Ranger Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Feb 13, 2011 -> 07:57 PM) Um, we had Jackson for two months and he performed admirably. And I don't even like Jackson. I agree with most of your post. I'm one not totally sold on the bullpen. The only sure thing is Thornton. Jackson was better than admirable for the Sox last year. He really only had 1 bad start. QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Feb 14, 2011 -> 08:18 AM) I agree with this. Let's see what Humber can do. He might surprise us all. It'd be better than wearing Pena and the rest of the bullpen out. I agree that the Sox don't want to do anything that puts an unnecessary workload on the relievers early in the year because that WILL have an affect on them by September. You don't want that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiliIrishHammock24 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Feb 14, 2011 -> 07:15 PM) I predict that Phil Humber will get a start and DOMINATE, and you'll be able to hear the eyebrows raise around here. I'll bump this thread when it happens. I have thought (and be shut down for thinking it) that Humber will actually be a pretty valuable 5th starter for us in the event he pitches for us due to injury or trade or whatever. I think he is going to open some eyes. Andruw Jones gave me the same feeling last year and I told everyone to watch out for him, and he delivered. Humber is my Jones of 2011. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quickman Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 Also remember throughout spring training teams will cut guys and some will be let go because they are out of options. The whitesox may end up picking up a pitcher in this way that can make 2 or 3 starts in april then head to pen if necessary. Phil humber does not send a message of all in. We need to do better and I am hoping that KW can pick up a pitcher in spring training. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 Anyone who wants to, or thinks we will, trade Danks during the season is insane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gatnom Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (Ranger @ Feb 14, 2011 -> 06:47 PM) He'll be fine. Unless, of course, he gets injured which is a possibility. A possibility in which there there appears to be a higher probability when the amount pitched jumps dramatically. Not that that means he will definitely get injured or anything. QUOTE (Ranger @ Feb 14, 2011 -> 06:47 PM) The up and down thing isn't going to hurt him in the slightest. The bottom line is: the Sox are better off this year having him pitch in the bullpen, so that's where he belongs. If he has to spend an extended amount of time as a starter this year, the Sox will not be as good as they would be if he were a reliever. I don't know Ranger... Chris Sale in the bullpen will not make or break this team Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (Ranger @ Feb 14, 2011 -> 07:47 PM) This really isn't going to be an issue. Any starter will tell you that you can pitch starter innings in the minors all you want, but nothing prepares you for throwing 160+ until you actually pitch in the Majors. It usually takes guys a year in the big leagues to get fully acclimated to it. Sale is on pace to get to around 170+ by the age of 24. That's a good enough pace. The up and down thing isn't going to hurt him in the slightest. The bottom line is: the Sox are better off this year having him pitch in the bullpen, so that's where he belongs. If he has to spend an extended amount of time as a starter this year, the Sox will not be as good as they would be if he were a reliever. He'll be fine. Unless, of course, he gets injured which is a possibility. Which is, um, kind of the sole reason to be concerned about his innings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowand44 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Feb 14, 2011 -> 09:35 PM) Anyone who wants to, or thinks we will, trade Danks during the season is insane. Yeup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Feb 15, 2011 -> 08:38 AM) Yeup. If we get off to the same start we did last year, then we're going to be thinking about it by May. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowand44 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 15, 2011 -> 08:39 AM) If we get off to the same start we did last year, then we're going to be thinking about it by May. I should have added "barring a collapse by this team," I don't think it's going to happen so I'm not too worried about it at the moment. Danks isn't going anywhere unless the team does indeed fall out of playoff contention by July, Kenny certainly isn't going to throw in the towel in May. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 15, 2011 -> 07:36 AM) Which is, um, kind of the sole reason to be concerned about his innings. Well, not really. Regression due to a dead arm is the big point of the Verduci effect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 15, 2011 -> 08:46 AM) Well, not really. Regression due to a dead arm is the big point of the Verduci effect. Not just regression, injury. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 15, 2011 -> 08:39 AM) If we get off to the same start we did last year, then we're going to be thinking about it by May. QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Feb 15, 2011 -> 08:40 AM) I should have added "barring a collapse by this team," I don't think it's going to happen so I'm not too worried about it at the moment. Danks isn't going anywhere unless the team does indeed fall out of playoff contention by July, Kenny certainly isn't going to throw in the towel in May. He knew that's what I meant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Feb 15, 2011 -> 09:31 AM) He knew that's what I meant. After last year, I feel compelled to make sure people add that caveat when they say that a firesale could never happen this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 15, 2011 -> 09:34 AM) After last year, I feel compelled to make sure people add that caveat when they say that a firesale could never happen this year. In the scenario where they are so bad early in the season that they're out of it by July, the only guys they'd likely trade are those with expiring contracts after 2011. This team is built with a 2-year window (maybe 3), so I don't think they'd have an outright firesale in 2011. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Feb 15, 2011 -> 09:37 AM) In the scenario where they are so bad early in the season that they're out of it by July, the only guys they'd likely trade are those with expiring contracts after 2011. This team is built with a 2-year window (maybe 3), so I don't think they'd have an outright firesale in 2011. With the amount of additional salary they've taken on this year, in the event of an April/May like last year, they will look at their books and realize their ticket sales have eroded, and they'll be in an even worse position for 2012. They'll start planning for significant salary cutbacks next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 15, 2011 -> 11:59 AM) With the amount of additional salary they've taken on this year, in the event of an April/May like last year, they will look at their books and realize their ticket sales have eroded, and they'll be in an even worse position for 2012. They'll start planning for significant salary cutbacks next year. With the contracts (years) they just handed out to Dunn, Konerko, and Crain, I really believe they've made a commitment to at least 2012. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Feb 15, 2011 -> 11:05 AM) With the contracts (years) they just handed out to Dunn, Konerko, and Crain, I really believe they've made a commitment to at least 2012. You're probably right. I for one hope that if we crash and burn again that we finally decide to go in another direction (i.e. committing a ton more towards the draft and player development). I know that won't be popular. But looking up at the Twins every year isn't popular, either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHITESOXRANDY Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 A 4-man rotation at any point in April is a terrible idea. And it just reinforces how bad our minor league system is that we don't have one capable arm to fill in for even a few starts, let alone for half a season. No s***. When is the last time that this worked? It's unbelievable that the Sox are "all in" but have no 5th starter. But, they can afford the most expensive DH in baseball. Pitching is what they need to win. Pitching is what cost them the divison last year and this year they have less than last year. At the end of this season when the Sox have once again finished second to Minnesota THIS is what we will point to as to where the Sox blew it! Kenny Williams should know better by now than to go into the season short on starting pitching. Adam Dunn isn't going to make the difference up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonard Zelig Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 I wonder if some people even read this article, because the quote was, "I look at the roster and the games earlier in the season and how we're going to play it, I look at the fifth starter," Guillen said. "We're going to use the fifth starter maybe one or two outings because of the day off and we can bump people, move people in the rotation." It appears they intend to keep everybody on normal rest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSqwert Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (Leonard Zelig @ Feb 15, 2011 -> 11:55 AM) I wonder if some people even read this article, because the quote was, "I look at the roster and the games earlier in the season and how we're going to play it, I look at the fifth starter," Guillen said. "We're going to use the fifth starter maybe one or two outings because of the day off and we can bump people, move people in the rotation." It appears they intend to keep everybody on normal rest. Thank you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Feb 15, 2011 -> 11:34 AM) You're probably right. I for one hope that if we crash and burn again that we finally decide to go in another direction (i.e. committing a ton more towards the draft and player development). I know that won't be popular. But looking up at the Twins every year isn't popular, either. We started to try that last year when we tried to dump AJ. We were also an Adam Dunn signing with someone else away from that this winter from the sounds of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (WHITESOXRANDY @ Feb 15, 2011 -> 11:45 AM) No s***. When is the last time that this worked? It's unbelievable that the Sox are "all in" but have no 5th starter. But, they can afford the most expensive DH in baseball. Pitching is what they need to win. Pitching is what cost them the divison last year and this year they have less than last year. At the end of this season when the Sox have once again finished second to Minnesota THIS is what we will point to as to where the Sox blew it! Kenny Williams should know better by now than to go into the season short on starting pitching. Adam Dunn isn't going to make the difference up. We have no sixth starter. Our fifth starter is hurt. Not many teams have six major league ready pitchers in their system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowand44 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 15, 2011 -> 12:58 PM) We have no sixth starter. Our fifth starter is hurt. Not many teams have six major league ready pitchers in their system. Ya no s***, someone is still mad about the Adam Dunn signing for some reason. Anyways, the more and more we hear, it sounds like the Sox are counting on Peavy to be out for about a month to start the season here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 15, 2011 -> 11:58 AM) We have no sixth starter. Our fifth starter is hurt. Not many teams have six major league ready pitchers in their system. Six? We don't have one. We don't even have half of one. I will concede that if Peavy only misses a month or so we should be alright. Anything more and it's 2004 all over again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Feb 15, 2011 -> 02:31 PM) Six? We don't have one. We don't even have half of one. I will concede that if Peavy only misses a month or so we should be alright. Anything more and it's 2004 all over again. How good were the 5th and 6th starters of the 8 playoff teams last year? Rangers got 1/2 a season from Harden as their 5th starter and traded for a better one because he was so bad. Twins had 28 starts and an ERA of 5.5 from Blackburn. Yankees had Vazquez and Burnett as their "4th and 5th starters" based on performance. Had to use Dustin Moseley for 10 games. Rays legitimately went 5 deep but James Sheilds had an ERA over 5. Teams are still winning without going 6-deep, or even 5-deep very strongly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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