beck72 Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 Cowley is a different story. He is a decent sportswriter who goes to games and understands the dynamics of a ballclub. That's why an article like this upsets me all of the more. It really didn't need to be done, and it comes off as petty and vindictive. If Lee hurt the dynamics of the Sox, and Cowley was pointing that out, why get upset about the truth, and attack the messenger? If the last quote is true, which prob. is as Cowley said other writers were there and could back up his account, this is good news that Lee is gone. It bodes well for the 2005 Sox and beyond that the right players are still around. BTW- I can see this article as a statement to the critics of this trade as well [not fans, but baseball writers and a few Chi. ones in particular]. Here's a guy who really covers the sox, not like Moronoti, who has inside info that this is a good trade. This could be a statement to the people in his profession-speak the truth and let the chips fall where they may. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 If there is a $3 million difference in annual salary between Perez and Clement, I'd go with the cheaper one. And that 3 million could be used on the other holes that could be filled with players like Alex Cora. Most likely we'll be waiting to see which players are non - tendered on December 20th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beck72 Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 The fact that Cowley is a respected sportswriter carries a ceratin amount of weight with me and this column does as well. The "hatchet job" that mariotti did on the Sox for making this trade just may have been the catalyst that inspired Cowley to spill his guts about the Carlos situation. And call it a hunch, but I'd bet Cowley checked with Buehrle before using his name in that manner. He never actually quoted Mark, but he did report on his observations. I may be wrong on this, though. Beat me to the punch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted December 15, 2004 Author Share Posted December 15, 2004 And that 3 million could be used on the other holes that could be filled with players like Alex Cora. Most likely we'll be waiting to see which players are non - tendered on December 20th. I don't think there will be any non-tender pitchers out there any better than Schoenewicz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 I'm surprised more writers hadn't talked about Carlos before, and that stuff like this didn't come out sooner. But to blame Cowley is a little much. Most likely he couldn't write a "hatchet job" while Lee was a member of the Sox. But if this is the truth, what exactly is the problem? If this is true, and we have no reason to believe it is not, then why couldn't Cowley write about it when it happened? The timing on this is weak. Its going to bring out the people with conspiracy theories, who will think the Sox put Cowley up to this to ease the pr hit they may take. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beck72 Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 If this is true, and we have no reason to believe it is not, then why couldn't Cowley write about it when it happened? If his beat is writing about the sox, publishing dirty laundry about the sox isn't exactly a good career move. "Whistle blowing" in general doesn't help a lot of people. It usually happens after the fact, and for a variety of reasons [life threatening illness perhaps?] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lvjeremylv Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 If this is true, and we have no reason to believe it is not, then why couldn't Cowley write about it when it happened? The timing on this is weak. Its going to bring out the people with conspiracy theories, who will think the Sox put Cowley up to this to ease the pr hit they may take. Anybody who calls themselves a White Sox fan should be very happy with the trade. And if they're not, they will be in time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 Hmmm....wonder what our collective reply to this article would have been had it been written by Moronotti? I hate when this kind of story is written after a guy is gone. Mariotti would have been vilified and the article dismissed as crap. But articles like this is what gets a pat on the head from the team and access later to better stories. Better journalists are able to ignore whatever insider tips they are getting and confirm and really check out the veracity of the information. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 If this is true, and we have no reason to believe it is not, then why couldn't Cowley write about it when it happened? The timing on this is weak. Its going to bring out the people with conspiracy theories, who will think the Sox put Cowley up to this to ease the pr hit they may take. You just stole my question Dick. Is he afraid to upset the players? Or did he finally get the chance to even a score? Don't get me wrong at all. I don't doubt this stuff at all. Many, many people had the same feelings about Carlos being lazy and selfish, and it showed on the field. The timing of it bothers me. The whole article wreaks of having an ulterior motive, and I don't like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthsox Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 LOL!!! Too F'ing funny!!! I knew since we weren't a winner in this trade that it would become common knowledge by Friday that CLee was pure evil. Looks like my prediction was dead on spot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 If his beat is writing about the sox, publishing dirty laundry about the sox isn't exactly a good career move. "Whistle blowing" in general doesn't help a lot of people. It usually happens after the fact, and for a variety of reasons [life threatening illness perhaps?] writing a story that is pro management would be a bad career move? The better stories aren't from the players "I just went out and played hard. Thank God for my talents" The stories that get noticed are the scoops on trades, mid season moves and the kind of stuff you get from access to OZ, KW, JR, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 If his beat is writing about the sox, publishing dirty laundry about the sox isn't exactly a good career move. "Whistle blowing" in general doesn't help a lot of people. It usually happens after the fact, and for a variety of reasons [life threatening illness perhaps?] But to pop off after the guy goes away makes Cowley look like a punk. If it wasn't fit to print when it happened, then it shouldn't be fit to print now. What is the purpose of this article? How many other players does Cowley consider assholes on the Sox? I'm sure there's a few. If they get traded away will we hear about them as well? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthsox Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 But to pop off after the guy goes away makes Cowley look like a punk. If it wasn't fit to print when it happened, then it shouldn't be fit to print now. What is the purpose of this article? How many other players does Cowley consider assholes on the Sox? I'm sure there's a few. If they get traded away will we hear about them as well? Cowley has always been the funnel for leaks on this team, whether from players or management. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3E8 Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 What does asno mean? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted December 15, 2004 Author Share Posted December 15, 2004 But to pop off after the guy goes away makes Cowley look like a punk. If it wasn't fit to print when it happened, then it shouldn't be fit to print now. What is the purpose of this article? How many other players does Cowley consider assholes on the Sox? I'm sure there's a few. If they get traded away will we hear about them as well? I still think mariotti's hatchet job on the Sox, and all the negatives expressed by the so called baseball experts across the country is what motivated this column. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OfficerKarkovice Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 What does asno mean? Donkey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 I still think mariotti's hatchet job on the Sox, and all the negatives expressed by the so called baseball experts across the country is what motivated this column. You're probably right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted December 15, 2004 Author Share Posted December 15, 2004 My biggest question about all of this info on Carlos is this. If he refused to position himself where the coaches wanted him, and that resulted in hits for the other team, why didn't Ozzie pull a Billy Martin and and jerk his arrogant ass off the field right then and there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted December 15, 2004 Author Share Posted December 15, 2004 Steff, you are strangely quiet on this subject. I'd love to "hear" your input on this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 My biggest question about all of this info on Carlos is this. If he refused to position himself where the coaches wanted him, and that resulted in hits for the other team, why didn't Ozzie pull a Billy Martin and and jerk his arrogant ass off the field right then and there? What was the alternative..? Carlos - for whatever reason cause I can't figure it out - was a fan favorite out there. In between his smoke breaks under the wall he'd toss balls, wave at the kids and girls, always smiling, yukking it up, etc, etc... plus.. he was producing. Ozzie had his hands full with all all the other team issues. I'm not surprised they didn't address Carlos previously. As for Cowley.. it's a shame he decided to do this now. It's like reporting that MJ cheated on his wife 10 years ago, IMO. No purpose but to start s***. There was no reason for the fans to know this. The trade - when a pitcher is signed - makes sense and, IMO, it should have been left at that. It makes the Sox look like they got rid of him because he was a clubhouse problem and not because it was the right thing to do. A few of Cowley's peers are not too happy with him this morning either.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBlackSox8 Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 Magglio left on bad terms "supposedly"....and now this little fiasco with Lee leaving on "bad" terms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 Steff, you are strangely quiet on this subject. I'd love to "hear" your input on this. I was thinking.. sometimes I author someting and read it over and think to myself.. "I probably shouldn't say that".. so I had to edit a bit. I'll go on record as saying that I did/do like Carlos. I wish him well. And that's all I have to say about that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 Those last about 10 lines about Carlos only wanting to pad his stats, saying he isn't a winner, and saying he hated "everyone" I just find a little hard to beleive. Once again someone seems to have leave the Sox on bad terms. One thing about Cowley... he doesn't make s*** up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted December 15, 2004 Author Share Posted December 15, 2004 Those last about 10 lines about Carlos only wanting to pad his stats, saying he isn't a winner, and saying he hated "everyone" I just find a little hard to beleive. Once again someone seems to have leave the Sox on bad terms. I do think it was time for this team to have a big shake up, and I think this was a good deal, just sad it had to happen like this. That "I hate everybody" thing was a direct quote. He can't say he said it if he didn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted December 15, 2004 Author Share Posted December 15, 2004 I was thinking.. sometimes I author someting and read it over and think to myself.. "I probably shouldn't say that".. so I had to edit a bit. I'll go on record as saying that I did/do like Carlos. I wish him well. And that's all I have to say about that. Thanks. I was always a Carlos fan. I'm sorry to hear about all this, but it does give a new twist to the trade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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