ILMOU Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Dec 4, 2013 -> 12:37 PM) The guy had a bushy beard but I don't think we need to jump to conclusions here I'm not. More wondering about personality/clubhouse issues, than what you think I'm thinking. Could there be more to the WS benching other than mere slumping? Of course , they brought in AJ, so that would seem to negate it. I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around the diminutive 3/21 deal, obviously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 QUOTE (Stan Bahnsen @ Dec 4, 2013 -> 01:51 PM) I'm not. More wondering about personality/clubhouse issues, than what you think I'm thinking. Could there be more to the WS benching other than mere slumping? Of course , they brought in AJ, so that would seem to negate it. I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around the diminutive 3/21 deal, obviously. Haha, I know what you're saying, but I can't turn down a good flea/caveman joke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coco1997 Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 (edited) Diamondbacks Prioritizing Trade For Ace By Steve Adams [December 4 at 1:54pm CST] The Diamondbacks are motivated to swing a trade for an ace-caliber pitcher, reports ESPN's Jerry Crasnick. Crasnick spoke with Arizona GM Kevin Towers, president/CEO Derrick Hall and owner Ken Kendrick in an excellent, in-depth breakdown of the situation. While Towers was quick to say that no player is untouchable, he sounded loath to part with prized pitching prospect Archie Bradley, a consensus Top 10 MLB prospect. I know he's supposedly "off-limits" but I wonder if Hahn has talked to Towers about Sale. Arizona has a ton of great prospects who could really plug most of this team's holes and accelerate the rebuilding process. Matt Davidson, Adam Eaton and Chris Owings come to mind. Edited December 4, 2013 by coco1997 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 If they are serious about dealing Sale, then they have to get a stud arm back in any deal, regardless of what teams do not want to do. Perhaps 2 stud arms, plus a slew of other prospects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunt Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 The Diamondbacks are motivated to swing a trade for an ace-caliber pitcher, reports ESPN's Jerry Crasnick Not that I in any way endorse it, but this franchise could turn around pretty quickly if they really did want to part with Sale. Something along the lines of Bradley + Davidson + Owings would definitely get me listening. Especially if the Sox have an opportunity to get Rodon or Hoffman in the draft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 QUOTE (coco1997 @ Dec 4, 2013 -> 02:50 PM) I know he's supposedly "off-limits" but I wonder if Hahn has talked to Towers about Sale. Arizona has a ton of great prospects who could really plug most of this team's holes and accelerate the rebuilding process. Matt Davidson, Adam Eaton and Chris Owings come to mind. I'm sure he asked. And then promptly hung up when Hahn asked for half of his roster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 If Arizona wants Sale, start with Archie Bradley and Didi Gregorius, and then add 2-3 more. But they've already said Bradley isn't going anywhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShandyMan Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 QUOTE (flavum @ Dec 4, 2013 -> 03:00 PM) If Arizona wants Sale, start with Archie Bradley and Didi Gregorius, and then add 2-3 more. But they've already said Bradley isn't going anywhere. bradley, skaggs, gregorious and davidson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 QUOTE (flavum @ Dec 4, 2013 -> 03:00 PM) If Arizona wants Sale, start with Archie Bradley and Didi Gregorius, and then add 2-3 more. But they've already said Bradley isn't going anywhere. They are going to have find it extremely difficult to acquire an actual ace type quality pitcher without giving up Bradley. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonard Zelig Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 QUOTE (flavum @ Dec 4, 2013 -> 03:00 PM) If Arizona wants Sale, start with Archie Bradley and Didi Gregorius, and then add 2-3 more. But they've already said Bradley isn't going anywhere. But they've already said Sale isn't going anywhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
professa Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 Sale and Ramirez for Didi Gregorius, Skaggs, AJ Pollock, and Matt Davidson I would pull the trigger on that. What we would get in return would, in my mind, put up a greater combined WAR than Sale and Alexei would. With this trade you have a great young core who is major league ready. Pollock Didi Dunn Abreu Viciedo Garcia Davidson Beckham Flowers/Phegley Quintana Danks Hector Skaggs Rienzo With that you have 1 player over 30 in your rotation and lineup Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSpalehoseCWS Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 Trading Sale is just dumb IMO. He's a young, cost-controlled ace. He's a piece you build around along with Abreu. Trade anyone else to help improve the team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 I'm sure you would get more WAR considering Didi Gregorious still has 5 years of controlled service time and he's a fantastic defensive shortstop. When making a trade like that, you want to get more than just that though, perhaps as much as 2 times as production as you give up with the idea that you will see a return on that production in the future. If they want Sale, they need to include Archie Bradley. Sale really has the best contract for a pitcher in today's game. He has an incredible amount of value. If they don't get an incredible amount of value - we're talking like 3 top 50-75 prospects or 4-5 top 100-150 level prospects - then there is no point in trading him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 Like I've said before... The price of Sale is astronomical and unprecedented. Look at what the A's got for Haren, now make it bigger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 QUOTE (staxx @ Dec 4, 2013 -> 03:01 PM) bradley, skaggs, gregorious and davidson I would be all over this. I like Sale as much as the next fan but as another poster already said the right haul would speed up the rebuilding quite a bit. Plus I'm still unsure of Sale's long term durability. Funny thing is a month ago the wifey and I were talking to each other about Sale to Arizona would be a fit for both teams provided Arizona caughed up the prospects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Princess Dye Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 The organization is a mess, honestly. If an organization reviving monster offer for Sale came in...you look at his mechanics and just basically do it. He either is one of those genetic freaks that can survive any amount of years of weird torque on his body ------- or he's not. And we'll only know the answer to that once he's either injured or done with a 15 yr career etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiliIrishHammock24 Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 I think it's fair to say Chris Sale should have the highest trade value of any pitcher in baseball right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 Gregorius, Eaton, Bradley, xx, xx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 I'm with ya Jose. The offer would have to be a damn good one but if the Sox can get an OF, 3B, front line starter and SS then do it. Bradley, Davidson, Pollack and Gregorius would get it done, IMO. If they insist no Bradley then Skaggs, Davidson, Gregorius plus a few other aspects is worth considering. Sale can only help this team roughly 33 games per year , but adding quality position playes in a trade such as this can help you much more often. The Sox could make a run at Tanaka with the few bucks saved in this trade scenario along with adding Bradley or Skaggs for the rotation in the near future. Hahn should at least keep his mind open. BMac was seen as untradable too and it wasn't long before Texas changed Kenny's mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiliIrishHammock24 Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 I don't want Gregorious. I'd rather have Owings. Assuming they wouldn't trade Bradley..... Skaggs, Owings, Davidson, Parra, Trahan for Sale. That trade would amazing consist of only blocked players given up by the Dbacks. Skaggs is blocked by "insert top pitching prospect here", Owings by Gregorious, Davidson by Prado, Parra by Eaton, Pollock, Ross, and Trahan by Montero. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Dec 4, 2013 -> 05:03 PM) I think it's fair to say Chris Sale should have the highest trade value of any pitcher in baseball right now. Without a doubt! Combine his age, contract, lefty and the fact that he's just damn good means a huge haul. His actual worth in a trade might be more than a team would give up tho. Hope I'm wrong on that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ginger Kid Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 Chris Getz was non-tendered. In other news, my dog s*** on the porch again last night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2Jimmy0 Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Dec 4, 2013 -> 05:03 PM) I think it's fair to say Chris Sale should have the highest trade value of any pitcher in baseball right now. With that contract this is absolutely true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILMOU Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Dec 4, 2013 -> 04:12 PM) I'm with ya Jose. The offer would have to be a damn good one but if the Sox can get an OF, 3B, front line starter and SS then do it. Bradley, Davidson, Pollack and Gregorius would get it done, IMO. If they insist no Bradley then Skaggs, Davidson, Gregorius plus a few other aspects is worth considering. Sale can only help this team roughly 33 games per year , but adding quality position playes in a trade such as this can help you much more often. The Sox could make a run at Tanaka with the few bucks saved in this trade scenario along with adding Bradley or Skaggs for the rotation in the near future. Hahn should at least keep his mind open. BMac was seen as untradable too and it wasn't long before Texas changed Kenny's mind. I hope this is all "Nintendo" talk. At the risk of not making any damn sense, I really don't want to trade Chris Sale, regardless of the return. His slider, imo, may be the most transcendent non-fastball pitch from a SP since the Koufax curve. For me, the slider makes him infinitely more fun to watch than Kershaw, Price or any other pitcher you can name. I enjoyed the hell out of him making Cargo and Tulo look like little-leaguers in the ASG. I fell in love early, and have looked forward to seeing him lead a playoff rotation for our guys. For this, I'm willing to wait a bit, if I feel we're at least heading in the right direction. I also believe that lacking a true Ace makes it very difficult to win the WS, and that our 2005 doesn't happen without Count's awesome run that ended in June of '06. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 QUOTE (Stan Bahnsen @ Dec 4, 2013 -> 05:27 PM) I hope this is all "Nintendo" talk. At the risk of not making any damn sense, I really don't want to trade Chris Sale, regardless of the return. His slider, imo, may be the most transcendent non-fastball pitch from a SP since the Koufax curve. For me, the slider makes him infinitely more fun to watch than Kershaw, Price or any other pitcher you can name. I enjoyed the hell out of him making Cargo and Tulo look like little-leaguers in the ASG. I fell in love early, and have looked forward to seeing him lead a playoff rotation for our guys. For this, I'm willing to wait a bit, if I feel we're at least heading in the right direction. I also believe that lacking a true Ace makes it very difficult to win the WS, and that our 2005 doesn't happen without Count's awesome run that ended in June of '06. Trading Sale who can only contribute to this team in 33 of 162 games per year is " Nintendo talk"? In the right trade Sale's return could fill multiple holes with players that can potentially help this team up 162 games per year each. This team is in dire need of help at multiple positions so the right return makes more sense than keeping one pitcher that can only help his team in 33 games per year. Now if Sale can play 3B, CF, 2B, C and LF than fine but until then the Sox need help bad! Your infatuation with Sale is obvious but I am a Sox fan first and foremost over any particular player. I would rather trade Sale to help make this team better overall than keep Sale out of pure puppy love. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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