Dick Allen

If Konerko came back and was healthy with the hand and the oblique, and hit like he normally does, if everyone stays where they are at, it will be a cakewalk to an AL Central title.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 1, 2008 -> 11:27 PM) Seriously Dick, you're being a drama queen here. That contract is not a huge albatross. That contract makes up less than 2% of the team's 08' payroll. As I said earlier, it certainly is not ideal or optimal, but considering where some of our other payroll is going to this year, I don't think it is going to in any way seriously handicap us. I mean, come on Dick, $2 million a year is a really negligible number by baseball standards. Its $3 million next year for a middle reliever who chances are will be in AAA. He'll be out of options, so I guess chances are he'll be in AAA or watching television. Up until Linebrink and Dotel, KW didn't pay $3 million to a reliever. MacDougal is nowhere near that class. I didn't say it was an albatross to the White Sox BTW, although I'm quite positive if some GM called KW and said he would assume the entire contract, KW would do cartwheels. I said it was a huge albatross in trying to move him. Its just another reason besides his performance why he has no value.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 1, 2008 -> 04:44 PM) This thread long-ago left the original topic, why stop now? Honestly, there should be at least a salary floor if there is not going to be a salary cap... The union doesn't want a salary floor because they believe that would be a precursor to a salary cap.

QUOTE (scenario @ Jul 1, 2008 -> 04:54 PM) Hmm... Javy had a 3.07 ERA last September... a 3.74 season ERA.. and a 3.57 ERA at the Cell And if you look at Javy's career splits, September is his best month with a 3.66 career ERA So what's the concern about his September numbers or his ERA outside of Montreal? Javy has generally been on non contenders. Teams that play against half a line-up of AAA call ups in September. 2004 is the only time he was on a playoff team and his September ERA was over 6.00. In no way do I think Garcia is better now than Vazquez, but Freddy has put up big numbers when it mattered. If he happened to be 100% healthy, there is no way Garcia isn't better than Vazquez. Freddy just will never be that way again IMO, but I'm sure the White Sox are keeping close tabs and I think unless someone offers him good money, he will eventually sign with the Sox.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 1, 2008 -> 04:26 PM) Yeah, I just think you're way off-base here in claiming that Mac's contract is some albatross or something. Certainly it's not optimal to pay a minor league pitcher $2 million per year, but there have been far worse atrocities committed upon payrolls. The difference between $2 million and say, $400k is not as much as you are claiming for a big league team. Its a huge albatross. The guy can't prove he can pitch effectively in AAA, has $1 million left to be paid this year, $2.65 million guaranteed next year with a $350k buyout. So you owe him $4 million right now. Approximately the same amount KW was able to sign Ramirez for 4 seasons. Why would a team give up anything of value and assume that contract taking into account his struggles this year and last and the huge injury risk he will always be? KW barely paid his ENTIRE bullpen $4 million when he was defending a world title.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 1, 2008 -> 04:00 PM) Yeah, see him. He's not doing too badly right now. If Aardsma had MacDougal's contract last winter, Boston wouldn't have traded for him.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 1, 2008 -> 03:57 PM) Have you guys not been watching the crap that teams are picking up in terms of relief arms over the last several years? They'll take anyone who's ever done anything who could possibly do something again. We signed ESTEBAN LOAIZA for the love of god! And Dick, why would we bring him up to the big league team if he's not corrected his problems yet? Simply because he has been a disaster for a year now doesn't mean he won't ever become something again. And while he is making $2 million this season, it's worth more to the club to hold onto him and hope he figures things out again than to DFA him. No one is claiming he's going to be traded for a top prospect; however, he certainly has some value to a team that thinks a change of scenery might serve him well. We all know he would be a guy the Sox would be looking into if he was in another organization having these problems right now... The point I am making is not only is he making $2 million this year, he is making $2 million next year as well. He stunk last year, wasn't good at the major league level this year, and has been horrid in Charlotte. No team is going to give you anything of value for him now. Loaisa was signed to a minimum pro-rated contract. No one would have picked him up if it meant paying him what is left on MacDougal's contract, let alone give up anything of even slight value for that honor. MacDougal has no value. Maybe he will in the future if he can get things straightened out, but to say he has some now is crazy.

QUOTE (BearSox @ Jul 1, 2008 -> 02:42 PM) Jumping in late here, and while his value is not through the roof, MacDougal still has value, and could be a key piece as a throw in a deal. Too many underestimate the value of pitchers with MacDougals stuff. Every team in the league would be willing to take a chance on him. Look at Aardsma, he was as bad, if not worse than MacDougal last year and we did get two borderline decent prospects for him. While we didn't get much for Aardsma, we still got more for him than what we did for Iguchi last year. With the way some people act, you'd think people with MacDougal's stuff grows on trees. They got crap for Aardsma, and MacDougal stinking AAA up would mean they would even less for him. Why would someone want to give up anything of value for a guy doing what he is doing in AAA in order to see if he can help them win in the major leagues right now? If anyone offered KW anything of value for MacDougal, he would be gone by now.. Don't forget, he also is signed through next season for a couple million a year I believe, far more money than Aardsma was getting.

QUOTE (beautox @ Jul 1, 2008 -> 02:57 PM) two seasons? we acquired him in '06 and he was above average for us, last year the wheels came off for him and Matt Thornton; Matt has been able to put it back together. MacDougal has more ML experience and success than him, like shack said: someone with his arm, past success and contract has some value. Lastly i said June; and i didnt even say tearing it up hes been ok. Yes 2 seasons. 2007 and 2008. He has no value or the White Sox wouldn't be paying him millions to pitch in Charlotte. MacDougal couldn't repeat a delivery to save his life, so he can't throw strikes. He has nice "stuff", but it doesn't matter because of his total lack of control. If he's so good, maybe the White Sox should call him up and start throwing him in the 7th and 8th innings. I doubt you would think that is a good idea. Why would it be for any other team looking to win?

QUOTE (beautox @ Jul 1, 2008 -> 01:36 PM) Insurance Troy Percival and Al Reyes are huge injury risks not to mention Reyes fell apart after the ASB last year; add into the equation Wheeler is just one year removed from this line 1.34WHIP & 5.30 ERA, Niemann will be thrown into a bullpen on a first place team with very little experience and Salas is off the PEDs, and you have a recipe for a front office looking for cheap insurance that might catch lightning in the bottle going forward. MacDougal hadn't been horrible down at AAA in June not great by any stretch but not bad either, the rays dont want to deal a top prospect for fuentes. Maybe we could get a Tweener like Fernando Perez for Mac and Uribe and a bit of cash. What kind of insurance is a guy who has shown the last 2 seasons he can't handle the major leagues. Its funny on this board how guys get trashed and most rightfully so, then when it comes time for a trade, the same people trashing these players think they have value. MacDougal has none. If he did, he would be at USCF right now.

With all the "W" flags I've noticed flying around in my neighborhood, I decided to buy an "L" flag. I have it flying proudly right now.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jun 26, 2008 -> 09:39 PM) I would like to know the specifics on the exact details of Thome's option for next year. I've seen conflicting reports, some saying the Phillies only paid 22 mill over 3 years and some say 22 mill over 4. If it's 4, cutting Thome loose would be a terrible move IMO; if it's only 3, then it's an entirely different story and he should be cut loose, though a big bat should still be brought in regardless. $22 million=$22 million. Whether they paid the White Sox off in 3 or 4 years isn't very significant. In fact, it probably is better if it were only 3. As I understand it, when a team agrees to pick up part of a contract, they just give money to the other team, so its not like Philadelphia is actually paying Thome. Its not like they are sending the Sox money every payday. The White Sox can spend that money on whatever they like. There was no way that option was going to vest. I think if Thome plays decently the last 3 months, he will be back, but it will be a reduced rate.

QUOTE (the People's Champ @ Jun 23, 2008 -> 02:26 PM) The difference is, I have nothing invested in him. I'm not hanging on to the tiny shread of hope that this kid may, MAY, just one day get it. I have the easy job. I can just wash my hands of him because I have nothing to lose. That's the difference, smart guy! But other teams don't have anything invested in him and you are suggesting that they will give up something of value for him. So you must know more than the other teams.

QUOTE (scenario @ Jun 22, 2008 -> 05:55 PM) The hairiest 16 year old in the world... that's not an image I want stuck in my brain BearSox. Sure there are exceptions. But think about it... People you know who are seniors in high school... People you know who are seniors in college... Can you generally tell the difference? It's not just 'look'. Those 4 years (17-21) usually result in some significant and obvious differences that are not hard for people to pick up on. Usually, but not always. One of my best friends was buying alcohol at 14 not ever getting carded. I also know a 44 year old woman who could easily pass for an 18 year old. A 21 year old could easily look 17 or 18, and vice versa.

QUOTE (LosMediasBlancas @ Jun 22, 2008 -> 10:03 PM) Give the Cubs some credit. Swept us minus Soriano and Zambrano. Long way to go still, but they look good. i'm pretty sure the Cubs have taken 9 out of the last 10 in this series,

Javy Vazquez showed again tonight why he cannot ever be considered a #1 pitcher. The first 8 pitches out of the zone? Ridiculous.

QUOTE (chw42 @ Jun 21, 2008 -> 08:05 PM) Minnesota won again. We're 2.5 up, maybe this is a must-win... Only a 2.5 game lead with 88 or 89 remaining. I think the Sox almost have to win out if they really have any playoff aspirations.

Carlos Zambrano has an interesting take on the Sox/Cubs rivalry from Chicagosports.com: I don’t like to pitch in American League ballparks,” he said. “I feel bored. The games are too long. I like the National League. You’re competing and you do something for yourself. No one has to come in for me and do the DH part. I like to compete and play against the White Sox. It’s good. Every time I go to U.S. Cellular, or Comiskey, or whatever is the name of the ballpark, people starts screaming at you and saying all kinds of things, calling you all kind of things. “That’s good. They say something like ‘Homosexual.’ Sometimes I’m in the outfield and they say bad words. ‘You’re a homosexual.’ I say ‘I’m going to show him I’m (not) a homosexual on the mound.’ That’s kind of like a good feeling between the Cubs and the Sox.”

QUOTE (joesaiditstrue @ Jun 21, 2008 -> 03:12 PM) this is pretty funny. it's clear brian anderson isn't good. he constantly fails in situations where all he needs to do is make contact. it's happened multiple times this year. he also, most of the time, looks clueless with a bat in his hands (which leads to his failure in advancing runners) but he's better than DeWayne, because DeWayne has had limited at-bats. Got it. What's funniest is Dwayne Wise is a much better hitter than BA. He hit a homer today. Screw his past in the big leagues, forget his age. Who cares if nobody claimed him on waivers thus were not willing to pay him slightly more than minimum to play for them.

QUOTE (whitesoxbrian @ Jun 21, 2008 -> 02:50 PM) We aren't looking for an answer- we're looking for just average-solid play in the field and in the batter's box. Sure, Anderson is 10 notches higher than Wise in the field, but at the dish they off-set each other. I don't care how old and how many ABs Wise has had as a major leaguer, the bottom line is, he can't be any worse then Anderson. What if he went 1-4 today and didn't hit the homer? You're pretty much basing Wise's offensive potential on 1 at bat. Wise made it through waivers without anyone claiming him. BA would be claimed.

Today was probably the least enjoyable time I have ever had at a ballpark. The Fat Boys in front of me were high fiving each other and jumping up and down on strike calls and White Sox foul balls. The Sox had the quieted for a little while, but after the 9 spot, it was brutal. I just think texting someone in between innings and then jumping up and down saying "9 runs" to yourself probably means you have a problem.

QUOTE (chw42 @ Jun 20, 2008 -> 06:40 PM) Some stupid Cubs fans or NL fans in general say the DH needs to be abolished because it favors the AL. BS, the fact that we have to have our pitchers hit is worse. At least NL teams can trot out a real hitter when they play in AL parks, we have to trot out a pitcher who gets 5 ABs a year when we play in NL parks. And one of the biggest reasons Danks was pulled today was because of the lack of the DH. I know Uribe got a hit and all, but he didn't score! Be grateful Cubs fans, so many things handed you this game. The rule should be uniform. I think it affects the visiting AL teams the most due to the fact that most DH's are integral parts of their offense.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 20, 2008 -> 06:04 PM) There are 2 totally separate issues between the yanking of Garland and the Yanking of Danks here. When the Garland yanking was at its worst, in 2002 and 2003, Garland had already piled up a bunch of innings. 190+ in both of those years. The reason to keep Danks on a tight leash is not struggling, it's health. Ask guys like Zambrano, Prior, and Wood how throwing a lot of innings early in their career has done for them, ore even how it's done for their shoulders recently. The rule of thumb with a young pitcher is you can jump their total innings up by about 30 or so per year. That number puts Danks on a 160 inning limit for this year. When Garland in 03 was still getting Yanked by Manuel every time he got in any sort of trouble, he'd thrown 190 innings the year beforehand, so the yankings then had nothing to do with keeping his innings low, it had to do with a lack of faith in the guy. Taking Danks out early today would have been similar to the Garland move if Danks allowed 2 runners in the 5th and Ozzie didn't give him a shot to finish that inning. You may want to go back to those years and look at pitch counts. You don't think health was involved with any of Manuel's decisions?

From Phil Rogers at chicagotribune.com: By pulling Danks only 85 pitches into his afternoon, Guillen was being consistent in how he has handled the 23-year-old left-hander for two seasons. He has been babied almost beyond belief, throwing 100 pitches only three times in his 15 starts this season and never even 110 in his 41 career starts. Those numbers will make old-schoolers want to throw up. But consider these numbers, as well—5.50, 2.80. Those are Danks' earned-run averages from his rookie season in 2007 and this season. The improvement is staggering. Something clearly is working in the job Guillen, pitching coach Don Cooper and others are doing in developing Danks. If the plan calls for him to be handled with kid gloves, so be it. Too much caution is always better than not enough when dealing with young pitchers, who as a group represent the most valuable assets in baseball. I have no problem with him getting yanked. Its funny neither Hawk or anyone else has really picked up on this considering this is the exact same treatment Jerry Manuel gave Garland and was ripped so much for. Its was the right move. People would have been b****ing if Danks started struggling.

QUOTE (chw42 @ Jun 20, 2008 -> 03:21 PM) That wasn't a bad decision, it's not Ozzie's fault Dotel sucked it up. Blame his offensive decisions. Not bunting with Anderson doubling and Jim Thome up? In that situation, you put in Ozuna or Wise and you bunt him over. At least get him over on a grounder to the right side. Cabrera probably could of gotten the run in with a sac fly. We had so many opportunities, screwed them all up. It's too bad Cabrera almost had a 2 run shot in the 7th, it just missed the foul pole. The White Sox are a poor bunting team. Bunting against a guy who throws as hard as Wood is difficult. I'm sure Ozzie would have liked if Thome would have made an out for it to be a grounder to the right side, but it didn't happen.