Dick Allen

QUOTE (Marty34 @ May 11, 2013 -> 07:42 AM) No quick fixes here. First step is to get rid of as much money as possible (and Buddy Bell.) 1. Get rid of Buddy Bell. 2. Release Gimenez, bring up Phegley. See if either him or Flowers can be at least a back up catcher. 3. Put Ramirez on waivers, hope someone picks up that contract, replace him with Keppinger. 4. Deal De Aza, Rios, Peavy for certain. Put Danks in CF, Viciedo in RF. Heck, put Dunn in LF if for nothing else to keep him in shape. 1 and 2 make sense. The others........you obviously want the Sox to be the Astros.

QUOTE (Jake @ May 10, 2013 -> 09:45 PM) Bulls just haven't had a single thing go their way. I'm really enjoying Van Gundy tonight. Calling a spade a spade. Thibs is his former assistant.

Hamilton has only homered vs. the Astros this year.

QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ May 10, 2013 -> 02:33 PM) Also, kind of funny that another report I saw on some no name pitcher, the scout says "Has above average velocity (88-89 mph)". Lol, back in 1985, high-80's was above average? Pitchers were using PEDs probably more frequently than position players. Also, many of the guys who you might think or the stadium gun shows throw in the low 90s, aren't really. They are juiced up a bit. Also, if it were a HS pitcher throwing in the high 80s, they would probably project him to get into the 90s, and finally, yes, back 30 years ago or so, there were only a few guys on a staff that threw 90+. Now it's just the opposite. Guys are throwing harder these days, no question about it.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 8, 2013 -> 06:18 PM) By the way, who would actually want to see the Twins play, compared to about 20-25 other teams in MLB? If those were the numbers against the Red Sox or Yankees, you'd have a much stronger point. Yet you talk about the sky falling when the Sox attendance in April when it's 35 degrees against Seattle and, yes, the Twins, is around the same amount.

This team just needs to score runs. They played TB, Texas, KC and the Mets, all of whom had their aces at one point, and were .500 against them despite hardly being able to score. They have scored the fewest runs they have scored through the first 30 games since 1968. If they can get some offense, despite what Andrew thinks, this is a good team. If they continue to hit like they have hit, they will get buried.

QUOTE (Andrew @ May 8, 2013 -> 11:37 PM) This a fan-board, right? If you have to ask, you're full of s*** too. Go to WSI. I invest in the Sox, year in, year out. Ok by you, Caulfield? For a guy who has all the answers, why are you wasting your time on a message board? Clearly, you should be running a team.

QUOTE (The Ginger Kid @ May 8, 2013 -> 02:36 PM) Ramirez is batting 2nd tonight! NO Keppinger! Gillaspie clean-up!! Maybe it's just me, or maybe it's just the lack of success, but Keppinger's effort hasn't impressed me this season especially for someone described as scrappy. To me he appears to be mailing it in, content he got paid.

QUOTE (bmags @ May 8, 2013 -> 02:33 PM) The strike kind of killed baseball good will in mid 90s. It wasn't the reason the Sox didn't have this "sustained success" that apparently is a requirement.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ May 8, 2013 -> 02:29 PM) How old is Sale? How old is Peavy? And how old would Sale be once the Sox were ready to win? Why risk where he would be health and contract-wise at that point. They are in last, they obviously can't win with him. Dump him now and let's complain about everything White Sox for the next decade. As you know, there is nothing better.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 8, 2013 -> 02:27 PM) It is proof that Sox fans would rather see mediocre teams than awful teams. Not only that, it took a WS to bring attendance back. Even when the White Sox successfully rebuilt and got Thomas, Ventura, McDowell and Fernandez in 4 consecutive drafts, and suffered through 3 seasons of barely drawing 1 million fans, it didn't lead to the "sustained success" that many here now say is a requirement for fans to come to games. I really think people are confusing the NBA with MLB. Not many teams bottom out, trade all their best assets for prospects and are contending anytime soon.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ May 8, 2013 -> 02:23 PM) Doesn't matter. Of course not. Guaranteeing being able to b**** about how bad the White Sox are for 5-10 years is by far more important.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ May 8, 2013 -> 02:18 PM) They are in last place now with Jake Peavy. How can you explain that? LOL. Should they dump Sale as well? They are in last with him. They should get rid of everyone.

After the White Flag trade, it took until 2005 for the White Sox attendance to be as high as it was in 2012. Not even a division title in 2000 drew as much as they did last year. The 6th straight year of decline.

Trading your best players doesn't necessarily improve your team. Trading Peavy for a prospect or 2 would indicate the White Sox aren't planning on contending anytime soon, and would probably really take a bite out of 2014 season ticket renewals.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ May 8, 2013 -> 01:31 PM) Because Peavy is far from a guarantee of pitching at a high level for much longer. Neither are the players you would get back either, so why acquire them? I would think track record is good for something.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ May 8, 2013 -> 01:26 PM) The Sox have no choice but to do the half and half rebuild/retool thing. I have seen good points on here though. I don't think they trade Rios or Peavy unless they are blown away by an offer. OTOH, some of the bullpen pieces should be shopped and dealt away (Crain, Thornton, Lindstrom). I would even trade Konerko if you could get something back in return. De Aza should be available and I would deal Ramirez for a good return as well. The surplus of pitching is nice as well as the intriguing starts by Erik Johnson and Chris Beck. If the Sox added McCann, Morales types in the offseason and made one big trade including one of the young pitchers (Quintana) with Beckham and more, they could compete next year. They would have a better offense and a rotation that includes Sale, Danks, Peavy, Santiago/Quintana, and hopefully Erik Johnson. It could work. I would be on board with the full blown rebuild but many would not be. It's probably not possible with this fanbase. That makes sense. Don't trade guys that will be almost impossible to replace unless you are shelling out nine figures, just because someone thinks the blueprint to getting better is hitting rock bottom. How many MLB teams have been successful doing that? This isn't the NBA or the NFL where a #1 pick can make almost an immediate impact and changes the dynamic of your team.

QUOTE (IlliniKrush @ May 8, 2013 -> 01:17 PM) 10+ games out and a last place team with your best players doesn't sell, either. Thinking a trade of Peavy will kill the fan base/remaining attendance is laughable. That's not a White Flag trade. If it doesn't set you up for next year, it will hurt. If the team could score runs, they would have a decent record right now. The Sox could use some hitters. Floyd, Konerko are off the books next year. $25 million more for the national TV contract. If payroll remains the same, that's $47 million freed to get some bats just next season. Why, unless it's a no brainer overpay for Peavy would you trade him? Lose the next 3 months and then re-tool. I don't understand anyone wanting the Sox to dump their best players. They have difficulty developing players. It's a fact. Unless you are a fan of "sustained losing" as some here without question would really enjoy , that is not the way to go.

QUOTE (IlliniKrush @ May 8, 2013 -> 01:13 PM) If the team is 10+ out, is that really a White Flag trade? Comparing the two is ridiculous. Dumping your best players for prospects usually doesn't sell, unless said prospects make a very quick impact. If the Sox traded Peavy for the Tyler Flowers and Brent Lillibridges of the world, that wouldn't go over very well.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 8, 2013 -> 01:04 PM) You can't be drawing a parallel between the Sox fan base and the Cubs. I agree, that's just crazy, and Cubs fans who look for excuses to go to games are starting not to show up. Sox fans look for excuses not to go to games. Can't go, the seats are blue. Can't go, I bought a $10 ticket and they won't give me access to the first row behind the dugout. Can't go, they are in first place, but it's not "sustained success". If they had a good team 2 years ago, I would probably go, but not if they are good just this year. Can't go, they change the pre-game video. And 2 complaints that were actually on WSI, can't go, the fireworks aren't loud enough. Can't go, the usher doesn't smile at me every time I pass.

Interesting they had an article in one of the papers yesterday with the Cubs rebuilding. The title was "Where have all the Cubs Fans Gone" If this happens when the Cubs are "rebuilding", what would happen when if the White Sox pulled the plug and decided not to be competitive for at least a few years? http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2013-05...-rooftop-owners Again, will one of you who thinks rebuilding is the only way give me one reason to think it would work with the guys like KW, Hahn, Buddy Bell calling the shots? Wilder was a crook, but the funny thing is, his fake players he used to line his pockets aren't much worse than the real ones these guys praise year after year who turn into nothing.

QUOTE (The Ginger Kid @ May 8, 2013 -> 11:23 AM) There's probably some discussion of this in the 26 pages of this thread which i'm not going to read, but what does the rotation look like with Danks? Is he better than Axelrod or Santiago? Would Danks accept a role as the long man in the pen until his shoulder is back to full strength? I would think the Sox would want him on a regular schedule, but if it came down to it, Danks doesn't come across as a primma donna type who would kick and scream if he were placed into that role.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 8, 2013 -> 10:56 AM) If this team really proves to be as bad as people think, we aren't going out and adding top free agents. That doesn't even make any sense. If this is really a 90 loss team, we are getting bunches of minor leaguers from other teams for our vets. We aren't adding a McCann, Utley, or anyone else making 8 figures annually. The problem with that is the Sox don't have many guys for whom they can get really good prospects. The Simon Castro types are the best they can hope for except for Sale and perhaps Peavy, and if you trade those guys, then you are right, and the Sox will be bad for years, and several people on this site will be very happy. If they keep their pitching intact, they just need a couple bats to be contending again. This team right now, if they could score, would be pretty good. Even the biggest pessimists couldn't see the offense slip this far. I do think they are far better off having to look for bats than for arms. I hope they don't ruin that strength.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ May 8, 2013 -> 10:40 AM) By the way, with all the talk of McCann, just want to throw out there... Phegley has a .318/.402/.588 line and a reasonable K rate down in Charlotte this year. He's been healthy for a few years straight now (which was the biggest concern with him), and reports are that his defense has improved a lot. He's 25, but this is a guy who was a 1st round Supplemental pick. Don't count him out as a possibility for 2014 if he keeps this up. I would imagine Phegley is just about to get a shot. If they want to be "fair" to Flowers, I would say give him a couple more weeks to see if he can turn it around, but 27 year olds with lifetime batting aberages under .200 generally don't become solid hitters. At the very least, bring up Phegley and see what he can do in Gimenez's spot. It's not like the Sox are losing anything there even if Phegley can't play. Hahn has to be at the point where he has to do something, and Phegley seems the easiest and most logical.

Back in the day, it wasn't uncommon for the upper deck to be closed at Wrigley Field, and in certain sections of the old Comiskey Park.