One change that could be interesting is to require companies that offer insurance to offer it from day 1. My current employer does that, which is really nice when changing jobs.

Is it really freedom to be beholden to a private corporation instead of a government you at least have a vote in?

 

You can leave a private corporation. Under this plan, you can't leave the government.

You can leave a private corporation. Under this plan, you can't leave the government.

Canada says hi.

You can leave a private corporation. Under this plan, you can't leave the government.

 

Sure you can, unless you're sliding down the slippery slope of "it'll eliminate all non-government options!". They aren't promoting single-payer or NHS-style systems.

 

If they drop a public option, it'll essentially become a slightly-right-of-center bill. So much for "the most liberal government ever!" ramming through communism/socialism.

and when its a monopoly, you can't leave the private corporation if you want that service.

Sure you can, unless you're sliding down the slippery slope of "it'll eliminate all non-government options!". They aren't promoting single-payer or NHS-style systems.

If they drop a public option, it'll essentially become a slightly-right-of-center bill. So much for "the most liberal government ever!" ramming through communism/socialism.

Today.

 

I tend to beleive the Barackus the Great who said be believes in the single payor system but knows that we will have to get there in steps.

I tend to believe the Barackus the Great who said be believes in the single payor system but knows that we will have to get there in steps.

I've thought this for a while. I think the LONG TERM plan... maybe 10-20 years, is a single payer system. But, as I said a long time ago, you cant do it all at once. It's too major of a shift for the market and system to take. It would only make things far worse. So, do it in steps.

1) Reform with an optional Government option... or co-op

2) Full Government option.

3) Tighten the screws on non-Government plans.

4) Single Payer.

and when its a monopoly, you can't leave the private corporation if you want that service.

 

Except that there is no monopoly. As was stated earlier in this thread, there are tons of other companies out there.

Except that there is no monopoly. As was stated earlier in this thread, there are tons of other companies out there.

 

For most professionals, health care coverage is part of your compensation. My company won't give me cash in lieu of forgoing those benefits. Essentially, to switch, I'd be taking a pay cut and having to turn around and spend a few hundred a month.

and when its a monopoly, you can't leave the private corporation if you want that service.

 

Good thing there isn't a monopoly then.

For most professionals, health care coverage is part of your compensation. My company won't give me cash in lieu of forgoing those benefits. Essentially, to switch, I'd be taking a pay cut and having to turn around and spend a few hundred a month.

 

Well that would be your choice to switch now wouldn't it?

 

Benefits, such as health insurance, 401k etc would be just as important a factor in switching jobs as location and salary would be for me.

For most professionals, health care coverage is part of your compensation. My company won't give me cash in lieu of forgoing those benefits. Essentially, to switch, I'd be taking a pay cut and having to turn around and spend a few hundred a month.

 

So instead much of the country is going to take a pay cut AND won't get a choice. That's much better.

Good thing there isn't a monopoly then.

One thing I haven't heard discussed much, is I'd really like to see some sort of encouragement for employers to offer services from multiple insurers, and let people choose. Some companies do this already, but not many.

 

Well that would be your choice to switch now wouldn't it?

It really isn't much of a choice if you want to be honest with your self. In this job market who's going to decline the health insurance offered by their employer to pay an exorbitant amount elsewhere?

For most professionals, health care coverage is part of your compensation. My company won't give me cash in lieu of forgoing those benefits. Essentially, to switch, I'd be taking a pay cut and having to turn around and spend a few hundred a month.

And here is the kicker to me, it depends on how much your employer is willing to spend on you....

I work for a church/school, and all I hear from my bosses... the pastors and our director of operations... is how evil this new healthcare system will be. Yet, when you look at the insurance they "give" us, it's absolutely horrible. I like to say it's overage for the sake of saying we have coverage. It doenst really cover much of anything. A single stress test I took a few years back was over $500. My wife had an ectopic pregnancy and had to have emergency.. what ended up being life saving... surgery. For the entire hospital stay and the emergency surgery, I think we payed just a hair UNDER $500.

 

Needless to say, when my daughter was born, I jumped over to my wife's coverage (her insurance price only goes up once when you add additional people. We can have just me, or me plus 5 kids and it's all the same price). It's no surprise that when given the option, many will leave to be on their spouses plan.

 

The point of my story is this: I dont know the exact details of the government option being floated around, but I KNOW it will be better and cheaper than the crap my employer gave me. And when we look at being fiscally smart, if they arent willing to at least EXPLORE the option of using the government option, I'm not sure what i will say.

Edited August 18, 200916 yr by Athomeboy_2000

It really isn't much of a choice if you want to be honest with your self. In this job market who's going to decline the health insurance offered by their employer to pay an exorbitant amount elsewhere?

 

It's still someone's choice.

 

I've wanted to move into NYC for over a year now but with the economy I'm just riding it out where I am. Once it get's better I may start to look again. But, again, it's my choice. And yes, having the health insurance I have does factor into it.

It's still someone's choice.

 

I've wanted to move into NYC for over a year now but with the economy I'm just riding it out where I am. Once it get's better I may start to look again. But, again, it's my choice. And yes, having the health insurance I have does factor into it.

When less than 1% of people decline their employer's health insurance and go out and get some on their own I fail to see that as a true choice. And yes I made that figure up but I'm probably not far off.

When less than 1% of people decline their employer's health insurance and go out and get some on their own I fail to see that as a true choice. And yes I made that figure up but I'm probably not far off.

Why would someone willing leave their employer's system unless they are making millions of dollars a year? It's just too expensive to go on your own. And as was mentioned, when you decline your employer option, you dont get that money they were using to pay for your insurance. So, while you may have been paying a small amount towards your employer option, you now have to pay 100% out of pocket.

 

And this whole tax rebate thing McCain tried to blow up our butt is a joke. A $5000 "credit" is not NEARLY enough.

When less than 1% of people decline their employer's health insurance and go out and get some on their own I fail to see that as a true choice. And yes I made that figure up but I'm probably not far off.

 

Why would you decline health insurance that is esentially "free" from your job? It's not a fiscally smart decision. And if the coverage is so egregiously bad that you feel a need to get rid of it maybe you should have factored that into your decision when weighing said job offer. No on makes you accept the job. Benefits, such as salary, work environment, location, stress, etc should be taken into consideration when pursuing jobs. I fail to see how anyone can not view that as a choice. It actually fits the definition of a choice to a 'T'.

 

To me, it's all about the "Something For Nothing Club", and people just keep wanting to hop on that bus.

Why would you decline health insurance that is esentially "free" from your job? It's not a fiscally smart decision.

 

 

That's the point. You don't have a fiscally smart decision to make in the current system. You take whatever your company offers or you pay out the ass.

No on makes you accept the job. Benefits, such as salary, work environment, location, stress, etc should be taken into consideration when pursuing jobs. I fail to see how anyone can not view that as a choice. It actually fits the definition of a choice to a 'T'.

Yes and no. I know, in my case, the job I was offered had better pay and stability than anything else I would have found immediately after graduating college. But the health coverage sucked. So, I could have taken a job somewhere else with lower pay and maybe a SLIGHTLY better health option, or had no job with no health coverage.

 

That's the point. You don't have a fiscally smart decision to make in the current system. You take whatever your company offers or you pay out the ass.

What a terrific "choice"!

What a terrific "choice"!

Hey, freedom isn't free!

Hey, freedom isn't free!

Maybe the death panel isn't a bad idea after all. Maybe they can put me out of my misery.

 

That's the point. You don't have a fiscally smart decision to make in the current system. You take whatever your company offers or you pay out the ass.

 

Well that "point" is asinine.

 

So should everyone complain about their 401K also and ask that that get taken over too? It's still your choice to pay into it or not. No one is forcing you to do so. If you don't like it go look for another job. What happens when you get fed up with your supervisor? Or your hours? Or your salary? You deal with it. How you deal with it is up to each individual.

 

I wanted to go on a cruise with some friends again this summer but I deemed it too expensive this year since I am moving into a house and had a bunch of other stuff I had to get done. It was my decision to forgo the cruise. It wasn't fiscally smart this year. People always have choices and more often than not they can work things out if they truly wanted to. But, it's much easier to cry about it being impossible and looking for a handout rather than doing something to change your situation, whatever it may be.