August 29, 201114 yr DeAza, Flowers and Viciedo have all been so impressive so far. If only this franchise had the foresight and self-scouting to know what they had wasting away in AAA this season the way so many of us on this board did.
August 29, 201114 yr QUOTE (DukeNukeEm @ Aug 28, 2011 -> 08:20 PM) This board, as I remember, was not all about Tyler Flowers. Yeah, I'm pretty sure most had written him off. That includes me. De Aza was never clamored for either.
August 29, 201114 yr I remember a few clamoring for De Aza...but wasn't Tyler coming off an injury? I'm glad he's gotten the chance. When he was obtained I thought he was the real deal. Remember watching him in AFL thinking...DAMN. Regardless...it's just nice seeing some youthful/talented exuberance up. I almost pray to God they can find a way to dump Rios and or Dunn this offseason. If Paulie doesn't want to be part of the rebuilding (and he deserves that option)...then LA or AZ I think would jump all over him. I'm ready for the rebuild...have been the past few years.
August 29, 201114 yr QUOTE (DukeNukeEm @ Aug 28, 2011 -> 08:20 PM) This board, as I remember, was not all about Tyler Flowers. Ya I was one of the few that liked him, but that is because I have a soft spot for prospects. Iamshack liked him alot as well to say the A.J. injury was a blessing and I agreed with that. (as did some other posters) I don't blame not calling Flowers up (A.J. was still producing) or even De Aza (though I can understand with Rios, he would have been stuck on the bench with Ozzie anyway, not to mention Pierre was comming around and this was before Q getting hurt) but there is no excuse for Viciedo not being called up. None.
August 29, 201114 yr I wanted De Aza up at the beginning of the year. As a 4th OF* Edited August 29, 201114 yr by Quinarvy
August 29, 201114 yr QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Aug 28, 2011 -> 09:13 PM) I wanted De Aza up at the beginning of the year. As a 4th OF* Which would have meant no Lillibridge.
August 29, 201114 yr QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Aug 28, 2011 -> 09:20 PM) Which would have meant no Lillibridge. I didn't believe in Lillibridge at the beginning of the year. I wanted him in AAA. He proved me wrong.
August 29, 201114 yr I'm not going to pretend I was clamoring for De Aza or Flowers. And I'm not going to take the short sample sizes we've seen so far and extrapolate that over a full season. That's crazy and b****ing just to b****. All I will say is that Ozzie/KW had multiple options they could've turned to when so many guys they were counting on this year failed to produce at any point this season and they did absolutely nothing.
August 29, 201114 yr Starting the season with DeAza would not of meant no Liilbridge it would of meant no Lastings Millege who started the season with the Sox
August 29, 201114 yr QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Aug 28, 2011 -> 09:24 PM) I'm not going to pretend I was clamoring for De Aza or Flowers. And I'm not going to take the short sample sizes we've seen so far and extrapolate that over a full season. That's crazy and b****ing just to b****. All I will say is that Ozzie/KW had multiple options they could've turned to when so many guys they were counting on this year failed to produce at any point this season and they did absolutely nothing. Why do people keep saying KW/Ozzie like? Is there any proof ANYWHERE that Ozzie has the power to veto roster moves? KW coulda fixed this mess a while ago, too many people think Ozzie is the problem when KWs ego wont allow him to fix messes he made HIMSELF
August 29, 201114 yr QUOTE (JPN366 @ Aug 28, 2011 -> 11:57 PM) I've always been pro-Flowers. Only basis I have for Flowers is what I saw in AFL (with Braves) a few years back...and all I kept saying was DAMN! Haven't followed him through the White Sox system. He's had terrible year last year. He's rebounded nicely. It's his time...
August 29, 201114 yr Don't make it sound like Ozzie could just bench Dunn. Dunn is gonna be batting fourth for 4 seasons. And Rios as well. These guys will be playing because of their salaries. I don't care that KW had one quote about Oz not being forced to play anybody. You DO play those guys because of their salaries. KW kind of threw Oz under the bus with that quote. You can't bench guys making the kind of jack Dunn and Rios make as we will find out next year again with our new manager. And this board HATED Flowers. I soured on him just reading all the posts about how he was not a real prospect. p.s. You have to wonder if the presence of Dunn would sour any manager candidate on our opening. Edited August 29, 201114 yr by greg775
August 29, 201114 yr QUOTE (greg775 @ Aug 29, 2011 -> 01:38 AM) Don't make it sound like Ozzie could just bench Dunn. Dunn is gonna be batting fourth for 4 seasons. And Rios as well. These guys will be playing because of their salaries. I don't care that KW had one quote about Oz not being forced to play anybody. You DO play those guys because of their salaries. KW kind of threw Oz under the bus with that quote. You can't bench guys making the kind of jack Dunn and Rios make as we will find out next year again with our new manager. And this board HATED Flowers. I soured on him just reading all the posts about how he was not a real prospect. p.s. You have to wonder if the presence of Dunn would sour any manager candidate on our opening. Well, it's too little too late, but Dunn has been riding the bench more often lately. And no, you do not have to play a guy because of his salary. KW said the right thing, Ozzie didn't do it. But the real problem in my mind is that KW never called Ozzie on it afterwards.
August 29, 201114 yr I've also been impressed with Flowers although he strikes out a lot, 20 of them in 55 AB's. That's approaching Adam Dunn type percentages.
August 29, 201114 yr QUOTE (JohnCangelosi @ Aug 29, 2011 -> 09:16 AM) I've also been impressed with Flowers although he strikes out a lot, 20 of them in 55 AB's. That's approaching Adam Dunn type percentages. His %age was slightly better until he faced off against the Angels pitchers. 20 in 55 is a bad number. He won't be able to keep above average performance with that K rate.
August 29, 201114 yr It was extra hard to read the twitter feed with Joe Cowardly going into cover Ozzie's ass mode by trying to make Viciedo into Kenny's fault instead of Ozzie's fault. It is extra douchey to read the smartest columnist in mom's basement when you know he is just trying to cover for his one source in town.
August 29, 201114 yr QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Aug 29, 2011 -> 08:29 AM) It was extra hard to read the twitter feed with Joe Cowardly going into cover Ozzie's ass mode by trying to make Viciedo into Kenny's fault instead of Ozzie's fault. It is extra douchey to read the smartest columnist in mom's basement when you know he is just trying to cover for his one source in town. How is it not KWs fault
August 29, 201114 yr QUOTE (Papa Tru @ Aug 29, 2011 -> 11:05 AM) How is it not KWs fault If the scenario was: KW has no authority right now to fire Guillen because of an edict from ownership, Consequently, KW has no authority right now to force Guillen to follow his instructions (because he can't fire him for open defiance of KW's decisions), and Guillen makes clear that he will not play Viciedo if he's called up, he'll bench the kid like he did last year, and maybe insult/run him down a bit for good measure Then KW's hands are tied from above and below in the org.
August 29, 201114 yr QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 29, 2011 -> 10:08 AM) If the scenario was: KW has no authority right now to fire Guillen because of an edict from ownership, Consequently, KW has no authority right now to force Guillen to follow his instructions (because he can't fire him for open defiance of KW's decisions), and Guillen makes clear that he will not play Viciedo if he's called up, he'll bench the kid like he did last year, and maybe insult/run him down a bit for good measure Then KW's hands are tied from above and below in the org. Spot on. What the hell is KW supposed to do? His hands are tied. I like Oz, I really do, but I don't think he and Kenny Williams will be able to work together anymore. I hope Ozzie goes to Florida or somewhere else. If Oz is there next year, then I think KW resigns, and I wouldn't blame him one bit.
August 29, 201114 yr QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 29, 2011 -> 10:08 AM) If the scenario was: KW has no authority right now to fire Guillen because of an edict from ownership, Consequently, KW has no authority right now to force Guillen to follow his instructions (because he can't fire him for open defiance of KW's decisions), and Guillen makes clear that he will not play Viciedo if he's called up, he'll bench the kid like he did last year, and maybe insult/run him down a bit for good measure Then KW's hands are tied from above and below in the org. And we have seen him run Dunn and Rios out there anyway, no matter who is hot behind them or available.
August 29, 201114 yr QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 29, 2011 -> 10:08 AM) If the scenario was: KW has no authority right now to fire Guillen because of an edict from ownership, Consequently, KW has no authority right now to force Guillen to follow his instructions (because he can't fire him for open defiance of KW's decisions), and Guillen makes clear that he will not play Viciedo if he's called up, he'll bench the kid like he did last year, and maybe insult/run him down a bit for good measure Then KW's hands are tied from above and below in the org. So do you really think KW is the type of person who would stick around knowing he has no power? I dont..
August 29, 201114 yr QUOTE (Papa Tru @ Aug 29, 2011 -> 11:18 AM) So do you really think KW is the type of person who would stick around knowing he has no power? I dont.. I'm not sure. Turn it around and ask it the other way...is KW the kind of person who would walk out on JR over a dispute about Ozzie?
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