VAfan Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 I see 2 big things that have hurt us, and I trace them to the end of July. 1. Trade talk. We were getting everyone, and ended up with Geoff Blum. That's pitiful, frankly. But then the Griffey talk actually heated up b/c he's a guy who could pass through waivers. All of this has to make the current team feel inadequate. At the very least, it is not a vote of confidence, by management, or even us fans who were clamoring for the new guy. 2. Bad roster moves. Blum and Adkins up, Gload and Harris down, Everett get's hurt. All this happened together. I'm okay with Blum, but why did he suddenly get ABs everywhere when Ross Gload, who can actually hit, was kept in AAA recuperating long after he was healthy, and then didn't play when we finally brought him up? Then, when Everett went down, we were left with 12 position players and a pitcher we didn't need and didn't use. Our offense went into an immediate funk. 2, 4, 3, 2, 2, 2 runs in a 6-day stretch. Amazingly we scratched out 4 wins. But it didn't bode well going into Boston, where we hit better, but couldn't pitch. Then we get a win washed out and return home to meet the Twins. Now Pods goes down and again we're back to using Timo Perez. 2 more losses follow for our first 4 game losing streak. How do we get out of this funk? 1. Fix the roster. Send Adkins down tomorrow after his performance tonight. Ozzie will never trust him, and we don't need his 4+ innings in 2 weeks to rest the pitchers. Bring up another hitter so we don't see Timo Perez again holding down the offense. The choices are: Gload, Harris, Young, Owens, Borchard. At this point I'd lean toward new blood just to provide a spark. 2. End the trade speculation or make a trade. The Griffey rumors were allowed to fester far too long by Kenny Williams. When it wasn't happening, he should have put an end to the speculation. It would have been a vote of confidence in his club. Instead his message has been the Sox aren't good enough. Neither of these fixes may work. We may just have to hunker down and weather the storm. With our pitching, that should be possible. But something needs to change the dynamic, because at the end of July our team energy just went into the toilet and it hasn't come out yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Honda Civic Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 QUOTE(VAfan @ Aug 17, 2005 -> 12:43 AM) 2. End the trade speculation or make a trade. The Griffey rumors were allowed to fester far too long by Kenny Williams. When it wasn't happening, he should have put an end to the speculation. It would have been a vote of confidence in his club. Instead his message has been the Sox aren't good enough. This may be the most important one. They need to come out and say "these are our guys." Or they need to get something done, YESTERDAY. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 This team is playing like they're expecting a spark from someone, and I agree that the trade discussions has gotten completely out of control. When every other word Hawk says is in regards to Griffey Jr., something needs to be done. As Calipari said to the Celtics "Larry Bird isn't walking through those f***ing doors". It's becoming more apparent we're living or dying with the core roster we've had all year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kev211 Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 (edited) Had they played sundays game and won I think that would have been huge on confidence and this woudnt be so bad right now we might have actually won yesterday or today. Edited August 17, 2005 by ScottPodRulez22 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 QUOTE(ScottPodRulez22 @ Aug 17, 2005 -> 05:48 AM) Had they played sundays game and won I think that would have been huge on confidence and this woudnt be so bad right now we might have actually won yesterday or today. Shoulda, coulda........There was absolutely no guarantee that we would have won on Sunday. We need to stop making excuses, and just win some f***ing games. Buehrle needs to step up tomorrow, and pretend like he needs to throw a shut-out to win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kev211 Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 QUOTE(fathom @ Aug 17, 2005 -> 12:50 AM) Shoulda, coulda........There was absolutely no guarantee that we would have won on Sunday. We need to stop making excuses, and just win some f***ing games. Buehrle needs to step up tomorrow, and pretend like he needs to throw a shut-out to win. No reason to pretend he HAS to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Aug 17, 2005 -> 05:50 AM) 1.So what do you consider the moves made by Minny, NY, Boston, Aneheim, or Oakland? If we were pitiful, then what were they? There was just nothing to be done, so get over it. I hate Timo just as much as the next Sox fan, but it is not Timo's fault Ozzie uses him like he is a latin Scott Podsednik. In the right situation, on a limited basis, Timo can help the team. I would however have already sent Adkins down for Baj, and see what happens with that. I would say that a lot of our guys blew their load in the first half of the season with the great effort they gave almost every night. The trade deadline would have been a great chance for KW to add a spark or two to the offense. I still want to know when we knew we'd likely put Pods on the DL. To me, it seems like this has been a long time going. If that's true, I can't believe KW didn't try to acquire another outfielder like Eric Byrnes, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ginger Kid Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 Honestly, I don't know what the problem is so I can't offer a solution. I do know that all teams go through a rough period and that back in April and May and June the Sox were quick to point out that the real test will come when things go bad. Facing a possible sweep with Santana pitching tomorrow, I'd say this qualifies as that "test" period. Maybe that's why Ozzie wants to stay with his guys and not hit the panic button. He believed in them in the early part of the season so why should he doubt them now? I think the great thing about the Sox this season has been that there are no superstars - they win as a team and they lose as a team. Keep the faith -- this team will pull out of this funk and they don't need some savior from Cinncinatti to do it. They're still playing hard and that's a great sign. In August and Septembers past it seemed they just laid down for the Twins. That's not happening right now. They're a little banged up and they're in a slump. What else can you say? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 Maybe PK should find a slumpbuster for the entire team Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Honda Civic Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ Aug 17, 2005 -> 12:54 AM) Maybe PK should find a slumpbuster for the entire team Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Aug 17, 2005 -> 05:52 AM) End of Story. Period. Over. Done. WIN f***ING GAMES, GET INTO THE PLAYOFFS, AND BATS WAKE THE f*** UP. Exactly, I'm so sick of hearing excuses or rationalizations coming from the Sox. We knew this would be a big stretch of our season with the games vs NYY, Twins, and Red Sox. So far, our offense has been a total flop. Not only do the Twins seem a lot more focused than the Sox, but they also look like they're playing looser and having more fun. We had a chance to end any Twins thoughts at the division this week. All we've done is wake the sleeping giant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ginger Kid Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Aug 16, 2005 -> 10:57 PM) OMG! I'm in love! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleepyWhiteSox Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 I saw the same team tonight (sorta) from early on, minus that timely hit to finish them off that we were getting a bit lucky with early on... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish71 Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 I just got back from this game. 16 innings to watch Jon unravel in one inning. How can a championship caliber team have so many holes. This team is not sucking because of trade talks. That is just plain foolish. Every year teams that are going for it deal with trade talk. We are losing because of good old corpseball. Nothing like watching sox players slam their helmets in disgust after failing time and time again to drive in runners in scoring position with less than 2 outs. High popups, K after K with men on. I felt like I was at last years August twins series. In fact Radke pretty much did the same thing. All I have heard all year long is that Crede is a streaky hitter and that he is a second half hitter. Well Mr. Crede is batting now .136 in August. That is about as much of an auto-out as you can get. And stop giving the excuse that he is playing gold glove defense. He is misplaying basic plays now. It would be better to sit him and play Blum at 3rd. If this is because his back hurts then DL him and get him better. Jermaine Dye has completely disappeared again. He is now batting under .200 in August. I watched him K silly again tonight. And his defense is suspect. Now later today we face Santana who could put us at a 5 game losing streak. Then we get the Yanks who will probably hit better in the favorable conditions of the cell. We are on the verge of a very long losing streak if we dont tread lightly. I have a funny feeling if we got Griffey he probably would of went better than our best hitter at 2 for 7. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Aug 16, 2005 -> 10:16 PM) Question to throw out there. Would you actually like to see the Sox lead get to about 6 games on September 15th?? While that is number would be very low, it would certainly give the Sox a kick in the ass, and maybe more motivation to pick up the pace. Im not saying I want it to be at 6 games, but would it be the worst thing in the world for this team right now? no, cause it means they've been tanking it down the stretch and thats the last thing I wnat to see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Aug 17, 2005 -> 06:16 AM) Question to throw out there. Would you actually like to see the Sox lead get to about 6 games on September 15th?? While that is number would be very low, it would certainly give the Sox a kick in the ass, and maybe more motivation to pick up the pace. Im not saying I want it to be at 6 games, but would it be the worst thing in the world for this team right now? No, I'd rather the lead stays about 8 or 9 the rest of the way. The closer the lead gets, the less I trust Ozzie to actually ever take our a starting pitcher. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 The one thing that this prolonged slump we've been in could hopefully do is make KW, and especially Ozzie, realize this team is not the greatest collection of talent ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ginger Kid Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Aug 16, 2005 -> 11:13 PM) Nothing like watching sox players slam their helmets in disgust after failing time and time again to drive in runners in scoring position with less than 2 outs. High popups, K after K with men on. I felt like I was at last years August twins series. In fact Radke pretty much did the same thing. That's called frustration. We vent on message boards, they slam their helmets. And last year, the Sox never would've rallied against Radke to take the lead. Never. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleepyWhiteSox Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 QUOTE(fathom @ Aug 17, 2005 -> 01:21 AM) The one thing that this prolonged slump we've been in could hopefully do is make KW, and especially Ozzie, realize this team is not the greatest collection of talent ever. I've never heard either say anything that even sounded as if they thought that... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleepyWhiteSox Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Aug 17, 2005 -> 01:16 AM) Question to throw out there. Would you actually like to see the Sox lead get to about 6 games on September 15th?? While that is number would be very low, it would certainly give the Sox a kick in the ass, and maybe more motivation to pick up the pace. Im not saying I want it to be at 6 games, but would it be the worst thing in the world for this team right now? HELL NO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Aug 17, 2005 -> 06:16 AM) Question to throw out there. Would you actually like to see the Sox lead get to about 6 games on September 15th?? While that is number would be very low, it would certainly give the Sox a kick in the ass, and maybe more motivation to pick up the pace. Im not saying I want it to be at 6 games, but would it be the worst thing in the world for this team right now? Also, in a town known to be pessimistic about their own teams, I have a bad feeling that there would be a lot of booing at games, etc. After just taking a nice long shower, it made me laugh to think how a lot of us are so upset right now, even though we have an 11 game lead in the division and 13 over the Twins. Of course, by no means do I think the division is clinched. However, there's still a long way to go before we're in serious danger of blowing the lead. Does anyone else want to join my philosophy that if this team doesn't make the playoffs, then they just flat out didn't deserve to make it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 QUOTE(fathom @ Aug 17, 2005 -> 01:47 AM) Also, in a town known to be pessimistic about their own teams, I have a bad feeling that there would be a lot of booing at games, etc. After just taking a nice long shower, it made me laugh to think how a lot of us are so upset right now, even though we have an 11 game lead in the division and 13 over the Twins. Of course, by no means do I think the division is clinched. However, there's still a long way to go before we're in serious danger of blowing the lead. Does anyone else want to join my philosophy that if this team doesn't make the playoffs, then they just flat out didn't deserve to make it? I'd say that philosophy is a given. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 QUOTE(YASNY @ Aug 17, 2005 -> 06:49 AM) I'd say that philosophy is a given. I mean to the point that I wouldn't even be upset, and more find it humorous. I'm sure this board would be in a total meltdown if the Sox don't make the playoffs. However, even as negative as I am, I think it would be one of those train wrecks that you just have to sit back and be amazed at. I pray that this situation never occurs though, and we make the playoffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish71 Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 If they blow a double digit lead and dont make the playoffs after this start a few things happen. KW is out of a job. There is about 13K at the Cell next year. And Soxfest is a bloodbath. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RibbieRubarb Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 I think people also underestimated what the presence of Frank Thomas in the line-up means for the other hitters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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