Your Realistic 2014 Lineup

[macsandz]

And in the fangraphs world he was worth $8 million last season and $12 million this season with a month left. And that's at a premium position where people are paying $20 million for a lot worse.

 

That's fine but he's a terrible fit on this team going forward, IMO.

He has 21 errors this season more than a few of which are routine plays.

In almost 600 plate appearances he leads the planet in fewest pitches seen.

Edited September 6, 2013 by bucket-of-suck

[Balta1701]

That's fine but he's a terrible fit on this team going forward, IMO.

He has 21 errors this season more than a few of which are routine plays.

In almost 600 plate appearances he leads the planet in fewest pitches seen.

And by the end of the year his fielding numbers will wind up looking similar to those he's had almost every year of his career.

 

Yes he doesn't take pitches, but "my shortstop isn't patient enough" is a really small complaint for a guy who is an above average fielder and who is actually getting better at running the bases.

[macsandz]

And by the end of the year his fielding numbers will wind up looking similar to those he's had almost every year of his career.

 

Yes he doesn't take pitches, but "my shortstop isn't patient enough" is a really small complaint for a guy who is an above average fielder and who is actually getting better at running the bases.

 

Again, on THIS team going forward he's contradicts the culture that Rick wants to create.

[witesoxfan]

Lawrie is 23. He was seriously rushed.

 

Jose Quintana is 24. He's a year and 6 days older than Lawrie. He's tied for 25th in fWAR for pitchers in the majors and, while his FIP and xFIP are in the 3.8s, he's still an incredibly talented and valuable piece.

 

Regarding Hector Santiago, he's a pretty good pitcher, but he struggles with control and allows a lot of flyballs. Until he can sink his fastball a little more, he's going to be a solid but inconsistent pitcher, closer to a 3 or a 4. There's no way I'd keep Santiago before Quintana. Oh, also, Santiago turns 26 in December.

Edited September 6, 2013 by witesoxfan

[greg775]

Jose Quintana is 24. He's a year and 6 days older than Lawrie. He's tied for 25th in fWAR for pitchers in the majors and, while his FIP and xFIP are in the 3.8s, he's still an incredibly talented and valuable piece.

 

Regarding Hector Santiago, he's a pretty good pitcher, but he struggles with control and allows a lot of flyballs. Until he can sink his fastball a little more, he's going to be a solid but inconsistent pitcher, closer to a 3 or a 4. There's no way I'd keep Santiago before Quintana. Oh, also, Santiago turns 26 in December.

 

I agree 100 percent. I think Q has passed Santana on the prospect list. Q is a better pitcher IMO.

[Quin]

I agree 100 percent. I think Q has passed Santana on the prospect list. Q is a better pitcher IMO.

 

Yes. But neither are prospects!

 

Q is the 20th best pitcher in baseball according to WAR. Santiago is around 50th if he had started the whole year.

[black jack]

Rick & co are not gonna punt the 2014 season.

 

This is based on a couple whispers about potential targets if they can't land Abreu.

 

Here is what I'd like to see:

 

Rotation: Sale, Danks, Josh Johnson (FA), Santiago, Erik Johnson

Bullpen: Reed, Jones, Lindstrom, Webb, Petricka, Leesman, Marinez

 

LF: De Aza

2B: Beckham

RF: Hunter Pence (FA) 3/$39

C: Brian McCann (FA) 4/$60

1B: Viciedo

DH: Dunn

CF: A. Garcia

3B: Brett Lawrie (Quintana trade)

SS: Semien

 

UT: Gillaspie

IF: Keppinger

OF: Danks

C: Phegley

 

 

What's your predicted lineup with Abreu?

 

[southsider2k5]

I know you have a unique situation but I would love for you to elaborate on this...

 

I would imagine he wants to get rid of all of the low baseball IQ and lazy players.

[GGajewski18]

If we trade Quintana to Toronto. We better be getting something more than Lawrie. I would do Quintana for Lawrie, Albert Tirado, Dalton Pompey and a lower level pitcher.

 

 

Edited September 7, 2013 by SoxPride18

[Marty34]

I think Quintana for Lawrie would be a pretty fair trade and one I'd make so long as they replace him short-term with a free agent signing and longer-term by taking a pitcher in the draft. More than focusing on a player though, it would be interesting to see what the best offers available for Quintana and Santiago are.

[ILMOU]

I'm not averse to keeping ADA, but I really, really don't want to see him at leadoff heading into next season. Not high enough OBP and just too damn stupid a base-runner, imo, to be our "table setter". Would very much like to see him in the 7 hole, where he can be a hybrid run-producer/secondary lead-off man, IF we can forge a deep enough lineup through FA/trades. Here's hoping like hell that Semien can be the OBP machine in the majors that he was in milb this year, or a close enough facsimile, however, his RHP/LHP splits are worrisome.

 

Speaking of splits, Tank is no longer sporting a LHP heavy OPS this season - in fact, the splits are almost exactly identical. This could just mean that he's now equally lousy against all pitching, or MAYbe he's making some baby steps - he's certainly been better the last few weeks. For me, he gets one more year to prove himself or it will be time to cut bait.

Edited September 10, 2013 by Stan Bahnsen

[Vance Law]

Like I said I have no problem moving Alexei if the right deal comes along (personally I'd give Semien first shot at the SS spot) but I'm not going to take a poor deal for him until one of the young guys plays so well that I'm forced to move Alexei for them.

 

I agree. I wouldn't mind seeing Leury platoon with Gillaspie as well as being super-utility.

 

The Cardinals have no use for both Craig and Adams and could use Alexei. Would love to see something get done there.

[witesoxfan]

I agree. I wouldn't mind seeing Leury platoon with Gillaspie as well as being super-utility.

 

The Cardinals have no use for both Craig and Adams and could use Alexei. Would love to see something get done there.

 

Craig will likely move to the outfield next year with Beltran moving on.

[2nd_city_saint787]

Craig will likely move to the outfield next year with Beltran moving on.

 

Where does that put Taveras and Jay? Alexei for Jay+? Jay in CF and leading off with ADA in LF batting 6th or 7th (like a poster said today) doesn't sound too shabby to me. Try and trade Tank for something useful.

[Vance Law]

Ahhh. Exactly, like I said, sign FA Beltran for LF or RF and DH.

[witesoxfan]

Where does that put Taveras and Jay? Alexei for Jay+? Jay in CF and leading off with ADA in LF batting 6th or 7th (like a poster said today) doesn't sound too shabby to me. Try and trade Tank for something useful.

 

There's no way I'd want Jay. He probably steps into a 4th outfielder's role with the Cardinals after this season. He's an OK player with a decent stick, but he doesn't hit for power, doesn't have real good speed, and he's not that strong of a defender. He's also a free agent after 2015 and turns 29 next year.

 

Essentially, he's Alejandro De Aza...with worse power and speed.

 

Regardless, I tend to doubt the Cards would have interest in Alexei. He seems to be a good fit, but they have so many pieces everywhere else that I think they can get away with a bit of a hole at SS as long as they can get a good glove.

[Eminor3rd]

There's no way I'd want Jay. He probably steps into a 4th outfielder's role with the Cardinals after this season. He's an OK player with a decent stick, but he doesn't hit for power, doesn't have real good speed, and he's not that strong of a defender. He's also a free agent after 2015 and turns 29 next year.

 

Essentially, he's Alejandro De Aza...with worse power and speed.

 

Regardless, I tend to doubt the Cards would have interest in Alexei. He seems to be a good fit, but they have so many pieces everywhere else that I think they can get away with a bit of a hole at SS as long as they can get a good glove.

 

Well, Jay is at least an on base threat. I'm not saying we should/could get him, but we do need to prioritize OBP guys. Jay is having a down year, and he's still at .343.

[2nd_city_saint787]

Well, Jay is at least an on base threat. I'm not saying we should/could get him, but we do need to prioritize OBP guys. Jay is having a down year, and he's still at .343.

 

Indeed, but I didn't know he was bad defensively(wite isn't the only one saying this) so that kinda throws a wrench into my desire for him.

 

Using UZR Jay is actually a worse CFer than ADA, -3.7 vs -7.2. Only CFer (I put the minimum at 800 innings) worse is Choo at a horrendous -15.6.

 

Jay does offer the ability to get on base but I get the feeling the White Sox will wanna put an emphasis on defense so I'm not sure he fits.

 

When looking at all these UZR stats, 2 guys stick out as players I'd like the Sox to try and acquire. Gerrado Parra and Colby Rasmus. They both are in the top 10 in UZR amongst players who have played CF at least 500 innings, both left handed, and both have a good bat to go with their gloves. With Melky/Gose/Bautista in Toronto and Eaton/Pollock/Ross in AZ both may be available for the right deal.

[Eminor3rd]

Indeed, but I didn't know he was bad defensively(wite isn't the only one saying this) so that kinda throws a wrench into my desire for him.

 

Using UZR Jay is actually a worse CFer than ADA, -3.7 vs -7.2. Only CFer (I put the minimum at 800 innings) worse is Choo at a horrendous -15.6.

 

Jay does offer the ability to get on base but I get the feeling the White Sox will wanna put an emphasis on defense so I'm not sure he fits.

 

When looking at all these UZR stats, 2 guys stick out as players I'd like the Sox to try and acquire. Gerrado Parra and Colby Rasmus. They both are in the top 10 in UZR amongst players who have played CF at least 500 innings, both left handed, and both have a good bat to go with their gloves. With Melky/Gose/Bautista in Toronto and Eaton/Pollock/Ross in AZ both may be available for the right deal.

 

Single season UZR isn't a great indicator of future performance, unfortunately, which is why so many people don't like it. It's a good descriptor, but a bad predictor.

[witesoxfan]

Single season UZR isn't a great indicator of future performance, unfortunately, which is why so many people don't like it. It's a good descriptor, but a bad predictor.

 

Right. Frankly, defense is also dependent upon scouting, coaching, and the defense of others around you too. Guys typically do not improve their defense, but it is not unheard of nor uncommon. I've seen Jay make some really good plays in the outfield in the past, but that doesn't make him a strong defender.

 

End of the day, I have no problem if the Sox were to bring in Jon Jay in a small trade - I like De Aza, so there's no reason I'd dislike Jay - I just think they need to aim for younger players than that.

[Eminor3rd]

Right. Frankly, defense is also dependent upon scouting, coaching, and the defense of others around you too. Guys typically do not improve their defense, but it is not unheard of nor uncommon. I've seen Jay make some really good plays in the outfield in the past, but that doesn't make him a strong defender.

 

End of the day, I have no problem if the Sox were to bring in Jon Jay in a small trade - I like De Aza, so there's no reason I'd dislike Jay - I just think they need to aim for younger players than that.

 

Yeah, for Jay, it would be a vet for vet swap that would make me happy.

[Lemon_44]

When the team is this bad, both physically and menatlly, obviously, an almost complete overhaul is needed. Through trades and a couple free agent signings I think te Sox can put a very good offensive lineup on the field.

 

For starters, sign Abreu and Hunter Pence. They shouldn't spend big money on McCann, plus I don't think ATL lets him go that easily. That's it for the free agents.

 

With trades, I start by giving Dunn away to any team that will take him. I think there will a team that will take a flyer him for 1 year and see what happens.

Next, I trade Alexei, who I still really like, along with a minor league pitcher and maybe another piece if needed, o STL for Mike Adams.

 

Next, I trade DeAza and again hit the minor league pitching along with another piece, if needed, to SF for Sandoval.

 

The '14 Sox lineup:

OF: Viciedo, Garcia, Pence

IF: Sandoval, Semien/Garcia, Beckham, Abreu/Adams

DH: Abreu/Adams

C: Phegley

Bench: Keppinger, Semien/Garcia, Danks, backup C

 

I think this could be realistic but, as in most cases, probably won't happen.

 

Also, they'd deal Konerko for nothing to any team interested and release Gillapsie(or trade Keppinger and keep Gillapsie).

 

[witesoxfan]

The idea of "giving" someone away screams bad baseball management to me. It also screams short-sighted and/or non-attentive if you are still giving Dunn away failing to realize how good he has been since about June 8th or whenever.

 

 

[Lemon_44]

The idea of "giving" someone away screams bad baseball management to me. It also screams short-sighted and/or non-attentive if you are still giving Dunn away failing to realize how good he has been since about June 8th or whenever.

I know he's been pretty good but I'm changing the whole attitude of the team. I'm not saying he's a problem, I just wouldn't expect any kind of significant return for him. We'd get rid of his salary and replace him younger options that can be part of the future. I don't see any way Dunn is here after his contract is up.

[greg775]

I know he's been pretty good but I'm changing the whole attitude of the team. I'm not saying he's a problem, I just wouldn't expect any kind of significant return for him. We'd get rid of his salary and replace him younger options that can be part of the future. I don't see any way Dunn is here after his contract is up.

 

How has Dunn's last 4 weeks affected the "how good he's been the second half?" Hasn't he been gawdawful the last four weeks or so? I do realize without him we probably will have fewest homers in all of baseball next year. Hahn has so much work to do to avoid a repeat of this season.