It was Ozzie's job to realize that Thornton is NOT a closer. A lot of us knew that LAST year when he had to fill in for Jenks. He just never looked comfortable in the role and this year it has born itself out.

Apparently he's no longer a setup man either.

Apparently he's no longer a setup man either.

Well, it was a concern of mine moving him to closer (because no one else had a good ST) that we would lose the best setup guy in the game and possibly have one of the worst closers, and that is what has happened.

 

I do believe, however, he will emerge again this year as a top setup guy.

Edited May 22, 201114 yr by JohnCangelosi

The sac bunts and the obsession with stealing bases drives me up a wall. NL style baseball sucks anyways, but it irritates me when this team is built to slug. Giving up outs sucks.

 

With that being said, Ozzie is still a top 10 manager in baseball right now.

It was Ozzie's job to realize that Thornton is NOT a closer. A lot of us knew that LAST year when he had to fill in for Jenks. He just never looked comfortable in the role and this year it has born itself out.

 

Secondly, Ozzie will go ALL YEAR with JP no matter what. Why? Because he's a f*cking idiot. All you have to do is look 2010 and Kotsay for proof of how stupid he is. Literally. The guy probably has a 56 IQ. But of course smarts aren't everything in managing. I like the fact that Ozzie is the boss, and I like his laid back attitude. I just wish he had someone that could THINK for him because it's evident the guy has very little brains when it comes to making tactical decisions.

 

Third, Beckham is playing a non slugging position and still young, so you can have MUCH more patience with him than an aging Juan Pierre who costs us ball games day in and day out when we have a better player in AAA waiting to take his spot.

 

Look at today's game, for example. Garland is throwing BP out there and Juan can't even get a pop up out of the infield- he's a little league ball player in MLB right now. Thankfully Alexei was able to bail him out. It's a friggin crime that this guy gets the most PA's for our team and at the same time is probably the worst player in MLB. Only on a team managed by Ozzie Guillen!

 

You guys act like Ozzie makes all the decisions. Kenny is our GM.

And as far as Thornton, when I was worried about him being a closer cause I don't like lefthanded closers, people bashed me on here. The overwhelming majority of Soxdom was happy Thornton was taking over for Bobby.

The second guessing on this site is comical.

My god, don't some of you know that second guessing has gone on forever on every team and will forever go on?

The Thornton decision was a popular one to make him closer. It by no means was just Ozzie.

You think anybody would have made Santos the closer right out of ST??

It was Thornton's. Like somebody said he paid his dues. He got the job and failed. Those people who think Ozzie should have magicly dumped him after his first or second bad outing, cmon. That's dumb. At that point of the season it really was early. He earned the job and blew it.

Greg you're projecting some here. For all you know and can see here without going back and reading posts, Cangelosi actually agreed with you the whole time about Thornton not closing.

 

I'm in the "Thornton earned the opportunity and blew it" camp. Bobby Jenks sucks in Boston, and is hurt. I have not, nor will I criticize Ozzie for going with Thornton. He was the logical choice at the time. They weren't using Santos. Thornton was an All-Star so he was the guy. He pitched himself out of the role. Oh well. Not Ozzie's fault.

Greg you're projecting some here. For all you know and can see here without going back and reading posts, Cangelosi actually agreed with you the whole time about Thornton not closing.

 

I'm in the "Thornton earned the opportunity and blew it" camp. Bobby Jenks sucks in Boston, and is hurt. I have not, nor will I criticize Ozzie for going with Thornton. He was the logical choice at the time. They weren't using Santos. Thornton was an All-Star so he was the guy. He pitched himself out of the role. Oh well. Not Ozzie's fault.

 

Agree. Has any man ever earned a shot at closing more than Matt Thornton did? You just have to give him more than a few tries at it, and they probably would have given him even more if his blown saves weren't so blatantly killing our team.

 

Forget about the stats and the standings, think about the impacts that had on the team in the locker room. Man said he could get the job done but he couldn't. He took all the wind outa the team's sails. Demoted himself right down the totem pole. He failed his one big shot at a closing gig. I think he's gotta be messed up in the head from the weight of letting the team down.

So how does a major franchise wind up with a manager and a GM who 2/3 or more of the amateurs can outperform them at their jobs?

 

I wonder how many professional GM/manager combos have outperformed them? I venture to guess not many.

The sac bunts and the obsession with stealing bases drives me up a wall. NL style baseball sucks anyways, but it irritates me when this team is built to slug. Giving up outs sucks.

With that being said, Ozzie is still a top 10 manager in baseball right now.

 

Yea but they aren't slugging so what do you do? What do you do if your sluggers are striking out or grounding into double plays or popping up? I'd do what Ozzie is doing- put some pressure on the pitcher with the running/fielding game since the batter isn't putting any pressure on him. I understand your point that we are a slugging team, but if our guys were hitting the ball Ozzie would look like a genius taking the extra bases.

 

Those outs caused by the running game shouldn't be as magnified as they are since we are losing. But I think the pitching staff is turning it around just like last year. This season could get tasty real fast.

Yea but they aren't slugging so what do you do? What do you do if your sluggers are striking out or grounding into double plays or popping up? I'd do what Ozzie is doing- put some pressure on the pitcher with the running/fielding game since the batter isn't putting any pressure on him. I understand your point that we are a slugging team, but if our guys were hitting the ball Ozzie would look like a genius taking the extra bases.

 

Those outs caused by the running game shouldn't be as magnified as they are since we are losing. But I think the pitching staff is turning it around just like last year. This season could get tasty real fast.

What puts more pressure on the opposition...having a runner on 1b and 0 outs or a CS and 1 out?

Hey, nice unexpected surprise there

What puts more pressure on the opposition...having a runner on 1b and 0 outs or a CS and 1 out?

 

C'mon man. Why take an obvious observation and try to make it your point? Juan Pierre has stolen an insane amount of bases during his career and led the league last year. I dislike typing the obvious, why make me go there? I feel like I have to.

 

Juan usually steals bases and scores, but he's not this year. Again, the obvious, but how is that Ozzie's fault- using a player's proven skill set?

 

Sometimes I feel like I'm playing cards with my brother's kids or somethin.

C'mon man. Why take an obvious observation and try to make it your point? Juan Pierre has stolen an insane amount of bases during his career and led the league last year. I dislike typing the obvious, why make me go there? I feel like I have to.

 

Juan usually steals bases and scores, but he's not this year. Again, the obvious, but how is that Ozzie's fault- using a player's proven skill set?

 

Sometimes I feel like I'm playing cards with my brother's kids or somethin.

 

I'm wondering if he got old really fast or he's hiding an injury.

 

I'm wondering if he got old really fast or he's hiding an injury.

 

Yea he looked slow getting started on that tag play today. Can Kemp really throw out Juan Pierre? I couldn't believe how close that was.

Would you care to point out where I mocked anyone? Look at the poll results, that is called objective evidence. The majority of posters here have outperformed both of these guys at their jobs. And it has been easily proven, both of those guys have done some really stupid things. So how did a major franchise wind up with these two?

 

And here is a hint . . .

 

The answer is JR. And the point is, maybe the team's problems should be more on his shoulders.

Oh come on, Tex...we are going to take the word of posters on soxtalk for evidence that they have outperformed Ozzie and Kenny at their jobs?

 

That is ridiculously absurd and a completely ignorant conclusion.

Greg you're projecting some here. For all you know and can see here without going back and reading posts, Cangelosi actually agreed with you the whole time about Thornton not closing.

 

I'm in the "Thornton earned the opportunity and blew it" camp. Bobby Jenks sucks in Boston, and is hurt. I have not, nor will I criticize Ozzie for going with Thornton. He was the logical choice at the time. They weren't using Santos. Thornton was an All-Star so he was the guy. He pitched himself out of the role. Oh well. Not Ozzie's fault.

 

This. You basically had to give Thornton the chance with the way he's pitched for this team. The only issue was the length of time it took to give him the hook. I'm reactionary (no news to you guys), so I would have taken him out of the closer role after the first two blown saves. If not then, it had to be after three. Four was too much slack.

Oh come on, Tex...we are going to take the word of posters on soxtalk for evidence that they have outperformed Ozzie and Kenny at their jobs?

 

That is ridiculously absurd and a completely ignorant conclusion.

 

Why not take the word of the people who post here? I wouldn't post here if I felt everyone, or even the vast majority of posters, lied.

*bump*

 

see sig

Why not take the word of the people who post here? I wouldn't post here if I felt everyone, or even the vast majority of posters, lied.

It's not about them "lying," Tex. Let's take a poll and see what percentage of posters think they could do a better job than the President now. Do you think that would be an accurate number of people who could honestly do a better job than the President?

 

C'mon man...