BBC: God told me to do it

[kapkomet]

BBC: God Told Bush to Invade Afghanistan and Iraq

 

LONDON (AFP) - US  President George W. Bush allegedly said God told him to invade  Iraq and  Afghanistan, a new BBC documentary will reveal, according to details.

 

Bush made the claim when he met Palestinian leader Mahmud Abbas and then foreign minister Nabil Shaath in June 2003, the ministers told the documentary series to be broadcast in Britain later this month.

 

The US leader also told them he had been ordered by God to create a Palestinian state, the ministers said.

 

Shaath, now the Palestinian information minister, said: "  President Bush said to all of us: 'I'm driven with a mission from God.

 

'God would tell me, 'George, go and fight those terrorists in Afghanistan'.'

 

"And I did, and then God would tell me, 'George, go and end the tyranny in Iraq...' And I did.

 

"'And now, again, I feel God's words coming to me, 'Go get the Palestinians their state and get the Israelis their security, and get peace in the Middle East.' And by God I'm gonna do it'," said Shaath.

 

Abbas, who was also at the meeting in the Egyptian resort of Sharm al-Sheikh, recalled how the president told him: "I have a moral and religious obligation.

 

"So I will get you a Palestinian state."

 

A BBC spokesman said the content of the programme had been put to the White House but it had refused to comment on a private conversation.

 

The three-part series, "Elusive Peace:  Israel and the Arabs", charts the attempts to bring peace to the Middle East, from former US president  Bill Clinton's peace talks in 1999-2000 to Israel's withdrawal from the Gaza strip.

 

The programme speaks to presidents and prime ministers, their generals and ministers, about what happened behind closed doors as the peace talks failed and the intifada grew.

 

The series is due to be screened in Britain on October 10, 17 and 24.

 

Um. Wow.

[Soxy]

I'm hoping that isn't true.

 

*Really* hoping.

 

I gotta go, God just told me to buy some Ben and Jerry's. . .

[kapkomet]

I'm hoping that isn't true.

 

*Really* hoping.

 

I gotta go, God just told me to buy some Ben and Jerry's. . .

God told me to tell you to buy some for me too.

 

 

Ice Cream is yummy.

 

Soxy, me too. I just do not even want this to be true.

[Queen Prawn]

I really hope that is not true.

[Cali]

"George W. Bush. This is GOD......fry Jones....."

 

Hope some people got that.

 

Anyway I'm sure this will totally blow over and no one will question the insanity of it. But you know, If I went on a killing spree and said God told me to do it. Probably get the chair. I'm just saying....

[kapkomet]

Personally, I think it's BS, because why would he tell that to Abbas, a Muslim? I mean if he were talking to Falwell, or Robertson, fine, I could see that. But what gain would there be to say something like that to a Muslim?

 

Of course, this is probably all out of context too. Something to the effect of, I prayed about it, and that was the conclusion that God led me to... and now, it's this.

[FlaSoxxJim]

Personally, I think it's BS, because why would he tell that to Abbas, a Muslim?  I mean if he were talking to Falwell, or Robertson, fine, I could see that.  But what gain would there be to say something like that to a Muslim?

 

Of course, this is probably all out of context too.  Something to the effect of, I prayed about it, and that was the conclusion that God led me to... and now, it's this.

 

I think you are being naive, Kap. This is unsettling to be sure, but hardly revelatory by any stretch.

 

Bush is seen as Messianic by the religious right (which makes his apparent betrayal of their trust in nominating Meiers that much harder for them to swallow). And he very much believes – or at least hopes to convince others – that he is literally a mouthpiece of God.

 

There was an epic length NYT Magazine article by Ron Suskind back before the election going into all of this:

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/10/17/magazine...5070&oref=login

 

(Subscription required but well worth the time to read.)

 

A belief that Bush has God actually whispering in his ear goes a long way toward explaining the convoction he has in his "gut feelings" and "instincts," regardless of what empiracal evidence or a room full of advisors tell him. It took Kerry to point out to the American audiencein the first debate that you can be certain about something and still be wrong, but Bush thinks it doesn't apply to him because there's a higherpower calling the shots.

 

Here's the lead in to the Suskind piece, to hopefully interest you enough to read the rest:

 

Bruce Bartlett, a domestic policy adviser to Ronald Reagan and a treasury official for the first President Bush, told me recently that ''if Bush wins, there will be a civil war in the Republican Party starting on Nov. 3.'' The nature of that conflict, as Bartlett sees it? Essentially, the same as the one raging across much of the world: a battle between modernists and fundamentalists, pragmatists and true believers, reason and religion.

 

''Just in the past few months,'' Bartlett said, ''I think a light has gone off for people who've spent time up close to Bush: that this instinct he's always talking about is this sort of weird, Messianic idea of what he thinks God has told him to do.'' Bartlett, a 53-year-old columnist and self-described libertarian Republican who has lately been a champion for traditional Republicans concerned about Bush's governance, went on to say: ''This is why George W. Bush is so clear-eyed about Al Qaeda and the Islamic fundamentalist enemy. He believes you have to kill them all. They can't be persuaded, that they're extremists, driven by a dark vision. He understands them, because he's just like them. . . .

 

''This is why he dispenses with people who confront him with inconvenient facts,'' Bartlett went on to say. ''He truly believes he's on a mission from God. Absolute faith like that overwhelms a need for analysis. The whole thing about faith is to believe things for which there is no empirical evidence.'' Bartlett paused, then said, ''But you can't run the world on faith.''

Edited October 7, 2005 by FlaSoxxJim

[kapkomet]

Thanks for the link. I'll read the whole thing tomorrow at work when I'm bored.

[KipWellsFan]

I'm hesitant to believe those telling this, but George was the one who said this

 

Tomorrow, I will take an oath and deliver an inaugural address. ... I will speak about freedom. This is the cause that unites our country and gives hope to the world and will lead us to a future of peace. We have a calling from beyond the stars to stand for freedom, and America will always be faithful to that cause.

http://www.soxtalk.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=28942

 

I definitely consider it a possibility that he said the aforementioned and if he did he's certifiable, tricking the religious right into voting for him, or he's actually had conversations with God. I don't have a hard time eliminating one of those possibilities from the choices.

[KipWellsFan]

White House denies Bush God claim

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4317498.stm

[Flash Tizzle]

Why don't voices from God ever tell their recepients to do something completely outrageous--like taking a s*** ontop a table?

 

/obscure?

[The Ginger Kid]

This really shakes my faith in God. Out of 300 million Americans, George W. Bush is the best he could come up with? Noah was the s*** and there's no questioning the stones on Moses.

 

And how could God make such a terrible foreign policy blunder by invading Iraq and setting off an intractible fight and eventual civil war? Am I wrong to question the master's design as administered by his prophet George?

 

And that's another thing, the name: Job, Noah, Abraham, Moses...George?

 

Something smells fishy here.

 

Wait...maybe it's not GOD talking to W. Maybe it's that other fellah...you know, the one who lives down there?

[Kyyle23]

Noah was the s*** and there's no questioning the stones on Moses.

 

LMAO, quote of the month-worthy.

[FlaSoxxJim]

Noah was the s*** and there's no questioning the stones on Moses.

 

And we all know a rolling Stone gathers Noah Moses.

[SpringfieldFan]

In my eyes anyone who actually believes the president thinks he hears God actually talking into his ear is more likely to be crazy then the president would be. It is possible to have moral conviction based on deep faith, introspection, and prayer and not have it mean its like a Burns/Denver movie.

 

''This is why George W. Bush is so clear-eyed about Al Qaeda and the Islamic fundamentalist enemy. He believes you have to kill them all. They can't be persuaded, that they're extremists, driven by a dark vision. He understands them, because he's just like them. . . .

 

First, if he were "just like them" there wouldn't even be an Iraq or Afghanistan anymore. Secondly, as far as the "fundamentalist enemy" (meaning the terror networks) - he's damn right you have to kill them all. There will be no white flags that end this. If that means I get called a warmonger, a hater, and ignorant- well then I accept those labels with pride.

 

SFF

[The Ginger Kid]

In my eyes anyone who actually believes the president thinks he hears God actually talking into his ear is more likely to be crazy then the president would be.  It is possible to have moral conviction based on deep faith, introspection, and prayer and not have it mean its like a Burns/Denver movie.

First, if he were "just like them" there wouldn't even be an Iraq or Afghanistan anymore.  Secondly, as far as the "fundamentalist enemy" (meaning the terror networks) - he's damn right you have to kill them all.  There will be no white flags that end this.  If that means I get called a warmonger, a hater, and ignorant- well then I accept those labels with pride.

 

SFF

 

Then you must be pretty disappointed that he invaded Iraq since there was no fundamentalist issue there until we went to war. I would guess that you also agree that the fight should've been taken to Iran, Saudi Arabia and Syria instead, longtime supporters of fundamentalist terrorism and hotbeds of anti-American sentiment. No?

[longshot7]

Howard Stern was right - Bush is taking orders from his imaginary friend, named "God."

 

It's almost unbelievable, but then I think about Bush. It's very believable.

[Balance]

Why don't voices from God ever tell their recepients to do something completely outrageous--like taking a s*** ontop a table?

 

/obscure?

Wasn't that George Carlin?

 

"Why doesn't God tell people to do things like take a s*** on the salad bar at Wendy's?"