My college friends and I do a trip to a new stadium every summer as a way to keep a guaranteed trip on the books, up to around 20 parks now.

I'll share an anecdote of a story I overheard of anyway group of guys doing this same thing at the same time, and their perspective on Rate Field.

Two years ago I was at my gate at the San Francisco airport after doing a double dip of a Giants game Friday afternoon (incredible!) and Oakland game Saturday night (depressing!). Oakland's stadium experience was just so sad with the upper bowl totally closed off, fans were loud and proud, and just knowing there were like 8 games left in that building before they left for LV.

Gate area at the airport is empty except for two other guys and I overhear them debating all of the stadiums they've been to, best to worst. One of them wholeheartedly said Rate Field was the worst fan experience and that he would never, ever want to return. Worse than any other stadium, including Oakland and Tampa.

Now, this is an outsider perspective and not a fan of the team, so they didn't tailgate etc to get the full experience. And it's only one voice calling it the worst. But non-Sox fans are not champing at the bit to come see a game here. We have an opportunity to make this fan-friendly for our fans and make it an attractive place to visit.

1 hour ago, MiddleCoastBias said:

My college friends and I do a trip to a new stadium every summer as a way to keep a guaranteed trip on the books, up to around 20 parks now.

I'll share an anecdote of a story I overheard of anyway group of guys doing this same thing at the same time, and their perspective on Rate Field.

Two years ago I was at my gate at the San Francisco airport after doing a double dip of a Giants game Friday afternoon (incredible!) and Oakland game Saturday night (depressing!). Oakland's stadium experience was just so sad with the upper bowl totally closed off, fans were loud and proud, and just knowing there were like 8 games left in that building before they left for LV.

Gate area at the airport is empty except for two other guys and I overhear them debating all of the stadiums they've been to, best to worst. One of them wholeheartedly said Rate Field was the worst fan experience and that he would never, ever want to return. Worse than any other stadium, including Oakland and Tampa.

Now, this is an outsider perspective and not a fan of the team, so they didn't tailgate etc to get the full experience. And it's only one voice calling it the worst. But non-Sox fans are not champing at the bit to come see a game here. We have an opportunity to make this fan-friendly for our fans and make it an attractive place to visit.

33% is upper deck isolation/heights

33% lack of things to do in surrounding area/parking lots

33% low attendance most seasons leaves visitors a depressed feeling except for weekends

totally different atmosphere 2008 G163 or this year's post season...at least 25 or so home games this season as well

ramp were quantity in Old Comiskey but just a reminder of seat segregation in GRF

suites in middle destroy coziness

Edited 11 hours ago11 hr by caulfield12

1 hour ago, MiddleCoastBias said:

My college friends and I do a trip to a new stadium every summer as a way to keep a guaranteed trip on the books, up to around 20 parks now.

I'll share an anecdote of a story I overheard of anyway group of guys doing this same thing at the same time, and their perspective on Rate Field.

Two years ago I was at my gate at the San Francisco airport after doing a double dip of a Giants game Friday afternoon (incredible!) and Oakland game Saturday night (depressing!). Oakland's stadium experience was just so sad with the upper bowl totally closed off, fans were loud and proud, and just knowing there were like 8 games left in that building before they left for LV.

Gate area at the airport is empty except for two other guys and I overhear them debating all of the stadiums they've been to, best to worst. One of them wholeheartedly said Rate Field was the worst fan experience and that he would never, ever want to return. Worse than any other stadium, including Oakland and Tampa.

Now, this is an outsider perspective and not a fan of the team, so they didn't tailgate etc to get the full experience. And it's only one voice calling it the worst. But non-Sox fans are not champing at the bit to come see a game here. We have an opportunity to make this fan-friendly for our fans and make it an attractive place to visit.

Just think, back in the day this old guy went to games at Comiskey and Wrigley just to see Major League Baseball games and greats stars like Williams, Mantle, Mays, Aaron, Mathews and so many more besides our guys like Fox Minoso and Aparicio and never gave the experience and all this other stuff a thought while only paying a 1.25 for a grandstand seat, I can’t believe I survived all these years without the “experience”.

2 hours ago, MiddleCoastBias said:

My college friends and I do a trip to a new stadium every summer as a way to keep a guaranteed trip on the books, up to around 20 parks now.

I'll share an anecdote of a story I overheard of anyway group of guys doing this same thing at the same time, and their perspective on Rate Field.

Two years ago I was at my gate at the San Francisco airport after doing a double dip of a Giants game Friday afternoon (incredible!) and Oakland game Saturday night (depressing!). Oakland's stadium experience was just so sad with the upper bowl totally closed off, fans were loud and proud, and just knowing there were like 8 games left in that building before they left for LV.

Gate area at the airport is empty except for two other guys and I overhear them debating all of the stadiums they've been to, best to worst. One of them wholeheartedly said Rate Field was the worst fan experience and that he would never, ever want to return. Worse than any other stadium, including Oakland and Tampa.

Now, this is an outsider perspective and not a fan of the team, so they didn't tailgate etc to get the full experience. And it's only one voice calling it the worst. But non-Sox fans are not champing at the bit to come see a game here. We have an opportunity to make this fan-friendly for our fans and make it an attractive place to visit.

My best friend was a diehard Cub fan, and he preferred the Cell over Wrigley, to each his own.

46 minutes ago, The Mighty Mite said:

Just think, back in the day this old guy went to games at Comiskey and Wrigley just to see Major League Baseball games and greats stars like Williams, Mantle, Mays, Aaron, Mathews and so many more besides our guys like Fox Minoso and Aparicio and never gave the experience and all this other stuff a thought while only paying a 1.25 for a grandstand seat, I can’t believe I survived all these years without the “experience”.

I am right there with you on watching the ballgame...BUT...I get it...there aren't a lot of "fans" that grow up the way we did in this era! Not being critical...if someone is dropping as much money as they do at an MLB game these days and they expect more than a game...I understand it!

22 minutes ago, BrittBurnsFan said:

I am right there with you on watching the ballgame...BUT...I get it...there aren't a lot of "fans" that grow up the way we did in this era! Not being critical...if someone is dropping as much money as they do at an MLB game these days and they expect more than a game...I understand it!

We used to buy those cheap scorecards day of game, write out the starting lineups, etc.

Almost nobody except broadcasters and those listening at home on the radio older than 50 would do that anymore.

1 hour ago, BrittBurnsFan said:

I am right there with you on watching the ballgame...BUT...I get it...there aren't a lot of "fans" that grow up the way we did in this era! Not being critical...if someone is dropping as much money as they do at an MLB game these days and they expect more than a game...I understand it!

Right, I’m with you. I don’t really care about the experience if the Sox are playing because I’m too focused on the game. In fact I rarely leave my seat at all. When I’m traveling and go to other venues, though, I indulge more in the “experience” side of it, and that’s how I expect casual fans treat home games too.

At the end of the day, I want the Sox park to be awesome mostly because I want the team to gain every competitive advantage possible.

2 hours ago, The Mighty Mite said:

Just think, back in the day this old guy went to games at Comiskey and Wrigley just to see Major League Baseball games and greats stars like Williams, Mantle, Mays, Aaron, Mathews and so many more besides our guys like Fox Minoso and Aparicio and never gave the experience and all this other stuff a thought while only paying a 1.25 for a grandstand seat, I can’t believe I survived all these years without the “experience”.

Keep in mind that these days, people have 60" HDTVs to watch games at home that didn't exist back in the day. Also, baseball is just not as dominant in our culture as it was in the 50s and 60s. It's more difficult now to expect to draw fans just because they want to see big name stars in person. Maybe Ohtani? But I can't think of much else star power that gets young fans excited such that they want to see these stars in person.

There's also a different economic expectation these days. When the Sox drew 1.65M fans in 1977, it broke the all-time Chicago attendance record and was a massive success. Now, if any MLB team caps out at 1.6M fans, there are screams of how the franchise is failing and has serious attendance problems.

Edited 8 hours ago8 hr by 77 Hitmen

13 minutes ago, 77 Hitmen said:

Keep in mind that these days, people have 60" HDTVs to watch games at home that didn't exist back in the day. Also, baseball is just not as dominant in our culture as it was in the 50s and 60s. It's more difficult now to expect to draw fans just because they want to see big name stars in person. Maybe Ohtani? But I can't think of much else star power that gets young fans excited such that they want to see these stars in person.

There's also a different economic expectation these days. When the Sox drew 1.65M fans in 1977, it broke the all-time Chicago attendance record and was a massive success. These days, if any MLB team caps out at 1.6M fans, there are screams of how the franchise is failing and has serious attendance problems.

13 minutes ago, 77 Hitmen said:

Keep in mind that these days, people have 60" HDTVs to watch games at home that didn't exist back in the day. Also, baseball is just not as dominant in our culture as it was in the 50s and 60s. It's more difficult now to expect to draw fans just because they want to see big name stars in person. Maybe Ohtani? But I can't think of much else star power that gets young fans excited such that they want to see these stars in person.

There's also a different economic expectation these days. When the Sox drew 1.65M fans in 1977, it broke the all-time Chicago attendance record and was a massive success. These days, if any MLB team caps out at 1.6M fans, there are screams of how the franchise is failing and has serious attendance problems.

Excellent points but sometimes it’s hard to accept some things like I don’t understand why people go to ballgame, pay good money for a seat and windup standing and watching the game from a concourse. Every once in awhile during a Sox they will show a view from around the fan deck pointing to the left field concourse and it’s packed with people just walking around with some standing and watching the game, I don’t get it, I guess I’m a Neanderthal man.

Edited 8 hours ago8 hr by The Mighty Mite

40 minutes ago, 77 Hitmen said:

Keep in mind that these days, people have 60" HDTVs to watch games at home that didn't exist back in the day. Also, baseball is just not as dominant in our culture as it was in the 50s and 60s. It's more difficult now to expect to draw fans just because they want to see big name stars in person. Maybe Ohtani? But I can't think of much else star power that gets young fans excited such that they want to see these stars in person.

There's also a different economic expectation these days. When the Sox drew 1.65M fans in 1977, it broke the all-time Chicago attendance record and was a massive success. Now, if any MLB team caps out at 1.6M fans, there are screams of how the franchise is failing and has serious attendance problems.

Fans forget that after the team drew 1.65 million fans in 1977 Veeck wanted to move the team 3 years later to Denver. Veeck thought he couldn't compete against the Cubs in Chicago AND he thought he could make more money in Denver. The AL wouldn't let him move the team to Denver and he wound up selling the team to JR.

1 minute ago, WBWSF said:

Fans forget that after the team drew 1.65 million fans in 1977 Veeck wanted to move the team 3 years later to Denver. Veeck thought he couldn't compete against the Cubs in Chicago AND he thought he could make more money in Denver. The AL wouldn't let him move the team to Denver and he wound up selling the team to JR.

Our Sox have a history of bad ownership but looking back the franchise was best under the Comiskey family in the first 20 years and again in the GO GO years. They did suffer after the Black Sox scandal but they had some nice seasons when Jimmy Dykes was managing led by Hall of Famers Luke Appling and Ted Lyons. I was never a fan of Veeck as he traded away a future All Star team after the 1959 AL Championship season. I will always appreciate him stepping in and buying the Sox in 1976 but he was under financed and for some reason he blamed it on bad managers as the Sox had 5 managers in 5 years in his 2nd stint, we saw Paul Richards, Bob Lemon, Larry Doby, Don Kissinger and Tony LaRussa.

Edited 7 hours ago7 hr by The Mighty Mite

Here's my next set of stadium visits and reviews. This time, it's for retractable roof ballparks I have visited.

Safeco Field (now T-Mobile Park): Easily the best of the 3 retractable roof ballparks I have been to. The roof was open when I was there and it really felt open air. Great view of the city and Puget Sound from some parts of the ballpark. This was 25 years ago, so I really can't comment on what the area around the ballpark is like. At the time, the Seahawks stadium was under construction, so there really wasn't much to look at from the bus station to the ballpark. Transit access from our downtown hotel was easy as we took an underground "busway" there. I believe that transit line has since been upgraded to an actual subway rail line.

American Family Field: I have only been there with the roof closed. Someday, I'd like to go to a game with the roof open to see what it's like. It's a good stadium. Nothing outstanding and nothing bad. I sat on the 200 level and my seats were great. It was easy to get to the different levels for concessions. One downside is that they don't have 360 access around the concourse. Location is a negative for me. There's absolutely nothing around the ballpark as far as I could tell other than acres of parking lot. Huge tailgating culture - but nothing much for people who don't tailgate. The only way in and out is by car or bus as far as I could tell.

Chase Field: I'd rank this the lowest among these three. I was actually there for an early season game and the roof was open, so that was nice. I can only imagine it feels more like a warehouse most of the season when the roof is closed. It's not a terrible stadium, but it's rather unremarkable. The most overrated feature is the swimming pool. Who cares? How many fans actually use it? Total gimmick IMO. The downtown location is good, but there wasn't much going on in downtown Phoenix when I went there (15 years ago). There is a light rail line that goes by the stadium, but it didn't go where I needed to go. They've since switched to artificial turf, so that would be a downvote for me.

2 hours ago, The Mighty Mite said:

Our Sox have a history of bad ownership but looking back the franchise was best under the Comiskey family in the first 20 years and again in the GO GO years. They did suffer after the Black Sox scandal but they had some nice seasons when Jimmy Dykes was managing led by Hall of Famers Luke Appling and Ted Lyons. I was never a fan of Veeck as he traded away a future All Star team after the 1959 AL Championship season. I will always appreciate him stepping in and buying the Sox in 1976 but he was under financed and for some reason he blamed it on bad managers as the Sox had 5 managers in 5 years in his 2nd stint, we saw Paul Richards, Bob Lemon, Larry Doby, Don Kissinger and Tony LaRussa.

2 hours ago, The Mighty Mite said:

Our Sox have a history of bad ownership but looking back the franchise was best under the Comiskey family in the first 20 years and again in the GO GO years. They did suffer after the Black Sox scandal but they had some nice seasons when Jimmy Dykes was managing led by Hall of Famers Luke Appling and Ted Lyons. I was never a fan of Veeck as he traded away a future All Star team after the 1959 AL Championship season. I will always appreciate him stepping in and buying the Sox in 1976 but he was under financed and for some reason he blamed it on bad managers as the Sox had 5 managers in 5 years in his 2nd stint, we saw Paul Richards, Bob Lemon, Larry Doby, Don Kissinger and Tony LaRussa.

Veeck being under financed in his second White Sox ownership was a myth. I was told that he could have easily asked for money from some of his well to do investors to sign some free agents. He didn't do it because he wanted the lowest payroll as possible knowing it would be easier to sell the team after the 1980 season. The media thought the world of him in Chicago and I never understood why.

2 hours ago, 77 Hitmen said:

Here's my next set of stadium visits and reviews. This time, it's for retractable roof ballparks I have visited.

Safeco Field (now T-Mobile Park): Easily the best of the 3 retractable roof ballparks I have been to. The roof was open when I was there and it really felt open air. Great view of the city and Puget Sound from some parts of the ballpark. This was 25 years ago, so I really can't comment on what the area around the ballpark is like. At the time, the Seahawks stadium was under construction, so there really wasn't much to look at from the bus station to the ballpark. Transit access from our downtown hotel was easy as we took an underground "busway" there. I believe that transit line has since been upgraded to an actual subway rail line.

American Family Field: I have only been there with the roof closed. Someday, I'd like to go to a game with the roof open to see what it's like. It's a good stadium. Nothing outstanding and nothing bad. I sat on the 200 level and my seats were great. It was easy to get to the different levels for concessions. One downside is that they don't have 360 access around the concourse. Location is a negative for me. There's absolutely nothing around the ballpark as far as I could tell other than acres of parking lot. Huge tailgating culture - but nothing much for people who don't tailgate. The only way in and out is by car or bus as far as I could tell.

Chase Field: I'd rank this the lowest among these three. I was actually there for an early season game and the roof was open, so that was nice. I can only imagine it feels more like a warehouse most of the season when the roof is closed. It's not a terrible stadium, but it's rather unremarkable. The most overrated feature is the swimming pool. Who cares? How many fans actually use it? Total gimmick IMO. The downtown location is good, but there wasn't much going on in downtown Phoenix when I went there (15 years ago). There is a light rail line that goes by the stadium, but it didn't go where I needed to go. They've since switched to artificial turf, so that would be a downvote for me.

I read a few years ago that the owner of the Brewers said they were happy how their stadium was built but if they had to do it all over again they would have had the stadium built in downtown Milwaukee. Evidently there was one area in the Milwaukee downtown where a stadium could have been built.

38 minutes ago, WBWSF said:

Veeck being under financed in his second White Sox ownership was a myth. I was told that he could have easily asked for money from some of his well to do investors to sign some free agents. He didn't do it because he wanted the lowest payroll as possible knowing it would be easier to sell the team after the 1980 season. The media thought the world of him in Chicago and I never understood why.

According to my research some of Veeck's minority partners were some of the richest people in America at that time but the reason he never went back to them for more financial help after their original investment was because he promised them that he would never do that and he said that he'd turn a profit every year for them.

It was a matter of him giving his word and not be willing to go back on it.

Take that for whatever it's worth to you.

I've never heard anything along the lines of trying to make it easier to sell the club by having the lowest payroll.

1 hour ago, WBWSF said:

Veeck being under financed in his second White Sox ownership was a myth. I was told that he could have easily asked for money from some of his well to do investors to sign some free agents. He didn't do it because he wanted the lowest payroll as possible knowing it would be easier to sell the team after the 1980 season. The media thought the world of him in Chicago and I never understood why.

Exactly, the guy was basically a huckster.

31 minutes ago, The Mighty Mite said:

Exactly, the guy was basically a huckster.

I thought he passed away last year?

yankee stadium (ruth's)
fenway
camden
jacob's field (cleveland)
rate & comiskey
metrodome (minn)
both tiger stadiums
kaufman (royals)
Big A (recent reno)
Oakland Coliseum
Previous Arlington
Safeco (Seattle)
Olympic Stadium (Atlanta)
RFK (DC)
Shea (previous)
Both Milwaukees
Wrigley
Old Busch
Riverfront (Cincinnati)
Dodger
Coors Field (Colorado)
Whatever San Francisco's called

Milwaukee's old park had a great vibe to it. I believe you couldn't see the field from either Arlington or Cleveland's concourses. Dodger Stadium and Kaufman were both cool in that I always saw them on TV as a kid and visiting was a life's dream. Safeco is cool walking by the bullpens. RFK sucked in that from the middle tier, you couldn't see popups for the upper deck overhang.

Riverfront and RFK both sucked in that they were old, worn down, the astroturf in Cincinnati had patches and was fluorescent. The RollerDome sucked, too. Magglio Ordonez left our group comp tickets, as we kept running into the White Sox at the hotel we stayed. That didn't suck. I mostly just remember the seated game experience for most of these. There's often drinking involved, which limits the note-taking. San Fran and Fenway have great neighborhood experiences, as does Seattle, Wrigley. I never got to the Bowling HOFs across from Busch stadium.

Riverfront was one of the cooler fan experiences, everybody dressed in red crossing the Ohio River bridge. Sat near Joe Crede's aunt and cousin at the Sox game in St. Loo.

Great food in Seattle, one real option in Dodger stadium (King Tacos?). If you walk from the Embarcadero in SF, Red's Java Hut was a must stop. My wife and I drank beers in their parking lot during their first modern World Series run, and we fell in love with that team. Rooted for them that year. Saw Curt Schilling no-hit the As into the 9th until Shannon Stewert broke it up with 2 outs.

Milwaukee can heat the stadium to about 30 degrees warmer than the outside temperature. Whenever I joke that I bet they can get it up to about 120 in the summer, whoever I tell that to corrects me that they probably don't have the heat on in the summer.

Was at the new Ryan Field - an architectural and engineering feat. Go Cats.

9 minutes ago, tray said:

Was at the new Ryan Field - an architectural and engineering feat. Go Cats.

The project, with the majority of the funding provided by the Ryan Family without public investment, will set a new standard in college athletics, transforming the traditional stadium model into a year-round community asset.

Patrick George Ryan (born May 1937) is an American billionaire insurance businessman. He is the founder and retired chairman and CEO of Aon.^[3][4] In 2010, he founded Ryan Specialty Group (RSG) as a holding company aimed at providing specialty services to insurance brokers, agents and carriers. RSG's first subsidiary, ThinkRisk, began business in December 2009 to provide underwriting and claims management services for media, technology, advertising and network security.^[5][6]

Edited 23 minutes ago23 min by caulfield12

"Never seen a stadium like this before. And when they say that one of two things is true," Ryan told USA TODAY Sports. "Either we'll be right in making these bold bets. And if we're right, you'll see echoes of it in lots of buildings going forward. And if we're wrong, it'll be one of a kind, the only one of its kind, you know?"

While Ryan is proud of the investment he, his family and their company Ryan Sports Development are making in Northwestern athletics, college fans elsewhere may wonder why they may invest so much into a program that has historically has struggled. The Wildcats have not been ranked since 2020 and with Indiana's resurgence, Northwestern has assumed the mantle of FBS's all-time losingest program.

.

Since then, the school and the Ryan family determined further renovations to a nearly 100-year-old stadium would prove to be more costly than building a brand-new stadium.

The former stadium was demolished in 2024.

"If you look at our academic facilities, our performing arts facilities, everything we try to do with the highest order of excellence," Ryan said. "So, you see that in every type of nanotechnology building, performing arts building, anything. We try to do things to the highest order of excellence."

Hmmm.....basically argues for a brand new stadium model, doesn't it?

“highest order of excellence” mentioned twice

Well, GRF was one of its kind too, but not exactly in a good way

Edited 16 minutes ago16 min by caulfield12

17 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

The project, with the majority of the funding provided by the Ryan Family without public investment, will set a new standard in college athletics, transforming the traditional stadium model into a year-round community asset.

Patrick George Ryan (born May 1937) is an American billionaire insurance businessman. He is the founder and retired chairman and CEO of Aon.^[3][4] In 2010, he founded Ryan Specialty Group (RSG) as a holding company aimed at providing specialty services to insurance brokers, agents and carriers. RSG's first subsidiary, ThinkRisk, began business in December 2009 to provide underwriting and claims management services for media, technology, advertising and network security.^[5][6]

Funded by private equity you say, @caulfield12?

Sorry @tray, I had to…

😉

10 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

We used to buy those cheap scorecards day of game, write out the starting lineups, etc.

Almost nobody except broadcasters and those listening at home on the radio older than 50 would do that anymore.

I’m 32. I like to score games. I scored almost all of the Sox ALDS games this year.