Eder, Fletcher DFA'd , Thorpe to the 60 day IL

[caulfield12]

5 hours ago, southsider2k5 said:

that won't be around past this year, all so we don't have to play anyone under 30. Do we need 600 PAs to figure that out?

Again,  why am I supposed to be so excited about a dev staff that we are absolutely afraid to use?  Hell  there was a million other DFAs of guys with control past next season who were out there besides the ones that we couldn't apparently do anything with here.  Why are we so damned scared of acting like we are trying to build a team for 2030 and not 2025?  That's what you should be doing when you lose 121 games.

Use them on who, exactly?

Cal Mitchell?  Veras?  Terrell Tatum?

There's just no even marginal MLB talent at Charlotte and likely Birmingham as well.

Alexander Canario would automatically become their best outfield prospect (all the way down to A ball) if he's claimed/traded for.

 

The very best option RIGHT NOW if you want a young outfield is probably transitioning Brooks Baldwin to the outfield.

Edited March 28 by caulfield12

[Chicago White Sox]

13 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

Use them on who, exactly?

Cal Mitchell?  Veras?  Terrell Tatum?

There's just no even marginal MLB talent at Charlotte and likely Birmingham as well.

Alexander Canario would automatically become their best outfield prospect (all the way down to A ball) if he's claimed/traded for.

 

The very best option RIGHT NOW if you want a young outfield is probably transitioning Brooks Baldwin to the outfield.

Exactly.  The OF in the upper minors is a wasteland.  Veras is probably the best we have and he’s not really a natural OF and has a ton of work to do in the plate discipline area before he ever becomes a potential major league OF.

[WhiteSox2023]

12 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Exactly.  The OF in the upper minors is a wasteland.  Veras is probably the best we have and he’s not really a natural OF and has a ton of work to do in the plate discipline area before he ever becomes a potential major league OF.

So do we all agree?  If Getz doesn’t make a move for Canario, whether that be by trade or waiver claim, it really would be questionable and disappointing.

[Chicago White Sox]

15 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

So do we all agree?  If Getz doesn’t make a move for Canario, whether that be by trade or waiver claim, it really would be questionable and disappointing.

I wouldn’t trade for him, but I would put a claim in.

[WestEddy]

16 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

So do we all agree?  If Getz doesn’t make a move for Canario, whether that be by trade or waiver claim, it really would be questionable and disappointing.

nope.

[WhiteSox2023]

8 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I wouldn’t trade for him, but I would put a claim in.

The Mets gave up cash considerations for him 5 weeks ago.  With rosters finalized, I doubt he would cost any more than that again.  I don’t see that being too much of a price to pay.  If they have to give up an A ball lottery ticket type player, one could question that.

Edited March 28 by WhiteSox2023

[WhiteSox2023]

9 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

nope.

Okay, if he just ends up costing a waiver claim fee, what would your reasoning be to not make that move?  Just curious.

Edited March 28 by WhiteSox2023

[Chicago White Sox]

18 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

The Mets gave up cash considerations for him 5 weeks ago.  With rosters finalized, I doubt he would cost any more than that again.  I don’t see that being too much of a price to pay.  If they have to give up an A ball lottery ticket type player, one could question that.

I would give up cash, but Uncle Jerry may not feel the same.  I wouldn’t trade an actual prospect though.

[WhiteSox2023]

20 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I would give up cash, but Uncle Jerry may not feel the same.  I wouldn’t trade an actual prospect though.

Agreed.

I was looking for more detailed rules on DFAs and waiver claims.  I am pretty sure, but not positive, that since the Mets DFA’ed Canario before all MLB teams had a chance to play their first game, that the waiver priority for Canario would be based on last year’s records, meaning the Sox would have #1 waiver claim priority and get first dibs to claim him.  Of course, another team could trade for Canario first within 5 days of his DFA, before the Sox have a chance to claim him on waivers.  But if he gets to waivers and the Sox put in a claim, Canario would be theirs.

Does anyone know the definitive answer to this?

Edited March 28 by WhiteSox2023

[southsider2k5]

10 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

Agreed.

I was looking for more detailed rules on DFAs and waiver claims.  I am pretty sure, but not positive, that since the Mets DFA’ed Canario before all MLB teams had a chance to play their first game, that the waiver priority for Canario would be based on last year’s records, meaning the Sox would have #1 waiver claim priority and get first dibs to claim him.  Of course, another team could trade for Canario first within 5 days of his DFA, before the Sox have a chance to claim him on waivers.

Does anyone know the definitive answer to this?

It used to be you had to go through your league first, and then the other league first in terms of waiver claims.  Did that change?  Like if you were an NL player, you'd go through worst to first in the NL, and then the same in the AL.

[WhiteSox2023]

25 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

It used to be you had to go through your league first, and then the other league first in terms of waiver claims.  Did that change?  Like if you were an NL player, you'd go through worst to first in the NL, and then the same in the AL.

This is where we need an expert.  I am seeing all sorts of confusing information or just not enough information on it.  Even MLB.com’s information is vague.  This article is from 2009 so it may be aged out, but it seems to indicate that it is based on date ranges and that both the entire MLB standings from the the prior season and the current season standings factor in, along with the standings by AL versus NL depending on which league the DFA’ed player was in.

Based on this information below (if accurate), the Sox would have the #1 waiver claim priority on Canario if he makes it to waivers for 48 hours, unless another team actually trades for him first in the initial 5-day window.

https://www.purplerow.com/2009/2/19/762532/mlb-transactions-part-thre

Edited March 28 by WhiteSox2023

[T R U]

52 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

So do we all agree?  If Getz doesn’t make a move for Canario, whether that be by trade or waiver claim, it really would be questionable and disappointing.

It would be very disappointing if they pass on claiming him. I wouldn't trade for him, but if its a free acquisition and the only requirement is to DFA Jankowski, you do it. 

[WestEddy]

49 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

Okay, if he just ends up costing a waiver claim fee, what would your reasoning be to not make that move?  Just curious.

I would not find it questionable and disappointing if Canario isn't on our team in a week. 

I'd imagine that the priorities in the first months of the season are:

1) Get Vargas, Sosa and Lee PAs and innings. You need to see if they're major leaguers going forward. 
2) Put your four young starting pitchers (and inexperienced bullpen) in the best position to succeed. A big step towards that goal is making sure you have better fielders at every possible position. 
3) Keep Robert, Benintendi and Vaughn fresh and healthy by rotating them through the DH slot. If they produce, you can trade them.
4) Give Will Venable a team that he can actually "manage" and try to win games with. Venable is also being evaluated as a part of the equation going forward. Why give him a s%*#-show to juggle in his first year?

One obstacle to all those is parking a guy in LF or DH and eliminating the rotation Venable has planned for the position. 

The main problem I have with the constant stoking of the "Getz is clueless" narrative is that he actually put this roster together with a plan and it would be silly to jettison that plan one game into the season to take a flier on a guy who hasn't collected the most glowing scouting reports. 

Cutting Jankowski, Maton, Slater, Taylor, Vaughn, Rojas all become flippant options if we just disregard the fact that they actually have to play the games, don't want to exceed the worst loss record again, and want to develop a positive clubhouse environment going forward.

Canario is an interesting player. We could have easily cut Colas and grabbed this guy up when the Cubs DFAed him, and then took a good, long look at him. Either their own scouts said the same thing many of the more credible reports we have access to said, or they just didn't know enough about him then. I don't think anything's changed in the last 6 weeks. 

Edited March 28 by WestEddy

[Buehrle>Wood]

23 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

It used to be you had to go through your league first, and then the other league first in terms of waiver claims.  Did that change?  Like if you were an NL player, you'd go through worst to first in the NL, and then the same in the AL.

It sounds like that has been done away with. From MLB

Claiming priority is based on reverse winning percentage. So, if a player is placed on outright waivers and claimed by more than one team, the team with the worse winning percentage gets priority.

 

A previous version of the rules gave priority based on the league of the team waiving the player, with NL teams getting priority for NL players, and AL for AL, but that is no longer the case.

Edited March 28 by Buehrle>Wood

[T R U]

6 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

I would not find it questionable and disappointing if Canario isn't on our team in a week. 

I'd imagine that the priorities in the first months of the season are:

1) Get Vargas, Sosa and Lee PAs and innings. You need to see if they're major leaguers going forward. 
2) Put your four young starting pitchers (and inexperienced bullpen) in the best position to succeed. A big step towards that goal is making sure you have better fielders at every possible position. 
3) Keep Robert, Benintendi and Vaughn fresh and healthy by rotating them through the DH slot. If they produce, you can trade them.
4) Give Will Venable a team that he can actually "manage" and try to win games with. Venable is also being evaluated as a part of the equation going forward. Why give him a s%*#-show to juggle in his first year?

One obstacle to all those is parking a guy in LF or DH and eliminating the rotation Venable has planned for the position. 

The main problem I have with the constant stoking of the "Getz is clueless" narrative is that he actually put this roster together with a plan and it would be silly to jettison that plan one game into the season to take a flier on a guy who hasn't collected the most glowing scouting reports. 

Cutting Jankowski, Maton, Slater, Taylor, Vaughn, Rojas all become flippant options if we just disregard the fact that they actually have to play the games, don't want to exceed the worst loss record again, and want to develop a positive clubhouse environment going forward.

Canario is an interesting player. We could have easily cut Colas and grabbed this guy up when the Cubs DFAed him, and then took a good, long look at him. Either their own scouts said the same thing many of the more credible reports we have access to said, or the just didn't know enough about him then. I don't think anything's changed in the last 6 weeks. 

Unless im mistaken, he was DFA'd and then traded so he never actually made it to waivers. In which case, we don't know if the Sox had a chance to claim him or not. Correct?

[WestEddy]

5 minutes ago, T R U said:

Unless im mistaken, he was DFA'd and then traded so he never actually made it to waivers. In which case, we don't know if the Sox had a chance to claim him or not. Correct?

They certainly could have traded cash or a rookie level pitcher for him then. I think the point of waivers is to put teams on notice, collect offers, then trade him to the team with the best offer. Short of that, release him to the top claiming club, or pull him back from waivers. 

[WhiteSox2023]

15 minutes ago, T R U said:

Unless im mistaken, he was DFA'd and then traded so he never actually made it to waivers. In which case, we don't know if the Sox had a chance to claim him or not. Correct?

Yes, this is how I understand it.  Any team could make a trade for a DFA’ed player within the first 5 days.  The Mets jumped the gun and worked a trade for him for cash considerations, which trumped the Sox #1 waiver priority.  If no team works a trade, the DFA’ed player goes through a 48-hour waiver claim process.  That’s when the Sox would have had #1 waiver claim priority based on last year’s record.  And I think the Sox still have this #1 waiver claim priority for the Mets most recent DFA’ing of Canario.

Edited March 28 by WhiteSox2023

[WhiteSox2023]

22 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

I would not find it questionable and disappointing if Canario isn't on our team in a week. 

I'd imagine that the priorities in the first months of the season are:

1) Get Vargas, Sosa and Lee PAs and innings. You need to see if they're major leaguers going forward. 
2) Put your four young starting pitchers (and inexperienced bullpen) in the best position to succeed. A big step towards that goal is making sure you have better fielders at every possible position. 
3) Keep Robert, Benintendi and Vaughn fresh and healthy by rotating them through the DH slot. If they produce, you can trade them.
4) Give Will Venable a team that he can actually "manage" and try to win games with. Venable is also being evaluated as a part of the equation going forward. Why give him a s%*#-show to juggle in his first year?

One obstacle to all those is parking a guy in LF or DH and eliminating the rotation Venable has planned for the position. 

The main problem I have with the constant stoking of the "Getz is clueless" narrative is that he actually put this roster together with a plan and it would be silly to jettison that plan one game into the season to take a flier on a guy who hasn't collected the most glowing scouting reports. 

Cutting Jankowski, Maton, Slater, Taylor, Vaughn, Rojas all become flippant options if we just disregard the fact that they actually have to play the games, don't want to exceed the worst loss record again, and want to develop a positive clubhouse environment going forward.

Canario is an interesting player. We could have easily cut Colas and grabbed this guy up when the Cubs DFAed him, and then took a good, long look at him. Either their own scouts said the same thing many of the more credible reports we have access to said, or they just didn't know enough about him then. I don't think anything's changed in the last 6 weeks. 

I guess it’s possible Getz would have claimed him if the Mets didn’t offer cash considerations to the Cubs for him first.  We don’t know.  But we do know that JR loves receiving cash considerations in trades, not so much giving them up.  🤣 

[WhiteSox2023]

I don’t think dumping a bad player like Jankowski for Canario conflicts with @WestEddy’s four noted priorities above.  Defensive flexibility with existing players on the roster greatly lessens the need for Jankowski and his ability to back up all three outfield spots.  I also think adding young talent where you don’t have much of it should be a fifth priority for Getz.

Edited March 28 by WhiteSox2023

[WestEddy]

1 hour ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

I don’t think dumping a bad player like Jankowski for Canario conflicts with @WestEddy’s four noted priorities above.  Defensive flexibility with existing players on the roster greatly lessens the need for Jankowski and his ability to back up all three outfield spots.  I also think adding young talent where you don’t have much of it should be a fifth priority for Getz.

Jankowski's gone as soon as Tauchman's ready in a week or so. I wouldn't trade for or claim Canario for a 3 week audition. Dude needs runway. I haven't heard of Canario's defense being on the level of Michael A. Taylor, so Slater is really the only player occupying the spot Canario would take. I know it's a meme, but Slater was the guy they targeted, either as a hedge against a Robert trade, or 2022-2023 Slater being a guy they could trade for a dude. I wouldn't expect them to launch the first player they targeted this off-season after 3 weeks. 

Just as we talk about Martin Perez, Bryce Wilson and others, they probably lured Slater with a promise of playing time, and a good couple month shot at a job. 

On a tangent, thinking about how they treated Pillar last year, and how he was so gob-smacked by the reworking of his contract, the Sox had to be feeling a money bite from their TV deals going away. 

 

[WhiteSox2023]

3 hours ago, WestEddy said:

Jankowski's gone as soon as Tauchman's ready in a week or so. I wouldn't trade for or claim Canario for a 3 week audition. Dude needs runway. I haven't heard of Canario's defense being on the level of Michael A. Taylor, so Slater is really the only player occupying the spot Canario would take. I know it's a meme, but Slater was the guy they targeted, either as a hedge against a Robert trade, or 2022-2023 Slater being a guy they could trade for a dude. I wouldn't expect them to launch the first player they targeted this off-season after 3 weeks. 

Just as we talk about Martin Perez, Bryce Wilson and others, they probably lured Slater with a promise of playing time, and a good couple month shot at a job. 

On a tangent, thinking about how they treated Pillar last year, and how he was so gob-smacked by the reworking of his contract, the Sox had to be feeling a money bite from their TV deals going away. 

 

Why not make Benintendi the primary DH since he may still be able to hit but his defense has dropped off and he has a noodle arm?  Drop Jankowski for Canario and let him start in LF for longer than just 3 weeks.  A month or so of starting would be more runway in the majors than Canario has ever received.

When Tauchman returns, stick with Getz’s original plan of Tauchman/Slater in a RF platoon.  Taylor serves as the backup outfielder.  If Canario is struggling badly after a month or so, try to slip him through waivers to AAA.  Afterall, we already know how poor of a hitter Taylor is and he started in LF on opening day.  I guess Canario could be worse than Taylor but I’d be willing to find out.

And why should the Sox be worried about giving Slater playing time?  The guy signed for $1.75 million.  That’s cheap bench player money.  After his performance last year, a guy like Slater was not in the position to make any demands, nor would the Sox need to promise him anything.  He has $500K in performance bonuses.  Tauchman has $1 million in incentives and a $250K relocation bonus if he's traded.  I doubt that means they won’t trade him if a team is interested at the deadline.  If Getz made any promises to a couple of outfielders that would be bench players on any other team but the Sox, that would be ridiculous.  Tauchman and Slater should have been thrilled to be in a planned RF platoon once Getz contacted their agents.

So where’s the problem with this proposed plan?

Edited March 28 by WhiteSox2023

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

2 hours ago, WestEddy said:

Jankowski's gone as soon as Tauchman's ready in a week or so. I wouldn't trade for or claim Canario for a 3 week audition. Dude needs runway. I haven't heard of Canario's defense being on the level of Michael A. Taylor, so Slater is really the only player occupying the spot Canario would take. I know it's a meme, but Slater was the guy they targeted, either as a hedge against a Robert trade, or 2022-2023 Slater being a guy they could trade for a dude. I wouldn't expect them to launch the first player they targeted this off-season after 3 weeks. 

Just as we talk about Martin Perez, Bryce Wilson and others, they probably lured Slater with a promise of playing time, and a good couple month shot at a job. 

On a tangent, thinking about how they treated Pillar last year, and how he was so gob-smacked by the reworking of his contract, the Sox had to be feeling a money bite from their TV deals going away. 

 

Lured Slater? 

Guys like Slater aren't getting promises in free agency, they're just thrilled to get a call. 

[Nardiwashere]

Why did SoxTalk turn into an Alexander Canario themed message board?  How good is this guy that there are 3 threads during opening week devoted to talking about him?  

[WhiteSox2023]

19 minutes ago, Nardiwashere said:

Why did SoxTalk turn into an Alexander Canario themed message board?  How good is this guy that there are 3 threads during opening week devoted to talking about him?  

Because we are a rebuilding team that is likely going to have a bad season so we have room to try out players and we have like two good outfield prospects.  Colas and Fletcher were failures but that doesn’t mean you stop trying to acquire outfielders, and Canario is younger than both of those guys and has more power.

Edited March 28 by WhiteSox2023

[WestEddy]

1 hour ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

If Getz made any promises to a couple of outfielders that would be bench players on any other team but the Sox, that would be ridiculous.

Getz would have no reason to make promises to guys playing for other teams. They are playing on the Sox.