Buehrle>Wood Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (IlliniKrush @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 07:16 PM) It's already a complete PR disaster. And any coach is doomed from the start. He's not in your eyes because it's your guy, but that won't make one difference. Any hire is the same at this point. That may be true. But at least Chicago likes Theus and we can around the BoT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 Weber said no to SIU Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigruss Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 My guess is that he wants a year or two off before going back to coaching. Unfortunately the SIU job is open now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 01:58 PM) Nebraska picked Tim Miles over Groce as well. I don't think Theus was ever considered for that position. I think Nebraska is a sleeping giant in bball. Arguably the best facilities in all of the Big Ten. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigruss Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 01:16 PM) Looks like it. Thomas has completely messed this situation up. He needs to be gone if Groce is the hire. BTW, really!? Give him some time, he's dealing with the BOT on top of the program being down, not to mention the state of funding from the state. You have to give anyone that comes in a chance, than judge Thomas' decision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 08:23 PM) BTW, really!? Give him some time, he's dealing with the BOT on top of the program being down, not to mention the state of funding from the state. You have to give anyone that comes in a chance, than judge Thomas' decision. I'll give him a chance. But this entire process has been shameful whether or not the coach works out or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigruss Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 02:25 PM) I'll give him a chance. But this entire process has been shameful whether or not the coach works out or not. I think Thomas is getting way too much blame here, obviously he had his guys that he wanted but the BOT f***ed around with his ability to go after those guys. And it seems most of the leaks came from the BOT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 Does anyone know if this is really Nick Smith or a fake account? Either way, it's hilarious. Nick Smith @thechainsaw45 The Illini Press conference was delayed due to the fact that Groce was a bit hesitant to come out in blackface. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlliniKrush Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 02:25 PM) I'll give him a chance. But this entire process has been shameful whether or not the coach works out or not. Because the 2 big guys said no? As if he could have done something to have them say yes. They don't want U of I. The end. That's the reason its shameful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gatnom Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 01:56 PM) I'm not asking for a splashy hire. If you have a big name, great. If not, well, you better have a track record as a good coach. And outside of a three game sample size, he doesn't. 34-30 in the lowly MAC and never finished better than 3rd (Bill Self won 71% of his conference games at Tulsa, Bruce Weber won 69% of his games at SIU). Overall, he won just 60% of his games. Who cares what he has coming back to Ohio next year? We're going to base this hire around what he might do in the future in a bad basketball conference? Tom Izzo coached at MSU before. Groce has no ties to the state of Illinois. What is this Chicago track record? He obviously did a great job making DJ Cooper out of South Holland come to Ohio, but out side of that I do not see much. I'm in class right now, so I can't really do the research right now, but it took Bill Self a good 4-5 years before he started winning with any regularity, with the last year being a particularly high outlier. An outlier that Groce should also roughly have next year since his entire team is coming back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (IlliniKrush @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 08:29 PM) Because the 2 big guys said no? As if he could have done something to have them say yes. They don't want U of I. The end. That's the reason its shameful. It's been filled with leaks, alumni turning on us, tons of negative press, everyone saying no to the point that a Big Ten program may hire a MAC guy, and reports that coaches don't want to work with Thomas himself. Illinois still doesn't have a coach as it now appears the AD is on a different page than the people he needs approval from. I don't think it could go much worse. Edited March 27, 2012 by Buehrle>Wood Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (gatnom @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 08:33 PM) I'm in class right now, so I can't really do the research right now, but it took Bill Self a good 4-5 years before he started winning with any regularity, with the last year being a particularly high outlier. An outlier that Groce should also roughly have next year since his entire team is coming back. Then hire him when he actually does start winning. Because, you know, he may never do that. For every Bill Self, there are ten more guys who don't win their first 5 years and ended up in obscurity. Edited March 27, 2012 by Buehrle>Wood Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigruss Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 02:37 PM) It's been filled with leaks, alumni turning on us, tons of negative press, everyone saying no to the point that a Big Ten program may hire a MAC guy, and reports that coaches don't want to work with Thomas himself. Illinois still doesn't have a coach as it now appears the AD is on a different page than the people he needs approval from. I don't think it could go much worse. Is not being on the same page as the BOT really a bad thing right now? They seem to be the fault for many of the problems the school/program is running into now. Personally, I like my AD fighting for what he thinks is the right move compared to what the BOT, who haven't run an athletic department, thinks is right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 Groce appears to be as good of a candidate as anyone who is willing to take Illinois' money. If you're Thomas and the Trustees say no, how do you continue as the AD? If you had any pride wouldn't you walk? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 08:41 PM) Is not being on the same page as the BOT really a bad thing right now? They seem to be the fault for many of the problems the school/program is running into now. Personally, I like my AD fighting for what he thinks is the right move compared to what the BOT, who haven't run an athletic department, thinks is right. The BoT is awful, don't get me wrong. But in the end they hold the power to deny the hire or at least make us look bad. Not that we could look much worse right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuskyCaucasian Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 Plane that was being used to pick up Groce has not left Champaign-Urbana. Major problems with a trustee and the hiring.— David Kaplan (@thekapman) March 27, 2012 Trustee James Montgomery reportedly is furious at hiring process at Illinois. Press conference that was planned is currently off.— David Kaplan (@thekapman) March 27, 2012 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 But they didnt have an issue with hiring an Ohio-based MAC coach for football..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 Illini Loyalty is reporting that the 3pm presser stuff was to see who was leaking the news. Funny, if true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 02:47 PM) Illini Loyalty is reporting that the 3pm presser stuff was to see who was leaking the news. Funny, if true. Now add some paranoia and you have Illinois athletics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (RockRaines @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 08:46 PM) But they didnt have an issue with hiring an Ohio-based MAC coach for football..... Because we are in a worse position for football and the MAC is at least respectable in football. It's the natural progression for mid-west mid-major football coaches. You don't make the Big Ten jump in basketball. It's been a bottom 15 (or worse) conference for awhile now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 Bruce Weber if not so classy would probably be getting a kick out of this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 02:49 PM) Because we are in a worse position for football and the MAC is at least respectable in football. It's the natural progression for mid-west mid-major football coaches. You don't make the Big Ten jump in basketball. It's been a bottom 15 (or worse) conference for awhile now. If a guy can coach and recruit, it really doesn't matter what conference he comes from. There have been bad coaches in the Big Ten and good coaches in the MAC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 08:53 PM) If a guy can coach and recruit, it really doesn't matter what conference he comes from. There have been bad coaches in the Big Ten and good coaches in the MAC. This is very true. My problem is the conference is bad, and he hasn't yet managed to finish better than 3rd in it. That leads me to have doubts about his coaching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gatnom Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 01:58 PM) Nebraska picked Tim Miles over Groce as well. I don't think Theus was ever considered for that position. Actually, Groce turned them down. QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 02:55 PM) This is very true. My problem is the conference is bad, and he hasn't yet managed to finish better than 3rd in it. That leads me to have doubts about his coaching. He's also coaching at a bottom feeder among bottom feeders. I see where you are coming from. He hasn't exactly accomplished a whole lot outside of tournaments (sound kind of like the opposite of a certain coach, of late?). You can point to his mediocre record, and say he won't be good. I can point to the context of that record, the current trend of the program, and his abilities as a recruiter as reasons why he might be a good coach. In the end, it is about projections, and the Peter Principle applies. Just because he wasn't the greatest MAC coach, doesn't mean he won't be a good Big Ten coach. Neither of us can really say for sure whether or not he would be a good or bad coach should he be hired. I think the reasons above are better methods for projection than just blindly looking at a conference record, but we just have to trust our AD's judgement should he be hired because he's the one we hired to make that decision. The AD, by the way, has a pretty decent track record for hiring good coaches. As for the Bill Self stuff I was talking about earlier, Self had a .505 winning percentage in his first 4 years with 1 NIT appearance. Groce has a .603 winning percentage in his first 4 years with 2 NCAA tournament appearances. I'm not trying to say that Groce is at all better than Self because the two situations are obviously not equal, but you can't write off Groce because of the first four years. And, if you want him to be more "proven" than he is now, who exactly do you want us to hire that is better? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 The players are now starting a campaign for Jerrance Howard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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