Some quotes (I may be off)

 

"We're going to swing until it's not a ball" srry: we're going to swing until it's a ball? i don't know about this quote, couldn't hear.

 

"Any statistics we bring up are a by product of a good at bat"

 

"Do we want adam dunn taking a ball off the plate with a man on third and justin verlander pitching?"

"why wouldn't you want that"

"It sets up a double play, he can drive that run in...it's not going to be a high scoring play anyway"

 

seems like this is over...but yeah..........sigh

Edited November 4, 201114 yr by bmags

Some quotes (I may be off)

 

"We're going to swing until it's not a ball" srry: we're going to swing until it's a ball? i don't know about this quote, couldn't hear.

 

"Any statistics we bring up are a by product of a good at bat"

 

"Do we want adam dunn taking a ball off the plate with a man on third and justin verlander pitching?"

"why wouldn't you want that"

"It sets up a double play, he can drive that run in...it's not going to be a high scoring play anyway"

 

seems like this is over...but yeah..........sigh

 

Jeff Manto, ladies and gentlemen. A proven Pirates reject. We need more Theo talk. At least that doesn't put me to sleep.

 

Well it looks like the BABIP and infield popups are not changing any time soon.

 

Should get a fair share of soft tossers throwing 88 pitch complete games as well with the sprinkling of solo home runs

 

If a runner is fast and takes a walk he can avoid the double play a few different ways

 

I listened to the interview and he did not say anything that led me to believe the above will not be true.

Jeff Manto, ladies and gentlemen. A proven Pirates reject. We need more Theo talk. At least that doesn't put me to sleep.

 

Someone needs to call Lord Theo and save the Sox from this anti-sabermetric devil

"Do we want adam dunn taking a ball off the plate with a man on third and justin verlander pitching?"

"why wouldn't you want that"

"It sets up a double play, he can drive that run in...it's not going to be a high scoring play anyway"

So of course, the earlier story that Manto doesn't like walks because they set up a double play was nowhere near what was actually said. I'm shocked.

 

I actually agree with this quote anyway. Guy on third with less than two outs, I want people swinging the bat too, if it is a hittable pitch.

 

So of course, the earlier story that Manto doesn't like walks because they set up a double play was nowhere near what was actually said. I'm shocked.

 

I actually agree with this quote anyway. Guy on third with less than two outs, I want people swinging the bat too, if it is a hittable pitch.

 

but that's a terrible teaching method. And that quote that he doesn't like walks because it sets up double plays was quite accurate.

but that's a terrible teaching method. And that quote that he doesn't like walks because it sets up double plays was quite accurate.

I think its a very good method - because I think part of the problem with Sox hitters last year was sphincter factor. Dunn in particular needs to take fewer marginal pitches.

 

And the quote was nowhere near accurate. Come on, didn't you study journalism? How can you say that this:

 

"Manto doesn't like walks because it sets up double plays"

 

is the same as this...

 

"Do we want adam dunn taking a ball off the plate with a man on third and justin verlander pitching?"

"why wouldn't you want that"

"It sets up a double play, he can drive that run in...it's not going to be a high scoring play anyway"

 

They are not the same at all, because one is highly situational - which by the way was one of the major gripes people had with Sox hitters in recent years, was not hitting situationally. The first quote is utterly false, the second one is what Manto thinks of a certain situation.

 

Saying those quotes are the same as me saying "I don't like beer because it gets me drunk" is the same as "once I've had a couple beers and I'm driving home, I don't want to have another beer because I might be too intoxicated to drive". They are not the same, at all.

 

I just want Dunn to return to 2004-2010 numbers. Whatever Manto has to say to get him there, I'm ok with.

 

 

I think its a very good method - because I think part of the problem with Sox hitters last year was sphincter factor. Dunn in particular needs to take fewer marginal pitches.

 

And the quote was nowhere near accurate. Come on, didn't you study journalism? How can you say that this:

 

"Manto doesn't like walks because it sets up double plays"

 

is the same as this...

 

"Do we want adam dunn taking a ball off the plate with a man on third and justin verlander pitching?"

"why wouldn't you want that"

"It sets up a double play, he can drive that run in...it's not going to be a high scoring play anyway"

 

They are not the same at all, because one is highly situational - which by the way was one of the major gripes people had with Sox hitters in recent years, was not hitting situationally. The first quote is utterly false, the second one is what Manto thinks of a certain situation.

 

Saying those quotes are the same as me saying "I don't like beer because it gets me drunk" is the same as "once I've had a couple beers and I'm driving home, I don't want to have another beer because I might be too intoxicated to drive". They are not the same, at all.

 

Most of the sox problems are not getting on base and swinging at s***ty pitches. I'll give you 2 scenarios, 1 where the team only swings at good pitches, the other where they swing at bulls*** depending on a million different scenarios. Which do you think would do better?

 

And as for your second crap, STREEEEEEEETTTCCCHHHH

If we're going to be playing the spin-this-into-a-negative game this offseason, then I'm leaving. Unbelievable. The guy hasn't even started his first day on the job and we hate him.

No we don't. At least no I don't. What I hate is trendiness in life and in this case slavish devotion to Jamesian dogma concerning stats.

 

The White Sox are not a good situational hitting team and they have a low BABIP because they swing at any pitch that is close to being a strike and then get themselves out. This is the mantra that I heard from Jeff Manto this morning.

 

This appears to be their philosophy and the Twins pitch to this and admit that they simply let he White Sox get themselves out.

 

What is changing?

 

Am I to now believe they will change this theory based on the pitcher?

 

I am not getting a good feeling about this the more I hear.

See, this condescending attitude is what pisses me off about sabr advocates. It's always thumbing your nose at anything that doesn't abide strictly by some incredibly general set of data, despite the fact that there are always scenarios that the data is simply not specific enough to address.

Amen to that. Few things worse than anal devotion to any sort of dogma.

 

The White Sox are not a good situational hitting team and they have a low BABIP because they swing at any pitch that is close to being a strike and then get themselves out. This is the mantra that I heard from Jeff Manto this morning.

 

This appears to be their philosophy and the Twins pitch to this and admit that they simply let he White Sox get themselves out.

 

What is changing?

 

Am I to now believe they will change this theory based on the pitcher?

 

I am not getting a good feeling about this the more I hear.

And let's remember the stat...the Sox have the lowest BABIP in the league over what, a 5 year period?

2007 - BABIP .278, MLB Rank: 30th; 21.1% K Rate, MLB Rank: 23th

2008 - BABIP .281, MLB Rank: 29th; 18.3% K Rate, MLB Rank: 11th

2009 - BABIP .285, MLB Rank: 28th; 18.7% K Rate, MLB Rank: 7th

2010 - BABIP .292, MLB Rank: 23rd; 16.8% K Rate, MLB Rank: 2nd

2011 - BABIP .257, MLB Rank: 30th; 16.8% K Rate, MLB Rank: 2nd

 

Composite Totals 2007 - 2011: BABIP .283, MLB Rank: 30th; 18.6% K Rate, MLB Rank: 9th

Ergo...the Sox don't strike out much...but they don't put the ball in play strongly. Almost as if they're being too aggressive on pitches out of the zone.

Ergo...the Sox don't strike out much...but they don't put the ball in play strongly. Almost as if they're being too aggressive on pitches out of the zone.

 

they swing at bad pitches

thus

they do not make good contact

thus

the BIP is not hit well

thus

it is fielded rather easily

thus

the hitter is retired

thus

BABIP is low

 

Sounds like Manto's strategy

 

As the Who says, "meet the new boss, same as the old boss"

I think its a very good method - because I think part of the problem with Sox hitters last year was sphincter factor. Dunn in particular needs to take fewer marginal pitches.

 

Aren't the Sox routinely at the bottom of the list of "pitches per AB"?

 

They don't need to be swinging at more marginal pitches.

Aren't the Sox routinely at the bottom of the list of "pitches per AB"?

 

They don't need to be swinging at more marginal pitches.

I think that one is in no small part because of AJ, who tends to be at the bottom of the league in pitches/PA. AJ's BABIP though is as good as or better than the team's in most of those years.

Maybe he"ll work out and maybe not. I haven't seen anything earth shattering or sacrilegious to his statements be they five years old or more recent. Isn't it just a little early for the pitchforks?

I think that one is in no small part because of AJ, who tends to be at the bottom of the league in pitches/PA. AJ's BABIP though is as good as or better than the team's in most of those years.

 

AJ and Alexei.

AJ and Alexei.

Hes another guy with a .292 babip. Not great, could be better, above average for this franchise

Hes another guy with a .292 babip. Not great, could be better, above average for this franchise

 

And he sees no pitches

I want to see a guy go up there, look at a couple pitches, then return to the dugout and get a bat . . .

I kid because I care™

And he sees no pitches

I have less of an issue with that than I do with the fact that the bottom of the AL BABIP says the contact the Sox are making is incredibly weak.

I have less of an issue with that than I do with the fact that the bottom of the AL BABIP says the contact the Sox are making is incredibly weak.

 

In other words they aren't being nearly as aggressive as people want to think. They are caught in between ala Nick Swisher.