shagar69 Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 They'd love to sign Omar Vizquel for shortstop and Barry Larkin as a 100-something game utilityman, but word is that Vizquel is very close to signing with the White Sox for two years and $8 million to play for fellow Venezuelan shortstop Ozzie Guillen. full article: http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/gammons/story?id=1912558 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hawaiisoxfn Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 I dont think he could be any worse than Valentin. Go for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shagar69 Posted October 30, 2004 Author Share Posted October 30, 2004 yeah, its a good deal. we might be SLIGHTLY overpaying but thats all right. (i think that you could get him for 2.5 mil per) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 Consider the source, but if it's true, I'm all for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 This would be great if it happens. We still got to wait till November 12th or so when you can officially sign FA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3E8 Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 yeah, its a good deal. we might be SLIGHTLY overpaying but thats all right. (i think that you could get him for 2.5 mil per) I agree. I think we could get him for less. If I were GM, I wouldn't do this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 I agree. I think we could get him for less. If I were GM, I wouldn't do this. Anything other than Val is worth it to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowand44 Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 Cool, if this is true this helps solve a top of the order hole and makes our middle infield defense pretty awesome. Makes me happy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shagar69 Posted October 30, 2004 Author Share Posted October 30, 2004 i just hope that by going after vizquel, instead of a renteria or cabrera, KW will now spend the rest of the money after a Top SP, like pavano or perez, not some piece of s*** like ortiz or milton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowand44 Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 i just hope that by going after vizquel, instead of a renteria or cabrera, KW will now spend the rest of the money after a Top SP, like pavano or perez, not some piece of s*** like ortiz or milton I'd rather have Vizquel then cabrera no matter what, orlando is very overrated, imo. Anyways I agree with you, I hope we go after Pavano if not Perez or a trade for a top of the rotation guy, Milton and Ortiz would get hammered here, jmo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3E8 Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 Milton and Ortiz would get hammered here, jmo. I don't think it's just your opinion. Seems to be everyone's except Kenny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T R U Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 Is that saying we would like to sign Larkin too? Or is that in referance to another team? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackie hayes Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 Is that saying we would like to sign Larkin too? Or is that in referance to another team? Supposedly the Red Sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shagar69 Posted October 30, 2004 Author Share Posted October 30, 2004 yeah, originally gammons was talking about how the bosox dont need cabrera since they have ramirez in the minors, they just need a stopgap. he said that larkin or vizquel would work, but vizquel is close to signing with us Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackie hayes Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 This isn't a make-or-break signing either way (the pitching staff is make-or-break), but I still find it hard to believe Vizquel is good enough to merit $4 mil per year. We're talking about one good year in 4. It's a mistake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shagar69 Posted October 30, 2004 Author Share Posted October 30, 2004 This isn't a make-or-break signing either way (the pitching staff is make-or-break), but I still find it hard to believe Vizquel is good enough to merit $4 mil per year. We're talking about one good year in 4. It's a mistake. thats the only way we'll get him though. there are a s***load of teams looking for SS, including the rich teams like the cubs and bosox. they would gladly pay him 5 mil IMO. its best that we sign him early for a reasonable price Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackie hayes Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 thats the only way we'll get him though. there are a s***load of teams looking for SS, including the rich teams like the cubs and bosox. they would gladly pay him 5 mil IMO. its best that we sign him early for a reasonable price If that's the price, let them have him.  The Indians have had him forever now, and they don't think he's worth $4 mil. What info do we have that makes us so much smarter?  EDIT: Btw, if they are willing to pay that much for him, they'll get him, since they'll make an offer before he's allowed to sign w/ the Sox on Nov 12th or thereabouts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shagar69 Posted October 30, 2004 Author Share Posted October 30, 2004 If that's the price, let them have him. The Indians have had him forever now, and they don't think he's worth $4 mil. What info do we have that makes us so much smarter?  EDIT: Btw, if they are willing to pay that much for him, they'll get him, since they'll make an offer before he's allowed to sign w/ the Sox on Nov 12th or thereabouts. the tribe doest want him cuz they got johnny peralta, a young kid, ready to take over for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hitlesswonder Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 This isn't a make-or-break signing either way (the pitching staff is make-or-break), but I still find it hard to believe Vizquel is good enough to merit $4 mil per year. We're talking about one good year in 4. It's a mistake. I agree. Assuming that Vizquel is essentially replacing Harris, the Sox will be paying 4 million to improve the OBP in the 2nd spot by 0.010 (last year Harris was .343 and Viquel .353). The 3 previous years, Vizquel hit no better than Harris last year, and there's no way he's a sure thing at 38 to repeat last year's performance. Defensively, I don't think Vizquel-Uribe is much better than Uribe-Harris.  Vizquel is better than Harris, but getting him doesn't improve the team nearly as much as putting money into a starter or reliever or catcher would. Plus, overpaying by a few million per year adds up. The Sox have already done it with Contreras. Doing it repeatedly will prevent making key improvements like a real major league pitcher at the 5th spot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3E8 Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 Great post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackie hayes Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 the tribe doest want him cuz they got johnny peralta, a young kid, ready to take over for him. Also Brandon Phillips, if he's finally as good as he says he is. But there have been reports that 1) they are preparing to not have Ron Belliard and 2) don't want to rely on both Phillips and Peralta (sp? -- I'm pretty sure there's an h somewhere in there) for success. Actually, there was an article in the Cleveland Plain Dealer suggesting they may pursue Polanco. I don't understand why we wouldn't do the same instead of signing Vizquel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shagar69 Posted October 30, 2004 Author Share Posted October 30, 2004 Also Brandon Phillips, if he's finally as good as he says he is. But there have been reports that 1) they are preparing to not have Ron Belliard and 2) don't want to rely on both Phillips and Peralta (sp? -- I'm pretty sure there's an h somewhere in there) for success. Actually, there was an article in the Cleveland Plain Dealer suggesting they may pursue Polanco. I don't understand why we wouldn't do the same instead of signing Vizquel. well peraltalta will play SS and phillips will play 2b. if they sign polanco he will replace phillips not peralta at SS. IMO, they have more confidence in peralta than philips Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackie hayes Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 well peraltalta will play SS and phillips will play 2b. if they sign polanco he will replace phillips not peralta at SS. IMO, they have more confidence in peralta than philips Okay... Yeah, that's exactly how I imagine it would work (IF they sign Polanco, just speculation by one writer at this point). But they feel that Vizquel at $4 mil is a worse value than someone else (maybe Polanco) at market value. Why should the Sox know any better? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maggsmaggs Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 $ 4 million dollars for a still great fielding SS and a great leader with a solid average/OPB, is a good deal. However, in the article, Gammons says "The White Sox have little money, and Ken Williams is starting at shortstop and trying to find a starter and an outfielder ... " I hope he is wrong about the money part, but I think after we get Visquel we will go after Dye or Hidalgo and a solid starter. I don't think this is raising payroll that much, but I don't know for a fact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hitlesswonder Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 Actually, there was an article in the Cleveland Plain Dealer suggesting they may pursue Polanco. I don't understand why we wouldn't do the same instead of signing Vizquel. I agree. Polanco is around 29 and hit around .300 with 17 HRs, a decent OBP, and plays good defense at 2B. He should be signable for not too much more than 4 million a year and could hit #2 just as well as Vizquel. I think he's much better bet to post decent numbers next season and the season thereafter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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