caulfield12

I do think the point that Richard might have a very good NL career (like Kip Wells did for awhile, and Josh Fogg, too) while the White Sox are continuing to struggle to man the 5th spot (of course, that's only WITHOUT a Peavy return in 2009) can later be used against KW. But, once again, that's only if Peavy blows out his elbow or something. And the insurance/contract we picked up from the Padres mitigates the risk factor, just like we got back about $5-6 million instead of eating David Wells' 2001 contract completely. Giving up RUSSELL was nothing at all...just a name that makes the trade look bigger, and possibly sad to those wallowing in 06/07 top prospect lists for the White Sox and believing he was actually a legit, TOP 10 prospect with most other organizations. Basically a one-pitch pitcher with so-so mechanics and much less valuable as a reliever than limited starter (like Poreda, except RHed). But if two of those three pitchers (think of Carter like a lesser version of Faustino DeLosSantos) excel, KW will never hear the end of it....UNLESS, of course, we win the World Series. In which case KW is back to being a genius and maybe having his own "revenge" book to answer Moneyball with Denzel as KW. LOL.

And Ozzie and KW agree with you, too. End of story and thread. Next year...maybe an interesting question to discuss...assuming Fields could be an 775-850 OPS 3B and not commit 25+ errors in the process.

http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/batting/_/pos...asePct/minpa/25 Look at Getz's OBP since the ASB, .382 and 6th in the AL during that time period! http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/batting/_/pos...asePct/minpa/25 ALSO, 6th in OPS. So better than AL average. Interesting argument here...all things considered, unless there's a CLEARLY better option, the INCREDIBLE affordability of Beckham, Getz, Nix and Alexei Ramirez give us many/multiple options around the rest of the payroll (starting rotation, bullpen, outfield, etc.) Imagine if we did have Brandon Allen/Viciedo/Fields paired with those four youngsters? Probably the most productive efficiency in all of baseball for cost of production...in any MLB infield. Finding better...impossible. The only weaknesses we have going forward are the 5th starter slot (until Peavy comes back), defense, health/age/range of outfield and the bullpen, which started out the 2009 season as our main area of strength the first 2-3 months of the season and has become something of a weakness recently.

Beckham would trail only Ben Zobrist in AL at 2B in OPS. Right now, he's fifth (860) behind Michael Young (so-so defensively despite GG), A-Rod, Longoria and Aybar (also limited defensively). So the argument that Rolen at 3B with Beckham at 2B is much better than Beckham/Getz has some merit, unless you consider the financial cost and the players that bringing in Rolen AND Peavy would prevent us from adding or resigning (CF, leadoff, Dye/Thome, LF/RF, etc., bullpen). Getz would be something like 14th out of 15 players (ahead of only CLE's Valbuena and also Casilla/Tolbert, who didn't have enough to qualify)... STILL, Getz's skill set (speed, doing little things, fundamentals, hustle...plus his cheap/affordable contract and production)....make him much more attractive and valuable to the WHITE SOX, especially if he can increase his OBP 15-35 points. ALEXEI is still sixth (out of 16) AL shortstops in what is a down year for him compared to his rookie campaign). http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/batting/_/pos...t/OPS/minpa/200 If he was putting up last year's numbers, he'd be RIGHT up there with everyone in the AL except for Bartlett (is this season an anomaly or repeatable?), Jeter and COMPARABLE with Scutaro, Asdrubal Cabrera and Erick Aybar. http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/batting/_/pos.../true/minpa/200 Getz at .340-.350 OPS becomes better than AL average and a much more palatable line-up option for Ozzie and KW...and I think he's definitely right there in that territory since the ASB, correct, as he has grown more and more comfortable in 2009.

$6.5-7.5 million, maybe $8 million tops (behind Papelbon) is pretty accurate as a guesstimate for Bobby Jenks in ARB, unless he completely tanks over the remainder of the season and loses the closer's role or doesn't recover quickly from his kidney stones (and they're a b****, I had them once...I understand him blowing those saves a bit better now, sometimes the pain is so great and your back hurts so much that you throw up from the pain, even if you have nothing in your stomach, it's that debilitating).

QUOTE (bmags @ Aug 3, 2009 -> 01:10 PM) Not a fan of this article. It was a weird way to frame the salary argument. Why bring up Carlos Lee as your example when he is meeting expectations, and therefore, arguably, living up to the numbers on his deal. Why not bring up a real suck contract with a bad player. It would have been stronger to say the money from Carlos Lee's contract brought a championship that Valentin, Lee, Ordonez and Thomas (out for most of that season) didn't.... Carlos LEE

QUOTE (Princess Dye @ Aug 3, 2009 -> 12:32 PM) Richard's ceiling appears to be that of solid #3 starter Poreda, now that he's away from the team that drafted him, is going to start being looked at as bullpen-type because of his makeup Obviously we cant judge the deal yet, but the guys we sent are replaceable. Peavy does some things that are very hard to find, and JR gets to take on that type of starter with his preferred method -- 4 year contract or less. His point about the big contract is a good one, but we're the kind of team that has to overpay anyway. I would rather have this on the books than have another one of those offseasons where FAs turn us down and we have to settle for Nick Swisher. Actually, we underpaid Dye, Buehrle, Konerko, Alexei Ramirez, Viciedo, etc. All had bigger offers from other teams, or would have had them on the free or open market. The thing the author totally discounts is the positive affect on the fanbase, increased attendance (not quite the Halladay affect in TOR, but it will be interesting to see attendance in his home starts versus other starters, especially his first 2-3 starts), increased season ticket renewals for 2010, etc. In other words, renewed positive optimism for the future of this ballclub. Peavy, GQCQ and Beckham, for example....can sell tickets in a way that Richard or Poreda never could dream of. You're not a former Cy Young winner for nothing, and I like the "shot across the bow" aspect of ramming it down the throat of a Cubs' franchise that is very much paralyzed financially. Even if he is DEBATABLY overpaid by $3-4 million per year at the back end, I think he more than compensates by generating additional revenues, goodwill from other free agents that will give the Sox extra consideration now (someone like Figgins)...the type of starting rotation we have, of course other players would love to play here.

QUOTE (Pumpkin Escobar @ Aug 3, 2009 -> 10:00 AM) Anyone see us floating a Longoria like offer to Beckham? 6 years 13-15 mil? Not quite yet. Give it one more season....not that he'll pull a Chris Young, but there's no rush. And the economy could go either way. Better to wait until everything is clarified in terms of the financial direction of the game of baseball, the White Sox and just the US economic situation in general.

Why waste Viciedo's arm at 1B? He's capable of playing LF or RF possibly...as well as 3B.

I don't know...sometimes when I see Lillibridge pictures, he reminds me of Elijah Wood's character from SIN CITY...equally creepy.

I REALLY REALLY want to start a string of threads about Willie Taveras coming here next offseason with KHP. By the way, Coco Crisp might be available again if the Royals don't keep him...exactly the kind of situation where KW will go out and take a smaller risk and bring him in for one year and see what happens...like the White Sox used to do with the revolving door of RFers in the 90's like Dave Martinez, Ellis Burks, Mike Devereaux, Lyle Mouton, Cory Snyder, Shawn Lil Abner, Matt Merullo, Pasqua, etc. TWO YEARS for CHONESTER, that's the max I would go...$16-19 million. Take it or leave it...

QUOTE (Markbilliards @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 09:21 PM) Just lost a lot of respect for Caulfield I should have known better...I have the "workout" tape of all-time with that soundtrack. My favorite, Eye of the Tiger, of course. Brigitte Nielsen used to be "hot" but she's so horrible now...and Dolph Lundgren always reminds me of the time when he, Seagal, and Jean Claude Van Damme were the at the top of action genre after Stallone and AH-NULD. NOW BACK TO OUR REGULARLY SCHEDULED THREAD. Yes, so strange to see Aardsma, Masset, Frank Francisco (was our property briefly) and McDougal all prospering. Four POWER RH arms, our biggest weakness currently.

The 3 ER in 21+ IP his last three starts....hitting 94-95 MPH consistently in the middle to latter innings....and he controlled the Brewers, one of the top 2-3 offenses in the NL, for most of his SD debut start two nights ago. You could understand why players might feel "sacrificing" 3 spots starts was questionable. Of course, we won Carrasco's spot start (luckily against Mitre) and Torres pitched extremely well compared to expectations coming into that game.

Adkins Diaz Barcelo (although injuries wrecked his stuff b4 the majors) Rauch (he was never a devastating FB type of pitcher, from the beginning...but especially after the labrum tear) Poreda Ginter Corwin Malone Brian West Royce Ring Joe Valentine Danny Wright could rush it up there b4 injuries wiped him out, too. Kip Wells always had "ace" stuff, just couldn't put it all together mentally. You could argue that Buehrle, Garland (sort of ours) and Josh Fogg all enjoyed success at the big league level because of pitches other than a 4 season fastball. Richard is a good counter-example here. Just maturity and maybe his almost Ivan Drago-esque (Rocky III reference) workout regimen.

I think we have to temper the Miguel Cabrera Lite idea...but anything approximating Carlos Lee's career with the White Sox would still be a bargain for this guy. He has a great arm, which is something Lee was lacking, and he seems quicker and more agile at 3B (from what I saw in ST) than Lee or Konerko ever did...not that either were close to acceptable at that position.

IMO, they can't take long term risks with Peavy (although there seems to be insurance, like the David Wells contract, to mitigate the downside risk) AND Alex Rios both having major struggles or injury problems. Rios is paid like an All-Star caliber player, and he hasn't been that for quite some time now. There are many more palatable options. Before, we could have used that leverage to get Rios and Rolen for very little (just taking on the contracts, basically, for salary relief/budgetary freedom for JP), but he can't afford to make himself look bad. Many writers are already calling for him to be fired, just because he didn't trade Halladay AND for the Vernon Wells and BJ Ryan contracts...not to mention Rios'.

QUOTE (Princess Dye @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 04:08 PM) I know it's not the NBA with its luxury tax, but still..... ...... we regard Linebrink as untradeable. And it's probably true. But why cant we just move him for another guy who's underperforming, perhaps on a slightly more palatable deal? You never see those deals in MLB. Borchard for Matt Thornton... Anderson for Kotsay Broadway for Castro

Trading Jenks for Crawford makes very little sense, to the Rays. How could they afford to pay a closer $8 million (plus) for only two seasons under their control when they can't afford Crawford, one of the most popular and likeable players in franchise history, for just one season? Yeah, I get that they might have more depth in the outfield than at the back of the bullpen, and that just sticking Grant Balfour into that role won't necessarily work out wonderfully, but I would be hugely concerned in the Rays' FO about acquiring someone with his medical history and with a seemingly declining fastball...despite his wonderful assortment of pitches and devastating offspeed stuff when he's on and has almost complete command. You give up Crawford for Joe Nathan (one or two years), but not Bobby Jenks. There are too many other comparable options that are less risky, someone like Jose Valverde comes to mind.

QUOTE (SoxFan1 @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 03:25 PM) He hit 95 today, he's certainly not done. He just need to improve his control and get some confidence back. But is it an arrow-straight 95 like Aardsma, Embree and Koch? Movement, command/location and getting ahead in counts is always the key out of the pen, and having a second pitch with a 10+ MPH differential from the FB...unless you're Mo Rivera.

Supposedly, his fastball is in the 91-94 MPH range still, right? I haven't seen him pitch live or on t.v. in at least two months, though. Has he thrown too many sliders or is he getting hit on the FB? Location? Arm/shoulder issue? Confidence/psychological? All of the above? On the surface, he looks like a decent reliever, strictly going by the numbers. But the reality is far different sometimes from the statistics...which is why baseball is such an interesting game to follow.

Or will his arm rebound at some poin in the future? Should we shut him down for 2-3 weeks and hope he can bounce back? Will Nunez and Pena supplant him? Thankfully, with Contreras, MacDougal and Dotel coming off the books, this is really the only BAD contract KW now has to worry about...with Konerko really rebounding well this season from an injury-prone 2008 (wrist/hand, oblique pull) to have perhaps the most consistent offensive output of his career.

Farmer said that was the fastest a leadoff triple dissolved into nothing that he'd ever seen in his broadcasting career. Probably not our day. You just can't "expect" to sweep the Yankees four in a row. Maybe they're relaxing with the Twins and Tigers already having lost.

Ummm...Joe Crede and Orlando Cabrera to the Twins, as predicted in the offseason.

QUOTE (knightni @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 10:16 AM) Sir, may I see your man card? *rip* Next you will ask me to see "I Love You, Man!" or "Yes, Man" Please don't, lol

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 10:11 AM) Maybe he can sing the national anthem instead of Liz Phair..... Liz Phair is cuter and rocks for an "old chick" IMHO. Ten years ago, I had a really big crush on her...like Sarah McLachlan, too. Maybe the only SoxTalk member to go to Lilith Fair???