be painful.

QUOTE (TheFutureIsNear @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 06:11 PM) One has to wonder how many of these rumors are true at this point. Is there anybody we are NOT interested in? If they are a decent bullpen arm, the Sox are interested.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 04:07 PM) Part of this is me being difficult, but it feels like a worthwhile discussion. Some of it may be a moot point because who knows if the Sox trade for Samardzija or who they trade to get him. I agee. It is worthwhile.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 03:54 PM) If the White Sox are an example to follow, that's not exactly true anymore either. Seems to me that in the past 10 years, the Sox have had several front of the rotation starters but only had one above average 2B during that entire time frame in Tadahito Iguchi. People saying that it's easy or that it's not as important have yet to really win me over with that argument. Frankly, if Semien is dealt, the Sox are looking at Carlos Sanchez and Micah Johnson as the internal candidates at 2B. Those two were both less than impressive at both AAA and the MLB, depending on where either ended up. All we can say at this point is we'll see. I think the Sox are the exception to the rule. They have had a awful record developing hitters of any postion not even poor but awful.

QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 03:49 PM) There aren't that many good infielders out there in general. They had it filled, they drafted a college SS that could not stick at SS, tried him at third and then settled him in at second. He hit really well through the minors and in his rookie season, so it seemed to be an issue that was not an issue. Then he regressed and they waited for him to rebound before cutting ties with an asset that had been very valuable that had lost all of its value. We don't know who it is, but we have a pretty good idea that its going to be Sanchez to start the season unless Alexei is dealt. I still think they will start johnson there, unless he totally fails in ST.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 03:49 PM) Lol, nope. It is funny. It's not often we hear that a guy may benefit from getting away from Don Cooper. True. however, no one coach can help everyone. Cooper does have an abrasive personality. I'm sure that rubs some players the wrong way. Can't help a person if he won't listen to you.

QUOTE (Dunt @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 03:47 PM) Yup, I have no interest whatsoever in Masterson I think both will rebound from different injury scenarios. However, I think Masterson will be cheaper.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 03:43 PM) If 2B were so easy to find, there would be a ton of really good ones out there. That's not the case. http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=...=&players=0 There are maybe 8 or 9 guys on there that I think you could safely say are very good. It's impossible to deny that the Sox have depth at the position, but if it were that easy to fill, we'd know who it was moving forward and they wouldn't have had a blackhole there over the last 5 years. I'm not sure if the comments were that it was easy. I think it was that the 2B/utility role is easier to fill and not as important as a top of the rotation starter.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 03:43 PM) No, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to imply that defense isn't factored into WAR -- it IS factored into WAR. It's just that the "positional adjustment" piece of WAR is based on offense. UZR/DRS are converted to runs saved and factored into WAR separately from total offense. Ok. that makes more sense in my interpretation of WAR as well. while I'm still not sold on it, it makes a better attempt this way.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 03:37 PM) I like the idea of a Masterson-type of guy, but he lost so much velocity, it's harder see him bouncing back. I think much of the velocity was due to injury. He injured his knee and he should come back from that pretty well. You can't put much behind a pitch without the strong base.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 03:34 PM) Well, the positional adjustments aren't based on defense, they're based on mean offensive value. So really what it's saying is that it's just as hard to find a good hitting 3B as it is to find a good hitting 2B, which "feels" weird because 3Bs were all like Vinny Castilla during the steroid era, but when you look around the league, seems more normal. The defensive contributions are then thrown on top, and those vary greatly because of the different types of plays each makes, as you alluded to. Makes senseand that could be true as defense is a big part of 3B so good hitters who can't play good D (carlos Lee) aren't kept at third. But I still see it as a major deficiency in WAR because it really doesn't take defense into consideration. So the best that WAR does is compare offense at the same position.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 03:22 PM) A lot of people don't realize that the WAR positional adjustment for 2B is identical to 3B. I know a lot people don't see any value in WAR, but I do think it's interesting that the sabermetric community considers those positions equally important and the talent equally rare. I think that is deficiency in the WAR calculation then. It is not as rare to find a good defensive 2B as a good 3B. They may be equal as far as run prevention as the 2B is more instrumental in double plays as such but finding a good #B is harder.

QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 03:19 PM) Jacksquat? Lawrie has been a much better player to this point than Donaldson was at the same point in his career. I think it's more that he is cost controlled for a long er period of time as well. Plus Beane got a really good prospect with him. I'ts more that the entire package of players the a's received was better long term than Donaldson

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 03:14 PM) Makes it difficult when they have the same initials. Good point. Shields was easier to spell and takes less time with my limited typing skills.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 02:59 PM) So basically trading for Samardzija makes sense if Billy Beane forgets to call 28 other teams and gives him to us for a huge discount. If you "fully expect the white sox to make a run at signing him to an extension", why on Earth would you give up anything in a trade for that guy unless you have a competitive roster this year? Again hitting my point, this makes no sense. If were going to blow 9 figures on a pitcher, just go add Shields. Shields is not the pitcher that JS is. Having him at the top of the rotation makes the Sox a much better team. I like shields but he will command too many years at his age. If the sox could get shields on a 3 year deal, i would agree with you.

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 02:16 PM) Edit : You also used LaRoches' last 3 seasons of OPS but used Moss last 2 then one from 2009 when he was 25 and had 385 AB's had a .304 OBP and .668 OPS instead of his age 28 season when he was clearly a much improved hitter who had a .358 OBP and .954 OPS because he only had 265 AB's. I did that because those the only times he played a substantial number of mlb games. In all of the other seasons he barely played in the mlb, which is one of the reason i would pick LaRoche over him. If you average out his career, he averages only 78 games per season which is why i only looked at his full seasons and one of those was only 133 games.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 8, 2014 -> 02:52 PM) Marcus Semien for 1 year of Jeff Samardzija continues to make no sense for the White Sox. It makes us slightly worse next year most likely in the lineup (Sanchez becomes your full time 2b, have to go sign a utility infielder just to back up Gillaspie), which is even worse in a way than Trading Anderson since trading for Samardzija is such an "all in on 2015" move. I think johnson is your leader for the second base job even if nothing else happens with the other player.