Chicago White Sox

Hawkins 1/3 with HR #17. Only 1 K on the day.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Jul 21, 2013 -> 06:07 PM) If the Sox could get Castellanos for Reed and even Crain they should do it. There's no doubt we would. It's not like we've never traded with divisional oppenents before. And I get that Detroit is a little different than say the Royals or Twins, but if you can land an elite prospect for a reliever you do it every time regardless of who you are trading with.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 21, 2013 -> 04:49 PM) You do know the Sox were 11th in the AL in OBP when they did win the WS? And hit 200 HRs and stole 137 bases, which helped make up for their below average OBP. The 2005 offense wasn't great by any means, but it was at least respectable. They had enough power and speed (along with an elite bullpen) to win close games. You can spin it however you want, but this year's offense entered today dead last in the AL in runs scored. They also happen to be 2nd to last in team OBP and I don't think that's a coincidence. That may work for you, but it doesn't work for me and I'm confident that Hahn feels the same way.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 21, 2013 -> 04:00 PM) If the White Sox don't get "too much" back for Addison Reed, who is young, effective, and years away from being expensive, then there's zero reason to trade him. If Reed is traded, people should say "man, why did that team give up that prospect for a closer". If that's not the reaction, then Reed should not be traded. Agree 100%. There's no reason to move Reed unless you get a ton back for him.

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Jul 21, 2013 -> 10:42 AM) Appears to me there's less teams willing to part with prospects and take on salary. Even the Yankees are trying to be fiscally responsible though they have been replaced by the Dodgers as the big spenders of the days. Sox most likely won't deal within the division. Boston and Arizona are clinging to prospects. The Angels seem pretty quiet though they might be a team to spend money but have as bad a farm as the Sox. Giants farm is bad too. Braves farm is bleh. The best farms are Arizona, Tampa Bay, Pittsburgh, Red Sox, Cardinals and Rangers among the contenders. Everyone selling is pretty much targeting those teams. Getting anything significant from any team besides those 6 will be difficult. Nationals ,Yankees, and Dodgers after that. D'backs, TB , Orioles, and Pirates would all require the Sox to chip in more morey than the Sox probably want to. Yankees could use Dunn bad, Hafner is close to being released but the Yanks are dealing with A-Rod and what he might bring to the table. Cards seem pretty content with what they have though Peavy may be a guy they want. Some of those farm teams strength are pitching but the Sox are more likely looking for position talent. Peavy and Crain and Lindstrom probably will be easiest to move. Crain is hurt and Lindstrom won't get us much. Peavy is the one piece the Sox need to get a real good return from. After that its a crap shoot and we're either going to be disappointed with the returns we get or the lack of trades. I think we improve the odds of a better return with a blockbluster or 3 way trades and those are difficult to work out. Boston is loaded with upper level position talent and Hahn already traded Thorton to them but theyre hording those guys. Hoping they loosen up and lose a lot in the next week. I don't disagree that teams are trying their best to hold on to their prospects, but by all means this is a sellers market. There are very few teams completely out of the race and two of those teams, the Astros & Marlins, don't have much to trade in the first place. The supply of attractive players should be relatively low and the addition of the second wild card spot should inflate demand as there are now more contenders and there is a new importance in actually winning your division.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 21, 2013 -> 12:12 PM) Have you talked to Rick? Publicly he has been far more optimistic about the White Sox immediate future than anyone. Pitching is there, they need offense. The 1976 White Sox were one of the worst White Sox teams ever, the next year they were the Southside Hitmen. This year has been quite simialr to 2007, when for a decent part of the season, the Sox had the worst record in baseball. 2008, they were in the playoffs. Rick is paid to be a salesman, both in terms of selling players to opposing GMs and selling tickets to fans. He's never going to tell the full truth nor should he. I know you watch this team on a daily basis and will admit the offense is horrific. We need some big changes (more OBP & better contact) before we can truly contend for a World Series and I don't see how Hahn can disagree with that. The good news is we have assets in Peavy & Crain (and possibly others) that we can use to help improve our offense. We should also have quite a bit of money to play with over the next two offseasons. If Hahn makes the right moves, he can turn things around pretty quickly. If not, it's going to take much longer because we don't have any prospects in our system who will likely be ready before the 2015 season and we can't fill all our needs in free agency.

For whatever reason, Gonzalez isn't highly regarded by the organization. I know he's still young, but they've stopped giving him regular at-bats for a while now. Plus he'll probably need to be added to the 40 man roster in the near future, which definitely won't happen. I wouldn't expect much from him, at least not with the White Sox.

QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Jul 21, 2013 -> 11:33 AM) I for one hope we do have Rios after the trade deadline and into next year. I think he is as good an OF'er and hitter with speed as anyone we have on the team and in our system. He is in demand, but the one that we should be discussing is Viciedo. What is up with that guy? He has an above average arm and it's exciting to see him throw out baserunners but where is his hitting? Where are the homers we saw in 2012? I sure don't want to see us give up Rios for some AA prospect and then throw in cash at the same time, if in fact he is traded. Rios offensively has contributed to the Sox in a positive manner. I don't see this team in a must trade situation where we tear everything down to rebuild. Tweaking works just fine for me We have the 3rd worst record in baseball. Tweaking isn't going to solve our problems. You can keep avoiding this hard truth all you want, but thank god Rick Hahn doesn't share your optimism. Change is coming in the next 10 days and it is much needed. Having said that, we have a championship caliber rotation in place, even if we move Peavy. That's a great starting point and provides us with an opportunity to become competitive again much sooner than some people realize. However, for that to happen, Hahn needs to cash in on some assets at the deadline and acquire a couple of young bats that can be part of the core going forward. If Hahn can accomplish that and acquire a couple bats in free agency over the next two years, I think 2015 is realistic to be legit playoff contenders again. Again, the key here is acquiring two young bats that we can develop in 2014 along with Beckham, Viciedo, Phegley, & possibly Gillaspie. The sooner we have some young, cost-controlled hitters in the lineup that we can actually count on the sooner we will be competitive.

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Jul 20, 2013 -> 07:15 PM) We're all going to be very anxious in the last few days before the trade deadline. The buyers are all waiting til the last minute to get the best read on their situations. Buyers seem to have the upper hand this year. Where have you come up with this?

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 21, 2013 -> 07:06 AM) Rios' trade value isn't affected by Ventura sitting him. It is affected by Rios dogging it. My point is Rios' is probably as close to being traded as more than half the White Sox. The reports were the Sox were dissappointed in what was being discussed. Rosenthal even speculated the Sox would have to throw cash and/or a prospect to take him off their hands. I think you completely misunderstood Rosenthal's point. He's not saying we can't move Rios, which is what your "take him off their hands" comment seems to imply. He's trying to say for the Sox to get what they want, which is near major league ready position prospects, they would have to throw in money or even some lower level prospects. A team won't take on his full salary and give us that type of return. Again, that doesn't mean Rosenthal thinks we can't move him or that Rios doesn't have value. I think we all take these little twitter updates for way more than they're worth anyways. Who is leaking all this information to these writers in the first place? GMs and other front office personal with a motive to increase the demand for or hide their interest in certain players. Every one of these updates should be taken with a grain of salt, because they're all mostly bulls*** to begin with. Rather, it's better to look at supply & demand and historical deadline trends to set expectations.

I wish the woman on the phone got hit in the face.

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Jul 21, 2013 -> 02:00 AM) I'm 100% sure a full gutting of the roster doesn't take place. In fact I'd be shocked if 4 key pieces are traded . My key pieces being Peavy, Santiago, Sale, Quintana, Danks. Rios, DeAza , Viciedo, Alexei, Beckham, Phegley,Crain, Reed, Jones ,Dunn. I think it's all but certain that Crain & Peavy get moved. Same goes for Lindstrom, although he's not one of your key pieces. After that, everything is less certain. I think there's a very good chance that at least one of Rios or De Aza gets moved, and possibly both. There are quite a few corner OFs that will be available in free agency, so this wouldn't be the hardest position to replenish assuming you have some money (which we will). I just don't think they'll give either of these guys away. I also think they'll be selling hard on Ramirez. The complete loss of power is maddening and he's never going to be a high OBP guy, which is a serious team wide issue. The AVG & SBs may be nice, but his wRC+ is 80 on the season. Now, he's a strong defensive SS and that makes him valuable. I just think to fix the offense we have to clear out the unproductive hitters that don't have much potential to get better. That means a guy like Alexei should probably go, even if it hurts on the defensive side. Plus I think Hahn will be targeting SS's in any Peavy deal, so hopefully a replacement would be close to being ready. Maybe Hahn finds a way to dump Keppinger or Dunn for salary relief, but I'm not too optimistic on either front. I doubt we're selling anyone else either. I'm sure he's listening to offers on Reed and maybe even Santiago/Quintana, but Hahn would have to blown away to act on any of those players.

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Jul 20, 2013 -> 04:57 PM) Peavy done after 87 pitches? No reason to push him too hard given the situation.

Pulling Peavy after 5 has to be a Hahn call. Robin probably would've sent him out there for two more innings.

QUOTE (maxjusttyped @ Jul 20, 2013 -> 04:20 PM) There's nothing wrong with letting a player dominate in a lower level before promoting them. Letting Hawkins continue to strike out in nearly 50% of his AB's does nothing to help his long-term development. The point is if he's dominating at a low level with bad habits, then he's not really developing. While I agree in principle, a 50+% K rate is just mind-boggling and something should probably be done to help Hakwins out whether that's a demotion or a time-out.

I just hope the scouts watching this game see the type of player Rios can be when he's motivated. I know he's been in a long slump, but put him in a playoff race and I think you'll get a player much closer to the April/May version.

f***, Rios should of had that ball.

Come on double play.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 20, 2013 -> 03:50 PM) I wonder how many 27 year olds with horrible stuff and a career ERA of 5.10 get a lot of chances in today's baseball? I think he'd make a serviceable 5th starter in the NL. I don't see much potential beyond that.

QUOTE (DirtySox @ Jul 20, 2013 -> 02:09 PM) It's a player option. "$15M Player option for 2015 if he 1) has 400 IP in 2013-14, including 190 IP in 2014, and 2) is not on the disabled list at the end of the 2014 season." Wow, did not realize that. Thanks for posting.

I know it's only the first inning, but the stuff looks there for Peavy. So far so good.

Phegley making up for that dropped third strike fiasco.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Jul 20, 2013 -> 01:37 PM) This is a nice piece about Peavy's trade value by Jon Hey man. I think we could get lucky and receive a nice little haul for Peavy. http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/blog/jon-heym...the-market-star That's actually a great write-up. I'm shocked he didn't mention the 2015 option a team would have on Peavy, but the point remains the same. He's one of the top 2 starting pitchers in a thin pitching market and is more than just a rental. There should be a half dozen teams fighting over him the next 11 days.

QUOTE (staxx @ Jul 20, 2013 -> 12:01 PM) let's all pray peavy throws a nice game so he can rebuild that trade value, will be the #1 pitcher on the market once Garza goes. If he pitches well today, I think he jumps Garza.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 20, 2013 -> 11:22 AM) You know, for once, I think Marty kinda has a point. I still think the reason to trade Peavy is that the sox are already loaded with pitching, but "making sure Jake doesn't get hurt again while we're paying for him" isn't the worst reason I've ever hear. I think you're over-estimating how loaded we are with starting pitching. Sale, Peavy, Danks, Quintana, & Santiago is an excellent rotation top to bottom, there is no arguing that. However, Axelrod has shown he's no more than a #5 and quite frankly shouldn't factor in any long-term decision-making. I really like Johnson though and feel that he's ready for an opportunity, so I think we can definitely afford to move a starter. Having said that, it's not the end of the world if he starts next year in AAA. After Johnson, Rienzo is the only other prospect who's even close to being ready for a job and he may ultimately wind up as a reliever. So behind our strong rotation, we have one legit prospect, another question mark, and a fringe #5 type. That's pretty decent depth for now, but trade Peavy and it's gone pretty quickly plus you've instantly weakened your major league rotation. Again, I think we can afford trade a starter and Peavy is the ideal guy to move IMO, but if the offers don't come in where you want them to you might as well hold on to him until the offseason. You don't simply dump a #2 starter for below market value to give someone like Axelrod or Rienzo innings. You only move him if you can acquire a couple position playing prospects that can help you as soon as next year. Hopefully Peavy pitches well today, because his contract should make him the most valuable starter on the market if his rib injury is behind him.