caulfield12 Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 I would have created a poll, but don't have the energy. Is there anyone who could actually do any better and come out of "nowhere" like Jenks did in 2005? Dotel? Thornton? Pena? Are ANY of those options NOT going to be demonstrably WORSE? The one we keep speculating about is Thornton...but there's lots of counter-evidence about suitability for that role. And we have what in the minors? Nunez? Link? Santeliz? It's looking like Jenks might turn into another Joe Crede and we'll wish we would have traded him this past off-season. I hope this team recovers enough to win ONE game tomorrow, or you really start speculating about the season that looked so promising just days ago completely slipping away. Fathom was right, even though it's not 8 games out (possibly 4 games out), heading straight into a tsunami of a schedule without a bullpen...this team has been the biggest tease of the last decade, at least since 2003. Was there anyone who felt we were actually going to win the game heading into the top of the 10th? Not many, if there were. Ozzie needs to do something to shake this team up, but I'm not sure what that is...or if pulling Jenks from the closer's role in the 2nd half will do anything but make things even worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justBLAZE Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 I like the guy Nunez in the minors. Bobby will remain the closer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 The same thing is happening to him that happened to Gavin earlier in the year. He's throwing his fastball too much. Just like with Gavin, their only plus pitch now (since he's lost so much velocity) is the curve. I would be so much less pissed if Jenks got hurt by Granderson on the curve. For the love of Quentin circa 2008, I struck out Granderson with a curve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 25, 2009 -> 06:36 PM) The same thing is happening to him that happened to Gavin earlier in the year. He's throwing his fastball too much. Just like with Gavin, their only plus pitch now (since he's lost so much velocity) is the curve. I would be so much less pissed if Jenks got hurt by Granderson on the curve. For the love of Quentin circa 2008, I struck out Granderson with a curve. I don't think Bobby threw a single curve ball today in the 9th. He got Guillen with it in the 8th. Why not break it out against Granderson? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangercal Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 Fwiw, Joe Nathan has 3 Blown Saves and Bobby 4. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_genius Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 3 straight jenks meltdowns. i've about had it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 QUOTE (rangercal @ Jul 25, 2009 -> 07:38 PM) Fwiw, Joe Nathan has 3 Blown Saves and Bobby 4. I'm with you on the "let's not overreact" angle, but Nathan is a pretty terrible comparison - his ERA is less than half that of Jenks, his WHIP is waaaaay lower (0.78 to 1.29, not counting today's games), and opponents are batting almost 100 points higher off Jenks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted July 25, 2009 Author Share Posted July 25, 2009 (edited) It's not the 3 versus 4 blown saves. That game against the Angels, it's over if Nathan doesn't TIP the ball (fluke 1) and then it bounced right off the bag (fluke 2) when the game easily would have been over with neither eventuality occuring. I've listened to and watched a lot of Twins' games over the years. Nathan's "fall" is a little like Mo Rivera's...he's great still, but not unbeatable anymore or like Superman. Jenks has CONSISTENTLY and VISIBLY been struggling with both his stuff and confidence. You don't get the same feeling from watching Nathan. If Nathan and Jenks were both put on the market today, Nathan could get you a Fernando Martinez (if the Mets were close to being in it, just as an example). He's still THAT good. Edited July 25, 2009 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockren Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 QUOTE (mr_genius @ Jul 25, 2009 -> 06:42 PM) 3 straight jenks meltdowns. i've about had it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chetkincaid Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 George Sherrill anyone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish71 Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Jul 25, 2009 -> 06:44 PM) George Sherrill anyone? I do not want to burn our prospects on bullpen help, or some dream of winning the whole thing this year. This team is incredibly flawed. As bad as Bobby has been, our offense and our defense has been just as bad. Ditching Flowers and other associated talent for this would set our franchise back quite a bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted July 25, 2009 Author Share Posted July 25, 2009 Is the cost of acquiring Sherrill close to worth it? Wouldn't it be better, if we did pull Jenks, to at least give Thornton a shot at the job first? You'd hate to give away a big piece of our future offense in Tyler Flowers when this team could be knocked completely out of the race in the next 10 days of the season... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 Perhaps Jenks is failing because he's not allowed to throw a semi-uncontrolled fastball. He's been 92 consistantly, but you see guys like Rodney, Aardsma, MacDougal allowed to rear back and throw 98. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chetkincaid Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 QUOTE (southsideirish71 @ Jul 25, 2009 -> 06:47 PM) I do not want to burn our prospects on bullpen help, or some dream of winning the whole thing this year. This team is incredibly flawed. As bad as Bobby has been, our offense and our defense has been just as bad. Ditching Flowers and other associated talent for this would set our franchise back quite a bit. That makes sense. I agree.. I wonder what Jenks would bring back if you put him on the market right now... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 QUOTE (knightni @ Jul 25, 2009 -> 04:49 PM) Perhaps Jenks is failing because he's not allowed to throw a semi-uncontrolled fastball. He's been 92 consistantly, but you see guys like Rodney, Aardsma, MacDougal allowed to rear back and throw 98. He was 96-97 today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Jul 25, 2009 -> 04:50 PM) I wonder what Jenks would bring back if you put him on the market right now... Not enough to make it worth it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kane0730 Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 Until he's traded in the Winter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish71 Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 25, 2009 -> 06:52 PM) He was 96-97 today. Thats a hot gun in Detroit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 26, 2009 Share Posted July 26, 2009 QUOTE (southsideirish71 @ Jul 25, 2009 -> 04:57 PM) Thats a hot gun in Detroit. Thornton was 95-96. Rodney was 96-97. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted July 26, 2009 Share Posted July 26, 2009 After going with Thornton and Dotel early today, Ozzie was pretty much stuck with Bobby. His WHIP has been pretty respectable up until about two weeks ago. I don't see much of an option besides letting Bobby work through it. If they pull him from the closer role, it's pretty much a vote of "no confidence," which will negatively impact his trade value. If they give him a fake injury and stint on the DL where he throws on the side, his perceived durability takes a hit (he already has a surgically-repaired elbow, which doesn't help), also lowering his trade value. If he's still throwing like this two weeks from now, Kenny's going to have to make a difficult choice. The fake 15-day DL stint with throwing on the side might be the best way to go in that case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted July 26, 2009 Share Posted July 26, 2009 Since Kenny wasted a top 5 prospect on Pena, why not give him a shot at closing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted July 26, 2009 Share Posted July 26, 2009 QUOTE (knightni @ Jul 25, 2009 -> 05:04 PM) Since Kenny wasted a top 5 prospect on Pena, why not give him a shot at closing? Because Bobby hasn't really been struggling for that long, and he's earned the right to work through short-term struggles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted July 26, 2009 Share Posted July 26, 2009 QUOTE (WCSox @ Jul 25, 2009 -> 08:05 PM) Because Bobby hasn't really been struggling for that long, and he's earned the right to work through short-term struggles. Bobby has struggled almost 75% of the time out there since 2007. He gives up a lot of leadoff hits and walks guys. He just hasn't blown the save as much until recently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 26, 2009 Share Posted July 26, 2009 QUOTE (knightni @ Jul 25, 2009 -> 05:04 PM) Since Kenny wasted a top 5 prospect on Pena, why not give him a shot at closing? His ERA with the White Sox is 12.46 and his WHIP is 1.846. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted July 26, 2009 Share Posted July 26, 2009 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 25, 2009 -> 08:08 PM) His ERA with the White Sox is 12.46 and his WHIP is 1.846. There you go. Just proves the quality of that trade, huh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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