I could have understood the trade if no money was involved. You think compensation is going away and all indications were that it was. You're not going to win anything that year anyway..... But if you are going to pretty much pay him anyway, you would think you could do better than Jon Adkins. Ray was a pretty good ballplayer at the time, having a big year.

It was a terrible trade when it went down, and even worse when we realized Adkins was using something that was giving him extra MPH on his fastball. Of course I also think that the scouts that we employed those years were absolute trash.

Potentially too much turnover from a winning team-ala 2005-took 3 years to recover from that

 

Turnover wasn't the problem.

 

Talent wise we were a better team in 2006 than in 2005.

 

We were one of the best offensive teams in baseball. We lead the AL in slugging (and MLB too I think).

 

The problem was that some of the guys who pitched really well in 2005 pitched pretty poorly the following year.

 

don't forget aaron cunningham for richar. in a couple of years i have a feeling that will be one of his worst ones.

Meh, it really made sense at the time. We had a relative surplus of OFs in the system, and almost no middle IF prospects.

Its really hard to judge most trades. The Foulke to Oakland trade can be judged both ways. It might have been horrible. Maybe if it wasn't made the White Sox win it all in 2003 without Billy Koch trying to close games. Flash Gordon took over the closer role. What if he was able to remain the primary set-up guy? Maybe that team wins.

 

On the other hand, one of the guys you get in that trade is Olivo. He turns out to be part of the deal to get Garcia, who does help the White Sox win it all. Could the Sox have traded for Garcia without Olivo? We probably will never know.

 

Then Garcia is traded for Floyd and Gio. Floyd helps the White Sox win the Central in 2008. Would Floyd have been a White Sox if Garcia wasn't available? We will never know. Gio goes for Swisher, who sucks in his only White Sox season, but he brings back some minor leaguers who may or may not help the White Sox win things in the future.

 

So just when you look at that trade, you can make an argument it was awful, and you can make an argument it was fantastic.

 

http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/news/021203closers.html

 

Olivo was not part of the Foulke/Koch deal....he was the player to be named later for RP Chad Bradford. I think this trade and maybe the one for Adkins/Durham were the ones that were used to "pick on" KW in Moneyball, the Michael Lewis' (aka former MTV VJ Tabitha Soren's husband) book

 

The A's trade was Foulke, Mark Johnson and RP Joe Valentine for Koch, Cotts and OF Daylan Holt.

Edited December 8, 200817 yr by caulfield12

The same argument can be made with Cotts though too. He had one good year for the Sox, but it was in 2005, and the Sox very well may have not won the division without Cotts, let alone the Series. It doesn't go into as many different degrees as the original went, but it's still something to consider all the same.

2005: Aaron Rowand, Daniel Haigwood and Gio Gonzalez for Jim Thome- Advantage Phi.

UMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM NO?!!?!?

UMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM NO?!!?!?

People hate Jim Thome and worship Aaron Rowand so it makes sense.

Rauch/Majewski for Everett was one of KW's worst trades.

Rauch/Majewski for Everett was one of KW's worst trades.

And yet, without it, we may not win that world series. Even in trades we lose, 05 sort of winds up being the great equalizer.

Everett was hardly a difference-maker in '05.

Everett was hardly a difference-maker in '05.

 

Difference maker, no. Integral piece of the puzzle, yes

Difference maker, no. Integral piece of the puzzle, yes

I disagree.

 

Dye, Konerko, Crede, Uribe, Iguchi, Rowand, Pods, The 4 starters, Jenks, and even Geoff Blum were more integral.

I disagree.

 

Dye, Konerko, Crede, Uribe, Iguchi, Rowand, Pods, The 4 starters, Jenks, and even Geoff Blum were more integral.

There's no way you can guarantee the Sox win the World Series without him and that's good enough for me. I wouldn't call any trade Kenny made prior to 2005 that added a player who was a member of the Championship team a bad deal and that includes the Foulke/Koch trade.

I disagree.

 

Dye, Konerko, Crede, Uribe, Iguchi, Rowand, Pods, The 4 starters, Jenks, and even Geoff Blum were more integral.

 

Like I said, not a difference maker, but Everett was the DH for pretty much the entire year(with the exception of Franks return and exit), and he drove in some pretty big runs. Everett was definitely in the mix for being an important part of that team

even Geoff Blum were more integral.

 

OK. You lost me there. No love for Crazy Carl again. I wonder how beloved he would be if he believed in dinosaurs?

 

I disagree.

 

Dye, Konerko, Crede, Uribe, Iguchi, Rowand, Pods, The 4 starters, Jenks, and even Geoff Blum were more integral.

Geoff Blum had 1 big hit. If he didn't get it, would the White Sox have lost that game? If yes, would they have lost the WS? We will never know. It could have been huge, but then again, maybe not.

people forget that Carl carried the offense that first month of '05

people forget that Carl carried the offense that first month of '05

 

Along with Pods (who was pretty much the White Sox offensive MVP well into July) and Gooch.

Edited December 9, 200817 yr by Jordan4life

Everett in '05:

 

.299/.351/.495/.846 w/ RISP

.302/.434/.558/.992 w/ RISP & 2 out

.317/.371/.529/.901 w/ Men On

 

Sucks to have a guy like that in the 3 hole, makes it real hard to score runs.

 

But yeah, Geoff Blum was the more important player.

Everett in '05:

 

.299/.351/.495/.846 w/ RISP

.302/.434/.558/.992 w/ RISP & 2 out

.317/.371/.529/.901 w/ Men On

 

Sucks to have a guy like that in the 3 hole, makes it real hard to score runs.

 

But yeah, Geoff Blum was the more important player.

 

I had no idea his numbers were that good in those three key situations.

Carl Everett had the ground out that moved Willie Harris to 3rd and allowed him to score easily on Dye's single...

Carl Everett had the ground out that moved Willie Harris to 3rd and allowed him to score easily on Dye's single...

 

He also started the 5-run, 5th inning rally against Boston in game 2. I love me some Carl.