Lip Man 1

It's all about making money and JR claims you can't do that in baseball (LOL) which is why he wants his family to keep the Bulls and sell the Sox.

"The scout added that Eder might be better-suited as a middle-inning reliever unless he curbs his wildness soon." https://chicago.suntimes.com/white-sox/2023/10/25/23931316/sox-gm-chris-getz-says-pitching-prospect-jake-eder-is-close-to-the-majors

Haven't heard about this, could you link to a story or something? That makes some sense, JR would want no possible complications when he's gone and the family sells.

Not qualified...even by White Sox (low) standards

I was at Idaho State football practice this morning and my friend who is one of the athletic trainers told me he just saw an ad the Sox placed looking for an athletic trainer for the minor league system. I don't remember if they said it was to be in charge of that department or not, just that they'd be based in Phoenix (Glendale) and would travel to the different minor league affiliates. Don't know if Getz is firing more people or they are expanding the department or what. What I do know is the Sox have had a number of people come through the door the last several years as far as trainers and strength and conditioning people. Very little continuity...maybe that's part of the reason they can't go two weeks without a player getting a serious injury.

Let's test your theory. Forbes says the Sox are worth 1.75 billion, let's assume a sale would go for a round figure of two billion. Deliberately trying to devalue the franchise means JR might "only" get 1.6 billion. You don't think JR wants every dime he can get in your scenario? There is a big difference between two billion and 1.6 billion. If money doesn't matter why hasn't he sold the team already? Because as I wrote in a story in August 2022, the tax hit from capital gains would be roughly 200 million dollars and that's not even counting the Illinois state tax hit. To answer your question it is because JR is soon to be 88, his franchise continues to make loads of money despite poor results on the field and mediocre attendance due to the almost unlimited revenue streams both domestically and internationally and simply because he honestly feels HE knows best. Full stop. He tells people what to do and if they want to keep working in the organization and drawing a handsome salary they go along with things. It is simply unbelievable to think he is deliberately wrecking the franchise, He's not that insane. He genuinely thinks he is doing things the right way and that the fans, the media, certain agents simply do not matter in the least. And he isn't going to change now as he gets older. He's had this attitude of arrogance for decades, it is simply getting worse as he ages. So again, with respect...please stop.

So JR is trying to destroy the value of his franchise to justify a move? OK then... Please stop. And remember while JR holds absolute power it does state in his contract that he can be removed if he does something illegal, seems to be losing his faculties or is doing something that can be considered malfeasance. Deliberately doing something to harm the sale value of the team would certainly justify removal by the minority owners. You don't see them doing that do you? And there are NO GUARANTEES MLB would approve a move or approve the Sox moving to that city. From a business standpoint that's a tremendous risk to take...no?

October 25, 1955 - Sox co-G.M.’s Chuck Comiskey and John Rigney made their first trade; shortstop “Chico” Carrasquel and center fielder Jim Busby went to Cleveland for slugging centerfielder Larry Doby, the left-handed power hitter the Sox had been lacking the previous three years. The deal also made room in the starting lineup for a rookie shortstop from Venezuela named Luis Aparicio. Doby’s best year was 1956 when he drove in 102 RBI’s with 24 home runs. He was traded to the Orioles after the 1957 season but returned to the Sox, who bought him from the Tigers, in May 1959. That year he appeared in 21 games and hit .241 October 25, 1983 - Thanks to the most wins in the Major Leagues and a second half run among the best ever, pitcher LaMarr Hoyt won the Cy Young Award. Hoyt was 9-8 at the All-Star break then exploded to go 15-2 in the back half ending the year with a record of 24-10 and an ERA of 3.66. In addition, Hoyt pitched almost 261 innings with only 31 walks. He then threw a brilliant complete game 2-1 win over the Orioles in the A.L.C.S. in Baltimore in the first game. Hoyt became the second Sox pitcher to ever win the award following Early Wynn in 1959. He easily outdistanced the Royals Dan Quisenberry 116-81 in voting points. Hoyt won 52 games between 1981 and 1983. October 25, 1993 - Sox manager Gene Lamont, who guided the team to its first postseason appearance in 10 years, was named American League Manager of the Year by the Baseball Writers Association of America. Lamont would beat out the Yankees “Buck” Showalter for the honor. Lamont got 72 total points to Showalter’s 63. Lamont picked up eight first place votes to seven for Showalter. October 25, 2005 - Game #3 of the World Series set the record at that time for the longest game by time duration in history. The 14-inning game went 5:41 minutes in Houston and ended when another Sox role player, Geoff Blum, belted a home run giving the club the lead at 6-5. It would end 7-5 with game #2 starter Mark Buehrle picking up the save because the Sox were almost out of pitchers. The Sox rallied from a 4-0 deficit in the game against the Astros Roy Oswalt to come back for the win. That record would be broken in 2018 when Boston and the Dodgers played 18 innings lasting 7:20 minutes.

Phillies have had a hell of a run though the past two years...would love to see the Sox do something like that. Anyway maybe in about 10 days, we'll know what moves Getz is going to start making.

October 24, 2000 - Ken Williams was named the new G.M. replacing the retiring Ron Schueler. Williams, a former Sox player, would bring passion and heart to the position. He also wasn’t afraid to take risks, no matter how many times they failed. He eventually would create a World Series champion in 2005, his signature moment in the organization. He then moved upstairs as one of the team’s executive vice-presidents after the 2012 campaign before being fired due to the disaster of 2023 in late August of that same year. October 24, 2005 - The White Sox winning the pennant drew a small cover mention in Sports Illustrated. In the upper left corner was a photo of Paul Konerko swinging his bat with the caption, “At Last! The White Sox Are in the World Series.”

https://soxmachine.com/2023/10/rangers-benefit-from-shots-white-sox-didnt-take/

October 23, 2005 - Game #2 of the World Series ended in an unexpected and dramatic fashion as outfielder Scott Podsednik blasted a walk off home run after the Astros scored two runs in the ninth inning to tie the game. The shot, off Houston’s Brad Lidge, ended the game in a 7-6 White Sox win at U.S. Cellular Field. They now had a two-game lead in the best of seven series. Earlier, with the Sox losing 4-2, Paul Konerko drilled the first pitch he saw for a grand slam in the seventh inning, turning the game and perhaps the series around. October 23, 2012 – After one of the worst seasons in a century of Major League baseball, Adam Dunn, the White Sox primary DH, was named the American League winner of the Comeback Player of the Year award by The Sporting News. Dunn bounced back to hit 41 home runs and drive in 96 RBI’s for the Sox who contended for the divisional crown until the final week of the season. The previous year he only hit 11 home runs with 42 RBI’s and had a batting average of .159.

It would be interesting to know exactly how much say Brooks has in this area. Obviously he has some but if JR says "We're not doing it..." Well...there you go. Bottom line the organization as a whole simply does not want to engage with a frustrated, angry fan base at this time. Can't say I blame them but it is gutless on their part.

The so called "face of the franchise" is perfect...if you want your "face" to flip off fans, get suspended for confrontations with umpires, get dropped because of an on-field fight and has a bunch of off the field exposes. Oh and has on-field performance has collapsed badly too. I agree with you, that's no leader.

October 22, 2005 - 46 years after their last World Series, the White Sox finally got back to another one. Game #1 against Houston was played with the Sox winning 5-3 at U.S. Cellular Field. Jermaine Dye and Joe Crede hit home runs. Jose Contreras pitched seven innings and the bullpen tandem of Neal Cotts and Bobby Jenks saved the game. Those two got out of a first and third no out situation in the eighth inning to keep the Sox in the lead. They struck out Morgan Ensberg, Mike Lamb and Jeff Bagwell.

"Luck is the residue of design..." - Branch Rickey

If the Sox left Chicago I'd simply stop watching baseball, period, full stop. I would never under any circumstances become a Cub fan.

Actually, May was the selection but because he had a multi-year deal in place he should not even have been allowed to be left unprotected. The selection was voided. The Sox then hinted about the possibility of taking Fergie Jenkins whom the Cubs left unprotected. After the Sox/Cubs six player deal, with the "promise" (nudge, nudge, wink, wink...say no more) that the Sox wouldn't take Jenkins, they selected Mura. I posted this earlier in the thread. Also to answer your question, the rules in place at the time had any unprotected player put into a free agent compensation pool. A team making a pick could choose from any player in the pool regardless of what team they came from.

Morman wasn't a free agent, the Sox actually got a pick for Lemon and were able to select an unprotected free agent. Not a draft pick if I remember right. Turns out they were hinting at taking Ferguson Jenkins whom the Cubs left unprotected. Hemond swung a big deal with the Cubs and promised not to select him. Found it...they originally chose Rudy May from the Yankees but that was voided because May still had a multi year deal and should never have been put in the compensation pool. That's when word got out they were hinting at taking Jenkins. After the deal with the Cubs they then took pitcher Steve Mura from the Cardinals.

As Chet told me in his interview his immaturity forced Roland's hand. He had agreed to a new deal with the Sox but hadn't gotten around to signing it yet when the Sox signed Carlton Fisk for more money. Lemon wasn't happy about that and never did sign the deal. He was potentially going to go free agent and Hemond figured it would be better to get a solid player for him (Steve Kemp) and take his chances. As it turned out when Kemp signed with the Yankees the Sox got a compensation pick in the free agent market although I don't remember who they took.

October 19, 1949 – Sox G.M. Frank Lane struck again. Lane dealt backup catcher and malcontent Joe Tipton to the Philadelphia A’s for a young, small second baseman named Jacob Nelson “Nellie” Fox. Tipton had gotten into a fistfight with Sox manager Jack Onslow during the 1949 season and wasn’t going to be kept. All Fox did was eventually get to the Hall of Fame, have his #2 retired by the team in 1976, make 12 All- Star teams, win the league’s M.V.P. award in 1959 and become one of the faces of the “Go-Go” Sox during the 1950's and early 1960's.

In two years Roland took a team that lost 106 games, had a handshake agreement to move to Milwaukee, saw Comiskey Park falling apart and was basically ignored by the media and turned them into a team that won 87 games in a shortened season and fought the A's well into September. To say nothing of the job he did in helping Veeck put together the 1977 team and he built the 1983 club. Very little about Roland's tenure was a failure. Wasn't his fault for most of his time he was saddled with a situation where money was in short supply from ownership issues. And if this is a definition of "failure" the Sox need a LOT more of this: Roland Hemond’s Best Trades: (in chronological order...) 1. November 30, 1971: White Sox send Ken Berry, Syd O’Brien and Billy Wynne to California for catcher Tom Egan, starting pitcher Tom Bradley and outfielder Jay Johnstone. (Author’s Note: Bradley would win 15 games with a sub three ERA in both 1971 and 1972. Egan served as a very good backup to Ed Herrmann and Johnstone added speed, pinch hitting abilities and a crazy character to keep the clubhouse relaxed.) 2. December 2, 1971: White Sox send Tommy John and Steve Huntz to Los Angeles for first baseman Dick Allen. (Author’s Note: The trade that saved the franchise. Allen won the M.V.P. award in 1972 leading the Sox to a near division championship. His ability to hit for power and average was unmatched on the South Side for years. Named to three All-Star teams.) 3. December 2, 1971: White Sox send Rich McKinney to the Yankees for starting pitcher Stan Bahnsen. (Author’s Note: Bahnsen would win 54 games in three and a half seasons in Chicago including 21 in 1972.) 4. November 19, 1972: White Sox send Tom Bradley to San Francisco for outfielder Ken Henderson and pitcher Steve Stone. (Author’s Note: Henderson was a Gold Glove winning, power hitting center fielder while Stone added depth to the pitching staff. Bradley never regained the form that he showed with the Sox and was out of baseball by 1975.) 5. August 14, 1973: White Sox acquire starting pitcher Jim Kaat on waivers from Minnesota. (Author’s Note: Kaat was a two time 20 game winner for the Sox in 1974 and 1975. Made the All-Star team in 1975. Won 45 games in two and a quarter years in Chicago.) 6. June 15, 1975: White Sox send pitchers Stan Bahnsen and “Skip” Pitlock to Oakland for outfielder Chet Lemon and pitcher Dave Hamilton. (Author’s Note: Lemon would turn into one of the top center fielders in baseball with the Sox making the All-Star team twice. Hamilton was a regular contributor to the 1977 White Sox team with four wins and nine saves.) 7. December 11, 1975: White Sox send third baseman Bill Melton and pitcher Steve Dunning to California for first baseman Jim Spencer and outfielder Morris Nettles. (Author’s Note: Melton had a bad back and had worn out his welcome getting into a shouting match in a Milwaukee hotel lobby with broadcaster Harry Caray. Spencer meanwhile won a Gold Glove for his defensive prowess in 1977 saving many errors. He also had 18 home runs and 69 RBI’s for the “South Side Hit Men”, twice driving in eight runs in a game.) 8. April 4, 1977: White Sox send shortstop “Bucky” Dent to the Yankees for outfielder Oscar Gamble, pitchers LaMarr Hoyt and Bob Polinsky and cash.(Author’s Note: The deal was made because the Sox could not afford to resign Dent. Gamble blasted 31 home runs for the “South Side Hit Men.” Hoyt would become a very good starting pitcher winning the Cy Young Award after going 24-10 in 1983.) 9. July 10, 1979: White Sox send pitcher Jack Kucek to the Phillies for infielder Jim Morrison. (Author’s Note: When the Sox were being rebuilt in the early 80's Morrison provided stability and power at either second or third base. Had three seasons of double figure home run totals.) 10. December 12, 1980: White Sox send pitcher “Tex” Wortham to Montreal for second baseman Tony Bernazard. (Author’s Note: Bernazard was a switch hitter with speed and the ability to hit to all fields. He was a good second baseman in his two and a half years with the Sox. Hemond then sent him to Seattle for Julio Cruz a move that crystalized the 1983 team.) 11. January 25, 1983: White Sox send pitchers Steve Trout and Warren Brusstar to the Cubs for infielders Scott Fletcher and Pat Tabler along with pitchers Dick Tidrow and Randy Martz. (Author’s Note: Perhaps Hemond’s greatest deal. Roland used the free agent compensation rules that were in use at the time to inquire about getting Cubs future Hall of Fame pitcher Ferguson Jenkins whom they left unprotected. Cubs G.M. Dallas Green got word of it and quickly made this deal. Part of it was the promise by Hemond that the Sox would not take Jenkins. Fletcher and Tidrow were important parts of the 1983 team. Tabler was then traded to Cleveland for Jerry Dybzinski adding another part to the club.) 12. January 20, 1984: White Sox select starting pitcher Tom Seaver from the free agent compensation pool. (Author’s Note: The future Hall of Famer would win 32 games in two years with the Sox including his 300th beating the Yankees 4-1 on August 4, 1985.) 13. December 6, 1984: White Sox send pitcher LaMarr Hoyt and two minor leaguers to San Diego for pitchers Tim Lollar and Bill Long along with infielder/outfielder Luis Salazar and shortstop Ozzie Guillen. (Author’s Note: Hoyt would see his career quickly end after the 1985 season due to substance abuse. Lollar and Salazar helped the 1985 team to a winning record but Guillen would become the Rookie of the Year in 1985 and win a Gold Glove in 1990 along with becoming a two time All-Star.)

They had other releases but you are basically correct.

October 18, 1969 - A little known studio musical group came out with an oddly named song. On this date it broke into the Billboard Top 100 chart and would eventually move all the way to #1. The group was called Steam. The song, “Na Na Hey Hey Kiss Him Goodbye.” Thanks to the efforts of Sox organist Nancy Faust it would become the song Sox fans used to ‘serenade’ pitchers being removed from games. Today you can hear it practically at every stadium in America but it started on the South Side! In April 2021 ESPN had a special short documentary on the history of the song and how through the efforts of Faust it became the fan base’s anthem and eventually spread as stated to other teams, leagues and sports.

Exactly... and Turner drove in over 90 runs last year and played in the most games in his career so he is taking care of himself physically.