w/o a doubt it was the todd ritchie deal. he was like 1-11 for us

That trade set the White Sox back several years. And while it's impossible to guess whether Williams may have overlooked Colon (among other deals) if Wells and Fogg remained on the club, those two would have been welcomed additions to the 02' rotation; 03' as well.

Another questionable one was Foulke for Cotts and Koch trade. There were some other minor prospects who sucked in that deal also.

I dunno, we lost 1 year of Foulke before he hit FA right? Yes, Koch sucked. But Cotts had a dominant 05 to help us win a ring and has been turned into another hard thrower who may well wind up being another good releiver.

I dunno, we lost 1 year of Foulke before he hit FA right? Yes, Koch sucked. But Cotts had a dominant 05 to help us win a ring and has been turned into another hard thrower who may well wind up being another good releiver.

 

Yep, at least the trade resulted in a huge cog for our WS team. It's funny how KW went after Koch because he wanted a hard thrower in the bullpen. Koch is similar to a lot of our relievers now....declining velocity, shaky command, and trouble getting the big out.

That trade set the White Sox back several years. And while it's impossible to guess whether Williams may have overlooked Colon (among other deals) if Wells and Fogg remained on the club, those two would have been welcomed additions to the 02' rotation; 03' as well.

Liefer deserved better...

another one is how about the signing of colon. colon pitched 1 season for us, and all the expectations we had of winning the world series and such, he went 13-12 or somethin around there, and we missed the playoffs

another one is how about the signing of colon. colon pitched 1 season for us, and all the expectations we had of winning the world series and such, he went 13-12 or somethin around there, and we missed the playoffs

KW traded garbage for Colon. It was one of his better trades. The 2003 team had a lot of talent. It should have made the playoffs.

I dunno, we lost 1 year of Foulke before he hit FA right? Yes, Koch sucked. But Cotts had a dominant 05 to help us win a ring and has been turned into another hard thrower who may well wind up being another good releiver.

Oh, I know, but for a while there it seemed to be a bad trade because of how bad Koch pitched, but Koch likely sucked because of that mysterious disease he had http://www.ktvu.com/news/9264350/detail.html

Edited May 29, 200718 yr by BearSox

Let's go back a little further. Rich Gossage and Terry Forster for one year of Richie Zisk and the forgetttable Silvio Martinez. One of Bill Veeck's money-dictated moves, and probably the worst.

Let's go back a little further. Rich Gossage and Terry Forster for one year of Richie Zisk and the forgetttable Silvio Martinez. One of Bill Veeck's money-dictated moves, and probably the worst.

Goose and Forster would have been 1 year guys as well. 1977 was a fun season. Did you know that Forster hit .576 in 1972, the year before the DH and was a career .397 hitter?

Edited May 29, 200718 yr by Dick Allen

Oh, I know, but for a while there it seemed to be a bad trade because of how bad Koch pitched, but Koch likely sucked because of that mysterious disease he had http://www.ktvu.com/news/9264350/detail.html

I dunno, I totally understand Mr. Koch's condition...but i'm still uncertain as to how exactly that leads ot you losing 7-8 mph off your fastball in 1 summer.

I dunno, I totally understand Mr. Koch's condition...but i'm still uncertain as to how exactly that leads ot you losing 7-8 mph off your fastball in 1 summer.

I read that article a long time ago, but I think I recall reading that this certain disease causing loss of strength.

Chris Young is going to be a damn good player in this league, and is definitely worth more than Mr. 102-108.

 

Young has been fantastic this year -- a .278/.317/.470 line in about 150 at-bats including 17 extra basehits already, that would rank second on the Sox -- and figures to only get better.

 

Six years of, at worst, a Mike Cameron type player or four years of a league average pitcher making $10 million annually? I'll take the former. It'll never be a terrible trade because Vazquez as a league average innings eater holds value, but man, this organization will -- actually, already is -- regret(ing) the day it traded Chris Young.

Young has been fantastic this year -- a .278/.317/.470 line in about 150 at-bats including 17 extra basehits already, that would rank second on the Sox -- and figures to only get better.

 

Six years of, at worst, a Mike Cameron type player or four years of a league average pitcher making $10 million annually? I'll take the former. It'll never be a terrible trade because Vazquez as a league average innings eater holds value, but man, this organization will -- actually, already is -- regret(ing) the day it traded Chris Young.

 

Couldn't agree more. Our outfield -- RIGHT NOW -- needs a young player who can hit, run and field. THAT player is in Arizona, and he's named Chris Young. He'll get better, too.

 

In his place is the guy who has been rewarded for mediocrity. IF -- and it's a big IF -- the signing of that turd to an $11 million deal prevents us from signing guys who actually have ACHIEVED things for this team -- and are critical to its makeup (Buehrle, Garland) -- the trade becomes even worse.

 

And just so I'm totally clear about my position: I don't think Vazquez has underachieved. I think this is who he is, and has been, for about 6 years now. His stuff isn't excellent. The view to the contrary is a myth. Here's why: if you continue to hang off-speed pitches -- that is, throw curveballs that don't curve and sliders that don't slide -- you're not underachieving. Your stuff just isn't that consistently good. That's the guy I see.

 

I get angry just thinking about that trade. I did the day it happened. And I do right now.

Um...man, that is the single most 1-sided deal ever.

 

 

I think Liriano/Bonser/Nathan takes the cake there.

 

Don't forget Sean Lowe, he was a gritty fifth starter who actually pitched some big innings for us. Ironic that we traded away three "starters" and got half of one back, since Ritchie went down to injuries after pitching in horrible luck (think Danks' first month).

 

 

 

Couldn't agree more. Our outfield -- RIGHT NOW -- needs a young player who can hit, run and field. THAT player is in Arizona, and he's named Chris Young. He'll get better, too.

 

In his place is the guy who has been rewarded for mediocrity. IF -- and it's a big IF -- the signing of that turd to an $11 million deal prevents us from signing guys who actually have ACHIEVED things for this team -- and are critical to its makeup (Buehrle, Garland) -- the trade becomes even worse.

 

And just so I'm totally clear about my position: I don't think Vazquez has underachieved. I think this is who he is, and has been, for about 6 years now. His stuff isn't excellent. The view to the contrary is a myth. Here's why: if you continue to hang off-speed pitches -- that is, throw curveballs that don't curve and sliders that don't slide -- you're not underachieving. Your stuff just isn't that consistently good. That's the guy I see.

 

I get angry just thinking about that trade. I did the day it happened. And I do right now.

 

 

We'll never know if CY could have put up similar numbers this year in the more competitive, pitching-dominated AL Central this year...maybe, maybe not.

 

I guess we'll get a hint if BA is traded to an NL team and ends up becoming a regular.

let's remember this is a franchise that traded away Johnny Callsion, Earl Battey, Norm Cash, Denny McClain, Terry Forster, Rich Gossage, Brian Downing and many other solid players.

 

And don't forget Hawk traded Bobby Bonilla for Jose DeLeon.

 

sending McClain to Detroit was one of the worst ever.

let's remember this is a franchise that traded away Johnny Callsion, Earl Battey, Norm Cash, Denny McClain, Terry Forster, Rich Gossage, Brian Downing and many other solid players.

 

And don't forget Hawk traded Bobby Bonilla for Jose DeLeon.

 

sending McClain to Detroit was one of the worst ever.

 

 

Baldwin for Onan Masaoka and the wrong Berry/Barry

 

Foulke/Johnson for Koch and Cotts (although Neal saved that one, it still cost us in 2003)

 

Cory Snyder

 

Gary Redus a Bedtime Story (just wanted to type that)

 

Royce Clayton for Myette (not on talent, but for disruption of team chemistry and displacing Valentin)

I think Liriano/Bonser/Nathan takes the cake there.

Remarkably, for such a devastating deal they've rebounded quickly. It's not unreasonable to suggest the trade may have cost them a chance at two division titles. Not bad considering the players involved. In an odd way, San Francisco actually benefited from their absence with a medicore record which led to the drafting of Lincecum.

 

Now, let's see whether Young's absence will be voided with additional prospects in the coming seasons. Not in the same manner as SF, but in terms of making up for a past mistake.

Edited May 30, 200718 yr by Flash Tizzle

Now, let's see whether Young's absence will be voided with additional prospects in the coming seasons. Not in the same manner as SF, but in terms of making up for a past mistake.

In 1997 the White Sox had 7 of the first 62 picks in the draft. I'm not going to hold my breath.

In 1997 the White Sox had 7 of the first 62 picks in the draft. I'm not going to hold my breath.

 

 

Ah yes, Jason Dellaero taken before Lance Berkman, and Garland ended up being the only major "impact" player of that draft, and he wasn't even a Sox pick.

another one is how about the signing of colon. colon pitched 1 season for us, and all the expectations we had of winning the world series and such, he went 13-12 or somethin around there, and we missed the playoffs

The Sox gave up El Duque, Rocky Biddle and Antonio Osuna. How in god sakes is that a bad trade. Colon was fantastic for the Sox, especially down the stretch for a brutally under-achieving team. The guy than got a huge contract from the Angels, won a cy young and obviously missed most of last season.

Ah yes, Jason Dellaero taken before Lance Berkman, and Garland ended up being the only major "impact" player of that draft, and he wasn't even a Sox pick.

Well, the Sox also drafted Jim Parque and Rocky Biddle with 2 of those picks, and spent another one trying to steal Jeff Weaver with a 2nd round pick to see if they could sign him it appears.

 

If we really want to talk about picks I wish we could do over, the one single pick is the Rogowski selection.

Edited May 30, 200718 yr by Balta1701

In 1997 the White Sox had 7 of the first 62 picks in the draft. I'm not going to hold my breath.

Even with past failures, I'd love for atleast two additional picks within the first 40. Any more and the problem becomes distributing money around.

Keith Foulke For Billy Koch

Johnny Oates

Geoff Zahn

Mickey Rivers

Duane Kuiper

Warren Cromartie

Bruce Bochy

Hubie Brooks

Andy McGaffigan

Willie McGee

Charlie Lea

Gary Gaetti

Bob Meacham

Steve Buechele

Tim Teufel

Jimmy Key

Calvin Schiraldi

Damon Berryhill

Joey Eischen

A.J. Hinch

Placido Polanco

Eric Gagne

J.J. Putz

Nate Robertson

Jeff Weaver

Scott Hairston

Zach Jackson

 

 

All wasted draft picks.

 

They wasted used their #1 in 1985 on Kurt Brown and passed on Barry Bonds and Rafael Palmiero.

 

In '83, they passed on Roger Clemens for Joel Davis.

Mike Cameron for Paul Konerko....

 

 

wait.