Lip Man 1 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 https://www.chicagotribune.com/2025/06/02/chicago-white-sox-detroit-tigers-tarik-skubal/ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitekrazy Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 Can't read it - paywall The myth is rebuilds work. That's what the consistently bad teams do. The problem with that is they never compliment the team either. That will be Reinsdorf. It's also a sport with the least amount of roster consistency. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lip Man 1 Posted June 3 Author Share Posted June 3 (edited) 1 hour ago, kitekrazy said: Can't read it - paywall The myth is rebuilds work. That's what the consistently bad teams do. The problem with that is they never compliment the team either. That will be Reinsdorf. It's also a sport with the least amount of roster consistency. Story talks with Skubal about how the Tigers rebuilt in a short time while the Sox window of contention fell apart. “How do I say this the right way?” Skubal told me before the game. “I don’t really believe in the term ‘rebuild,’ to be honest. Our rebuild was supposed to be five years, and it started in 2017 or whatever. That means we were supposed to have already won by now, and we haven’t. So I don’t believe in the word.” “It’s tough for fans. When you’re a diehard fan and your team is kind of openly saying we don’t want to win, that’s not what you want to hear. I play baseball, but I’m a fan of other teams — the (Phoenix) Suns and the Arizona Cardinals — and when a team comes out and openly says we’re rebuilding, you don’t want to hear that. “As a Suns fan, we’ve been through tough times, but now we have an owner that wants to win as badly as the fans do. That’s all you can ask for as a fan.” “Mat Ishbia has been great for the community,” said Skubal, who grew up in Arizona. “Obviously the Suns’ season was disappointing, but it’s good to know they have a plan in place, and that’s all you ask for.” Reinsdorf had a plan, too. It worked until he decided to ignore his general manager, Rick Hahn, and hired his friend, Tony La Russa, as manager over A.J. Hinch, who eventually went to the Tigers. Edited June 3 by Lip Man 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 1 hour ago, Lip Man 1 said: Reinsdorf had a plan, too. It worked until he decided to ignore his general manager, Rick Hahn, and hired his friend, Tony La Russa, as manager over A.J. Hinch, who eventually went to the Tigers. Yet, it's Rick Hahns fault. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almagest Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 8 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: Yet, it's Rick Hahns fault. If you still think Hahn is blameless in this debacle at this point... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 8 minutes ago, almagest said: If you still think Hahn is blameless in this debacle at this point... Blameless? No. The entire blame? No. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSox2023 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 11 minutes ago, almagest said: If you still think Hahn is blameless in this debacle at this point... The entire blame is on Jerry. He continues to hire poor GM’s and doesn’t let them make their own decisions or spend on the right players. He’s a meddler and the Sox will be in a rebuild loop as long as he owns the team. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitekrazy Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 Scouting and development. GMs don't really scout unless it is office people. Then they still don get to make the final decision. Then there is also the era of the more brittle player. It's a trend in all sports. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 (edited) 21 minutes ago, kitekrazy said: Scouting and development. GMs don't really scout unless it is office people. Then they still don get to make the final decision. Then there is also the era of the more brittle player. It's a trend in all sports. Doesn't seem to be slowing the Cubs down much offensively... Edited June 3 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lip Man 1 Posted June 3 Author Share Posted June 3 1 hour ago, southsider2k5 said: Yet, it's Rick Hahns fault. Just FYI, that last comment that I posted from the column isn't my opinion it was written by Paul Sullivan although the blame to a large extent directly falls on JR. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WBWSF Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 2 hours ago, Lip Man 1 said: Story talks with Skubal about how the Tigers rebuilt in a short time while the Sox window of contention fell apart. “How do I say this the right way?” Skubal told me before the game. “I don’t really believe in the term ‘rebuild,’ to be honest. Our rebuild was supposed to be five years, and it started in 2017 or whatever. That means we were supposed to have already won by now, and we haven’t. So I don’t believe in the word.” “It’s tough for fans. When you’re a diehard fan and your team is kind of openly saying we don’t want to win, that’s not what you want to hear. I play baseball, but I’m a fan of other teams — the (Phoenix) Suns and the Arizona Cardinals — and when a team comes out and openly says we’re rebuilding, you don’t want to hear that. “As a Suns fan, we’ve been through tough times, but now we have an owner that wants to win as badly as the fans do. That’s all you can ask for as a fan.” “Mat Ishbia has been great for the community,” said Skubal, who grew up in Arizona. “Obviously the Suns’ season was disappointing, but it’s good to know they have a plan in place, and that’s all you ask for.” Reinsdorf had a plan, too. It worked until he decided to ignore his general manager, Rick Hahn, and hired his friend, Tony La Russa, as manager over A.J. Hinch, who eventually went to the Tigers. That is not the case here with JR. The team lost 121 games in 2024 and he did nothing to improve the team this past off season. It doesn't say much for his character. He's laughing all the way to the bank with this teams low payroll. He hasn't given any indication that he wants to improve the team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 1 hour ago, caulfield12 said: Doesn't seem to be slowing the Cubs down much offensively... Sure it does. One good year does not a career make. Let's see where they are if they don't pay a massive contract to Tucker. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 23 minutes ago, WBWSF said: That is not the case here with JR. The team lost 121 games in 2024 and he did nothing to improve the team this past off season. It doesn't say much for his character. He's laughing all the way to the bank with this teams low payroll. He hasn't given any indication that he wants to improve the team. I don't think this is accurate. They have spent a great deal if money in areas where they never have in the past. Upgrading the equipment throughout thr minors, building and staffing a big biomechanics lab in Arizona, renovating the entire DR complex. All things needed to actually develop players. If the minors start to develop good players, thats when the payroll should go up to fill in the pieces. They could have signed 2-3 big free agents and this team would still be bad. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 1 hour ago, ptatc said: I don't think this is accurate. They have spent a great deal if money in areas where they never have in the past. Upgrading the equipment throughout thr minors, building and staffing a big biomechanics lab in Arizona, renovating the entire DR complex. All things needed to actually develop players. If the minors start to develop good players, thats when the payroll should go up to fill in the pieces. They could have signed 2-3 big free agents and this team would still be bad. They fed us the same exact propaganda during Hahn and Williams. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshPR Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 3 hours ago, southsider2k5 said: Blameless? No. The entire blame? No. I can agree with this somewhat. But I read Hahn admitting goofing up the tatis thing. We're the padres didn't even want tatis at first Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 1 hour ago, southsider2k5 said: They fed us the same exact propaganda during Hahn and Williams. Again, I haven't seen this actually stated anywhere. And I don't recall them ever spending money on development of the minor leagues. They've never had a consistent development plan for the system. This is why they've never consistently developed players. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almagest Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 11 minutes ago, ptatc said: Again, I haven't seen this actually stated anywhere. And I don't recall them ever spending money on development of the minor leagues. They've never had a consistent development plan for the system. This is why they've never consistently developed players. We all used to complain about the lack of high end internally developed prospects all the time. They were stuck in 2005 for 18 years. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 29 minutes ago, ptatc said: Again, I haven't seen this actually stated anywhere. And I don't recall them ever spending money on development of the minor leagues. They've never had a consistent development plan for the system. This is why they've never consistently developed players. And I previously post articles from before. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 27 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: And I previously post articles from before. On the money spent throughout the minor? Ill have to look for them. I'd really like to see exactly what they are doing at each level and the biomechanics lab. Ive heard rumors about what the lab is like. It's pretty impressive apparently. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 4 Share Posted June 4 4 hours ago, almagest said: We all used to complain about the lack of high end internally developed prospects all the time. They were stuck in 2005 for 18 years. Some of us still do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almagest Posted June 4 Share Posted June 4 10 hours ago, southsider2k5 said: Some of us still do. I think we all do, especially on the hitting side. That may be changing, but we'll see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted June 4 Share Posted June 4 24 minutes ago, almagest said: I think we all do, especially on the hitting side. That may be changing, but we'll see. Yep, until the players start making it to the MLB, we won't know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almagest Posted June 4 Share Posted June 4 13 minutes ago, ptatc said: Yep, until the players start making it to the MLB, we won't know. Frankly, I'm encouraged to even see players doing well consistently in the minors. We barely even had that for decades. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiderman Posted June 4 Share Posted June 4 21 hours ago, Lip Man 1 said: Story talks with Skubal about how the Tigers rebuilt in a short time while the Sox window of contention fell apart. “How do I say this the right way?” Skubal told me before the game. “I don’t really believe in the term ‘rebuild,’ to be honest. Our rebuild was supposed to be five years, and it started in 2017 or whatever. That means we were supposed to have already won by now, and we haven’t. So I don’t believe in the word.” “It’s tough for fans. When you’re a diehard fan and your team is kind of openly saying we don’t want to win, that’s not what you want to hear. I play baseball, but I’m a fan of other teams — the (Phoenix) Suns and the Arizona Cardinals — and when a team comes out and openly says we’re rebuilding, you don’t want to hear that. “As a Suns fan, we’ve been through tough times, but now we have an owner that wants to win as badly as the fans do. That’s all you can ask for as a fan.” “Mat Ishbia has been great for the community,” said Skubal, who grew up in Arizona. “Obviously the Suns’ season was disappointing, but it’s good to know they have a plan in place, and that’s all you ask for.” Reinsdorf had a plan, too. It worked until he decided to ignore his general manager, Rick Hahn, and hired his friend, Tony La Russa, as manager over A.J. Hinch, who eventually went to the Tigers. He's not wrong. The team sells the fans that the only way to do this is to completely take it apart and put it back together, but this time with long-term sustainability. You don't hear of any commitment to be a significant free agent spender or that the players they draft (particularly pitching) will be retained if they draft well - but that goes back to the sustainability nonsense. They can continue to replenish without having to spend on elite free agents. Meanwhile, the White Sox are on Year 3 of a rebuild with no guarantee of any outcome and the next 1-2 years don't look to very promising with most of their young talent still developing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
champagne030 Posted June 4 Share Posted June 4 15 minutes ago, spiderman said: Meanwhile, the White Sox are on Year 3 of a rebuild with no guarantee of any outcome and the next 1-2 years don't look to very promising with most of their young talent still developing. And the guy, supposedly, in charge has a track record of nothing but suckage. I know, I know....we need to give Getz more time because everything wrong is the fault of the previous regime and Getz had nothing to do with that.🙄 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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