Chicago White Sox

Sheets put up a -2 OAA in 82 innings in RF and Vaughn put up a -2 OAA in 118 RF innings. I can’t stress enough how bad these guys were out there. Using them as a RF platoon is not setting this roster up for success as too much of their offensive value will be negated by shitty defense. And you can’t look at this stuff in a vacuum as context matters. We already have a bad defensive LF in Eloy. With a halfway decent RF, you can have Robert cheat a bit to the left and limit the amount of space Eloy needs to cover. With one of two slow footed RFs, we are literally fucked.

It’s just that people lump his CF & LF/RF defense into one bucket and draw incorrect conclusions. From 2017 to 2020, he had a DRS of 6 in RF. During this same period his OAA was 4 for RF. Additionally, his UZR/150 was positive in three of these four years. Generally speaking, he’s graded out to an average or slight above RF. That matches scouting reports as well. As for this year, his defense was graded poorly, but he was injured and there is nothing predictive about one years worth of defensive metrics.

That Conforto is bad? I would definitely make the argument he’s not bad.

It’s not trading Vaughn to make room for Gavin. It’s trading Vaughn to add a cornerstone guy at a greater position of need. I get it’s easy to say “just go spend money” to fill all our holes, but that’s not remotely realistic with Jerry as owner. We desperately need another high-end pitcher and a left-handed bat of some sorts at minimum plus multiple bullpen arms. Once we run out of money, it’s going to be near impossible for us to continuing adding without subtracting from the major league roster. Again, I just don’t see how we address all our needs without tapping into our LF/1B/DH glut. Hopefully I’m wrong and Hahn finds a way to make it all work.

Exactly. For OAA, Conforto was in the 63rd percentile whereas Vaughn in the 6th. Even if you make the argument Conforto is not a good defensive OF, he’s clearly not Vaughn levels of bad.

I was reading this article earlier and thinking this is probably the Sox’s way of thinking. We know they like to move fast under normal circumstances, but this offseason places additional incentives to get your guy early if possible.

Fully agree. I love Jose so much, but having $18M to address other needs and then being able to start Vaughn at 1B, Sheets at DH, and with Grandal & Burger in the mix as needed makes it so much easier to build a compete roster.

Why is Conforto unlikely to sign here?

What if you’re getting another cornerstone type player in return, but one who provides more defensive utility? I guess I struggle to see how we fill all our needs without moving one of our LF/1B/DH types. Abreu is untradable, Eloy would be selling at his low point, and Sheets won’t get you that much in return. Just feels like Vaughn is the one guy who you can legit get value and still have a solid DH option.

I really don’t see how Vaughn survives the offseason with us unless we are going to sacrifice RF defense. Hahn has continued to stress improving the defense is critical, but that’s going to be tough if your improvements are limited to 2B. Something has got to give and I think Vaughn is the piece that gets moved because he’ll return the most value and will be attractive to the most teams.

That’s going to be some brutal OF defense and negate a lot of the value these kids provide with the bat. I’d rather use one of Vaughn/Sheets at DH and get me a real RF.

He was injured last year and that down year will be factored into the price. What would you rather do to address RF and add more balance to the lineup?

I think you’re misrepresenting Boras a bit here. He literally comes up with outlandish asks for his mega-stars and will wait out as long as possible until a team meets it. Once a team does meet that price (or comes close enough), I’m pretty sure he actually accepts without a bunch of gamemanship. And he definitely has his go to clubs for star players as he knows there are only so many clubs who can take on massive contracts late in the off-season.

While I don’t think Varsho is realistic, I do like the outside the box thinking and feel like Hahn will need to be creative this offseason.

I’m still just not sure why the Dbacks would trade him given his age / control. Marte is a much more realistic target for us. The challenge there is the only piece we have that gets you in the conversation is Vaughn and they already have a few 1B/DH types in Smith and Beer. Maybe they can be convinced Vaughn can play a passable LF long-term. Regardless, Marte is the guy we should pursuing if we’re looking for an impact player via trade.

Are you actually comparing Conforto & Semien to two dudes that cleared $300M? I fully agree that Semien is extremely unlikely, but these dudes are nothing like “Harpchado”.

Lol…you’re actually struggling with someone saying if Eloy replicated his 2020 results over a full season?

Which is exactly the point I just made.

Conforto and a pitcher makes so much more sense than Semien at that price. Can’t afford to pay him SS money and use him at 2B.

Because the fanbase was irate over the Machado fiasco and the front office wanted it to be clear that they actually made the highest bid for Wheeler without the BS option year shit that they used with Manny. But seriously, are you actually arguing they made fake offers to Wheeler? Like what exactly is the point you are trying to make here?

How often does a player accept a lower offer? Haven’t you argued in the past like 95% of free agents take the biggest offer?

Don’t think he was laughing when we made that 3/$55M offer for Keuchel, although he may laughing right now

Yeah, Rick Hahn is conducting fake negotiations in hopes of Soxtalk posters like myself citing it years later as proof they aren’t cheap ???

The Machado stuff I won’t defend because their offer wasn’t very serious IMO, at least once the Padres entered the mix. But when it comes to Wheeler, they had the highest offer on the table and lost out because of his wife’s geographical preferences. Perhaps they could of continued outbidding themselves until they reached a price point he couldn’t say no to, but I can’t fault them for that. Generally speaking it sets a bad negotiating precedent with agents you constantly work with.

I’m hoping this is sarcasm because they 100% made the offer with hopes of him accepting it