But trading a starting pitcher for relief pitcher whose value is down right now (justified or not) is inherently wrong, no matter cost or team controlled years left. Joba is simply not worth Jackson. If a trade like that is going to even be considered, the Yankees are going to include a hell of a lot more too.

But trading a starting pitcher for relief pitcher whose value is down right now (justified or not) is inherently wrong, no matter cost or team controlled years left. Joba is simply not worth Jackson. If a trade like that is going to even be considered, the Yankees are going to include a hell of a lot more too.

 

Yeah, that's why I edited my post. I'd only consider it if you stuck him in the rotation. They'd have to have a lot of confidence in Coop and his 'magic' ways to make such a deal.

Yeah, that's why I edited my post. I'd only consider it if you stuck him in the rotation. They'd have to have a lot of confidence in Coop and his 'magic' ways to make such a deal.

 

Joba in the rotation scares me because it seems as though he really only has the two plus pitches in his fastball and slider and when his fastball isn't at 95, it becomes much more hittable. That is what happened in 09 and last year he just began to improve himself.

 

I don't think Joba is anything but a reliever. I think he will be a pretty dominant reliever, perhaps in the form of Brad Lidge, throughout his career, but I think he's a reliever. If the Sox are to trade Jackson for him, they'd need more along with Joba. I'd suggest they ask for Romine, and if they say no to that, then you need to get a pitching prospect along with him too (and I would say that Nova does not qualify for that).

If KW can get them to throw in Nova, Betances, or Brackman with Joba, then fine, make the deal. Otherwise no. I had this idea earlier, but it was predicated on getting one of the three pitchers stated in return as well. No prospect that can start now, no deal.

Isn't Joba just a right handed Parque? 5 innings then done

That might be the only thing they have in common. Joba throws it about 15 MPH harder than Parque.

If KW can get them to throw in Nova, Betances, or Brackman with Joba, then fine, make the deal. Otherwise no. I had this idea earlier, but it was predicated on getting one of the three pitchers stated in return as well. No prospect that can start now, no deal.

The obvious problem with any deal that requires the Yankees to send us a starter back is that it's a bad deal for the Yankees. They need people who can be starting pitchers, even if they're not good. If they're trading for starting pitchers, they can't afford to give one up.

The obvious problem with any deal that requires the Yankees to send us a starter back is that it's a bad deal for the Yankees. They need people who can be starting pitchers, even if they're not good. If they're trading for starting pitchers, they can't afford to give one up.

 

They can probably afford to give up Brackman. He's still sorta far off, and could definitely end up being a reliever instead of a starter. He is a high upside kind of pitcher too. If the Sox got Joba and Brackman for Jackson, you'd probably have to make that deal.

Jackson & CQ for Joba & Gardner

The obvious problem with any deal that requires the Yankees to send us a starter back is that it's a bad deal for the Yankees. They need people who can be starting pitchers, even if they're not good. If they're trading for starting pitchers, they can't afford to give one up.

Didn't we have this argument in another thread? However is there no value in an upgrade in talent, as well as a guy who has(to a certain degree) a major league track record? If you're arguing that Jackson is basically an $8.5MM, 27 year old "prospect" then I can somewhat agree with that point of view.

Edited January 15, 201115 yr by Elgin Slim

Didn't we have this argument in another thread? However is there no value in an upgrade in talent, as well as a guy who has(to a certain degree) a major league track record? If you're arguing that Jackson is basically an $8.5MM, 27 year old "prospect" then I can somewhat agree with that point of view.

The Yankees would get a slight to moderate upgrade in talent, I think most would agree on that...but it still leaves their biggest hole unfixed and it gives up talent to do so.

Trading one of our starters for a reliever is just a horrendous idea at the moment.

Trading one of our starters for a reliever is just a horrendous idea at the moment.

 

The bolded is the key. Jake Peavy really f***ed us in the ass trying to be a hero last year.

Completely off topic, but Buster Olney's blog reminded me of this. How sweet would it be if Nick Swisher never existed, and we had Gio Gonzalez back? We would have a pretty awesome rotation of Peavy-Buehrle-Danks-Jackson-Floyd-Gio. That's 6 very solid starters.

Completely off topic, but Buster Olney's blog reminded me of this. How sweet would it be if Nick Swisher never existed, and we had Gio Gonzalez back? We would have a pretty awesome rotation of Peavy-Buehrle-Danks-Jackson-Floyd-Gio. That's 6 very solid starters.

 

Not to mention DLS in the 'pen. And maybe we don't even trade for Jackson with Gonzalez in the fold. Meaning we'd have two quality, cheap and team-controlled pitchers for the next 5-6 years in Gonzalez and Hudson with Sale waiting in the wings. At the very least we'd have some serious trade bait. But let's not go there. That first Swisher trade makes me sick.

Not to mention DLS in the 'pen. And maybe we don't even trade for Jackson with Gonzalez in the fold. Meaning we'd have two quality, cheap and team-controlled pitchers for the next 5-6 years in Gonzalez and Hudson with Sale waiting in the wings. At the very least we'd have some serious trade bait. But let's not go there. That first Swisher trade makes me sick.

Really, DLS in the pen? We'd keep him healthy when the A's couldn't?

Not to mention DLS in the 'pen. And maybe we don't even trade for Jackson with Gonzalez in the fold. Meaning we'd have two quality, cheap and team-controlled pitchers for the next 5-6 years in Gonzalez and Hudson with Sale waiting in the wings. At the very least we'd have some serious trade bait. But let's not go there. That first Swisher trade makes me sick.

 

That's why I have that Torii Hunter quote at the bottom. I also knew Gio personally. He should've never been traded.

Edited January 15, 201115 yr by JPN366

Really, DLS in the pen? We'd keep him healthy when the A's couldn't?

 

I know he was hurt in '09. Was he hurt last year? Even if he was a never-ending injury risk he'd still be a nice option to have in your back pocket. His K/9 in 47.1 IP was 13.9. ERA wasn't great but with those K numbers at mostly the AA level you've definitely got a legitimate prospect on your hands.

 

 

That's why I have that Torii Hunter quote at the bottom. I also knew Gio personally. He should've never been traded.

 

I didn't mind the first Gio trade because he helped net us a HOF. But when we got him back I thought for sure he was here to stay. That first Swisher trade will forever be a black mark on Kenny's resume.

Edited January 15, 201115 yr by Jordan4life

I know he was hurt in '09. Was he hurt last year?

He's coming back from the Tommy John surgery. When he got to AA last year, he put up a 6.54 ERA and he's pitched 77 innings combined since 2008.

 

He's a ways away still.

He's coming back from the Tommy John surgery. When he got to AA last year, he put up a 6.54 ERA and he's pitched 77 innings combined since 2008.

 

He's a ways away still.

 

I know the ERA sucked. But you know what a big proponent I've become of saber stats and pitcher peripherals. Seems to me the only thing holding him back are injuries. But I still hate the trade. I'll admit I didn't go nuts when it first happened. But I really hated parting with Gio a second time. Thanks a lot JC for that damn post of yours. I had forgotten about it. Now I'm mad.

No way. I don't see the upside to this deal whatsoever.

 

EDIT: I don't know why we're trying to figure out ways to trade starters, they're the backbone of the team and we're not actually THAT deep there.

Edited January 15, 201115 yr by ScottyDo

No way. I don't see the upside to this deal whatsoever.

 

EDIT: I don't know why we're trying to figure out ways to trade starters, they're the backbone of the team and we're not actually THAT deep there.

Agreed, starting pitching is what wins the 162 game marathon and we are solid, but lacking some depth so I do not know how we could entertain thoughts of trading a starter. As I've stated before though, if the arb case with Danks continues to move forward without resolution, I think there is a chance he gets traded.

I didn't mind the first Gio trade because he helped net us a HOF. But when we got him back I thought for sure he was here to stay. That first Swisher trade will forever be a black mark on Kenny's resume.

 

Thank you Brian Anderson

That first Swisher trade will forever be a black mark on Kenny's resume.

 

Players have had down years, and the Sox made the playoffs despite him. Trading Swisher to NYY for lol and wtf is worse in my mind even if Swisher didn't bounce back like he did.

I actually wouldn't mind this trade.

Joba might need a change of scenery and like you said, Sale could start.