Texsox

QUOTE(KipWellsFan @ Apr 5, 2005 -> 11:49 AM) http://apnews.myway.com/article/20050405/D899BTI80.html Apparently by 2008 Americans will need passports to re-enter country from Canada, Mexico, Panama and Bermuda, and Canadians will need passports to enter. More info at link. Yikes, that will make working in Mexico an even bigger pain in the ass. Currently it's a simple two question pass "American Citizen?" "yes" "Anything to Declare?" "no" "Have a nice day . . ." Border crossing could take anywhere from 5 seconds to an hour depending on the tourist traffic, number of bridge lanes open, if you were in a Customs (slow) or Immigration (fast) staffed lane.

Apprehension numbers are down and that's a success? Wasn't the reason they are there because apprehension numbers were too low and too many illegals were entering the country? I thought it would be a sucess if MORE illegals were being caught. If after they leave, the Border Patrol doesn't catch anyone, would it mean the protest was a success and no one is crossing anymore? Could it be while the Border Patrol is checking on sensors tripped by the Minutemen, illegals are getting past?

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Apr 5, 2005 -> 11:42 AM) The Pope's would be assasin wants to attend his funeral http://www.drudgereport.com/flash3ps.htm Watch it on tv like everyone else. :banghead I'm certain there are a lot of convicted criminals that would like a get out of jail for a day cards.

Actually it could speed crossing for people who cross everyday. I know the Hidalgo Bridge has been scheduled to test out a kind of easy pass lane with an electronic indicator which would allow users to by-pass the Customs or Border Patrol stops. If they increase that program for frequent crossers, that would give them time to check the passports or US ID for everyone else. Found this quote http://edition.cnn.com/2001/US/12/12/rec.canada.border/

IIRC didn't Carter make an unflattering remark about Catholics?

QUOTE(TheBigHurt35 @ Apr 5, 2005 -> 11:10 AM) That's true, but I don't see how having to own a passport will change that. Even now, one still has to go through customs. Hell, I've even been held for 20 minutes and had my car searched entering Detroit a few years ago. I don't know what Canadian passports cost, but American ones are about $90 and take about two months to get. Not exactly financially-crippling. And they're good for a decade. What it will do is stop the casual shopper. When Mexico increased their fee for an interior visa from under $10 to almost $60 person, plus a vehicle import permit, I decided I didn't need to bring the family to Monterrey anymore. As a Canadian, using the American cost of $90 per person; $280 for a family of four is stupid to spend for a day in the US. It also adds $280 to the cost of a vacation for that family. Although I am certain American pharmacies are hoping Canada retaliates and requires Americans to buy passports as well. I'm a pro business conservative and this stuff seems short sighted. We are harming ourselves more than helping.

QUOTE(KipWellsFan @ Apr 5, 2005 -> 10:49 AM) Women should be in the kitchen, where they belong. that's why their feet are smaller, so they can get closer to the sink

The downside to this is millions of people everyday cross these borders for work and play. It hurts the local economies when shoppers cannot reach the stores. Tourism is one of the few areas of our economy that continues to be strong. Hotels, restaurants, airlines, and other tourism industries cannot outsource these jobs to China, Mexico, and other countries. More at link

Let's look at the good and bad these Minutemen Volunteer Patriots (MVPs) have brought. Good It has focused attention on a problem area, that hopefully will result in some immigration reform. Bad It has diverted resources normally used to fight smuggling, and pulled officers off known smuggling routes, to investigate the protesters when they trip sensors. It has cost the Border Patrol money to watch these MVPs and keep them safe. Again diverting resources that are already stretched too thin. It has insulted the outstanding officers in the US Border Patrol. Imagine if we did that to a US serviceman in Iraq. What is their lasting effect? In a month they go home and nothing has really changed. What really needs to be done: A sane government policy which allows our agriculture industry to continue to produce low cost food. A sane government policy on legal tourism that recognizes Mexican nationals for investing dollars in the US by buying homes, owning stock, and owning businesses. Lobby Mexico to increase the amount of merchandise a Mexican national is allowed to bring into Mexico after shopping in the US. Fund Border Patrol and be certain they have the tools to do their jobs. Imagine how secure our border would be if a few billion dollars were invested there instead if Iraq. __________ We have thrived with the longest unsecured borders in the world because we have adopted policies that benefit not only the US, but our neighbors as well. There have been more terrorists attacks by people from Michigan then Mexicans in the past 100 years.

QUOTE(YASNY @ Apr 5, 2005 -> 08:56 AM) The fact remains ... as of right now they are not vigilantes. OK, call them what you will. Let's use the title they prefer Minutemen. The Minutemen do not believe the US Government is doing enough to protect our borders and they need to come to America's defense. Would that be a fair statement? Here is part of one of these group's mission statement They talk about a synchronized offense. Can we call them vigilantes?

QUOTE(YASNY @ Apr 5, 2005 -> 08:53 AM) You have repeatedly called these people vigilantes through this thread. I have not argued any points of yours or the justifications for your opinions. They are all valid. I am, however, pointing out the facts, as things currently stand that these people are neither vigilantes nor criminals. That is the crux of my argument. Why can't you accept a fact as a fact until it no longer is a fact? And ... I'll give you this .. it very well could become as you expect it to. I called them vigilantes because that was the term being used. It was in the thread title, it was in the articles, and was what Border Patrol calls them.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Apr 5, 2005 -> 08:05 AM) ChiSoxy, isn't some of this more a linguistic issue than a sex act definition? QUOTE(RibbieRubarb @ Apr 5, 2005 -> 08:49 AM) I agree. These kids seem like Cunning Linguists!

Interesting point regarding the narrowing of the definition places homosexual acts out side of what sex is. I guess we are heading towards a definition that sex is the act that could result in pregnancy. Perhaps penetration with a condom will someday not be sex? Will a new word spring up to describe acts that lead to an orgasm that do not involve penis~vaginal contact?

GOD isn't spelled G.O.P.

QUOTE(YASNY @ Apr 5, 2005 -> 08:15 AM) You are so anxious to label these citizens as vigilantes or criminals without any solid justification whatsoever. Pure speculation is all you have. It's petty politics because you disagree with them. Speculation? Fair enough. But . . . I also have 8 years of living on the border and seeing these groups come and go. I have 6 years working with the local Chambers of Commerce, manufacturing groups, listening to campaign speeches, looking at initiatives to help the border region, talking with friends who are Border Patrol agents and Customs agents, crossing the International bridge daily, working in Mexico, having friends who are Mexican-Americans, non-resident aliens, and regular tourists. This isn't a new issue for me. (legal and illegal crossing) It is vital to the economy of the border region. The new Laser Visa cost Valley businesses hundreds of thousands of dollars in lost business when it was first introduced. I am a conservative law and order type guy. When our law enforcement agencies report these guys getting in the way, tripping alarms, and harassing honest citizens, I agree with law enforcement. I never understood protesters who called police officers pigs and all that in the 60s. Vigilantes? I didn't start the thread, it is the thread title that southsider gave it, (who thinks I'm dead wrong on this), and is what law enforcement is calling these guys. I like being on the side of our men in blue. Dedicated officers who patrol these lonely stretches of wilderness. If you prefer a different label for these volunteers, I'll use it. How is it helping that Border Patrol has to investigate the sensors that these Brave American Patriot Volunteers are tripping? The Border Patrol stops over 500,000 illegals along that stretch each year. Do you think they are going to catch more or less with these guys driving around and tripping sensors and pulling officers off their regular duties?

QUOTE(YASNY @ Apr 5, 2005 -> 07:19 AM) Tennessee's most scandalous senator now facing serious investigation Then, at the end, they play the race card. Unreal. :headshake :headshake how does this guy keep getting elected? Amazing. I think this actually shows how Delay is so much better at this stuff. Delay does this on a national scale and emerges unscathed. This guy is doing local stuff. Maybe with some time he could be groomed to take on delay.

QUOTE(TheBigHurt35 @ Apr 5, 2005 -> 07:04 AM) There's no doubt that, regardless of who is in office now, the President would attend John Paul II's funeral for "political" reasons. That's a political reality that would apply to attending the funeral of any massive international figure. That said, I'm dismayed by the cynical attitude that Bush would only attend the funeral for political reasons. Bush is a devout Christian... why wouldn't he want to attend the funeral of, arguably, the most important and influential Christian of the 20th Century? (Apologies to MLK.) Hell, I'd bet that the vast majority of Christians here would be happy to take time out of their "busy schedule" to attend JP II's funeral (with the government taking care of food and travel expenses, of course). There is a major split in Christianity between Protestant religions and Catholicism. In some Christian circles the Catholic faith is considered a cult and they will run through how to spot a cult. Charismatic, all knowing leader, rituals, etc. So while Bush will gain in some circles, he will lose in others. There are many world leaders that have died and we send VPs, Ambassadors, and other dignitaries. The White House has to evaluate every nuance of the situation for diplomatic factors (will it piss off an ally?) domestic (what's happening and yes political gain/loss), security, and a myriad of other issues. Did Bush attend Arafat's funeral? He was a massive international figure. Not putting them on the same plane, but there are just so many issues before a President can go. Remember he missed both of his daughters college graduation. I am certain he would have liked to be there.

ChiSoxy, isn't some of this more a linguistic issue than a sex act definition? Look at words that have sexual connotation and how this generation has altered the meanings gay and pimp come to mind. Could the research actually be pointing to a narrowing of what the word "sex" means, and not a narrowing of what the sexual act is? There may not be an lessening of moral boundaries, this doesn't necessarily mean that oral sex has become any more common. I know I'm not being clear. Look at the word gay. At one point, it meant happy and cheerful. Then it was used to describe a homosexual. Now in some corners it is used to mean stupid. A "gay" act could mean throwing a party, same gender sex, or doing something stupid. If researchers published a study that adolescents are reporting not being as gay as they previously where, it could have very different meaning depending on what year the survey was conducted. But it might not mean they were any less happy, stupid, or sexually active.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Apr 5, 2005 -> 07:24 AM) I'm wondering why they need guns? Most of these guys are from out of state, I wonder what Arizona's laws are in regard to concealed weapons. We have a reciprocal agreement with a few states in Texas which would make it legal to carry if you have a permit from one of those states.

QUOTE(YASNY @ Apr 5, 2005 -> 07:23 AM) Well, perhaps those earlier groups were vigilantes. As of now, this group is not. I'm wondering why they need guns?

QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Apr 4, 2005 -> 11:31 PM) I just have a chart near the door. I randomly change the color of said chart to give my outdated electronics a false sense of security. from the home security system thread.

QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Apr 4, 2005 -> 11:31 PM) I just have a chart near the door. I randomly change the color of said chart to give my outdated electronics a false sense of security.

QUOTE(YASNY @ Apr 5, 2005 -> 03:34 AM) As of yet, they have not taken the law into their own hands. They are reporting illegal activity to the proper authorities .... as any good American citizen should do. The group currently in the news is not the only group that has done this. There are or have been many more. I guess that is part of the debate here, this isn't anything new to the border. These guys are just better at promotion and since 9/11 they have wrapped themselves up in the American flag.

The Pope v. Britney Spears Care to guess before looking?

QUOTE(DonkeyKongerko @ Apr 4, 2005 -> 06:07 PM) How scientific is this though? I would also guess that boys are more likely to admit to performing oral sex and even lying about it than girls. I would guess more guys would lie about receiving than giving.