southsider2k5 Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Feb 10, 2014 -> 05:57 PM) Not ignored. Not difference makers.the 3 combined for a 0.3 WAR in 2013. Bobby is Less talented of the Bundy boys. Also ignored is that is one only one team. Another quick google search gives up Anthony Rizzo and Will Middlebrooks from the 2007 draft of the Red Sox. Another click gives up Joba Chamberlin and Ian Kennedy from the Yankees 2006 draft. Rick Porcello from the Tigers pops up in another search. Also popping up were Camerin Maybin and Andrew Miller... you know the duo used to get that Cabrera guy? Jeff Samardzija was an overslot guy. Rick Ankiel was an over slot guy. JD Drew was an over slot guy. Got enough WARs yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 (edited) QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 10, 2014 -> 06:55 PM) Also ignored is that is one only one team. Another quick google search gives up Anthony Rizzo and Will Middlebrooks from the 2007 draft of the Red Sox. Another click gives up Joba Chamberlin and Ian Kennedy from the Yankees 2006 draft. Rick Porcello from the Tigers pops up in another search. Also popping up were Camerin Maybin and Andrew Miller... you know the duo used to get that Cabrera guy? Jeff Samardzija was an overslot guy. Rick Ankiel was an over slot guy. JD Drew was an over slot guy. Got enough WARs yet? And you do know why they might have signed above slot, they signed for less than the Sox gave guys like Honel and Broadway and McCollough, or maybe you don't. Samardzia got $250k.the White Sox couldn't recognize talent. It is truly amazing you can't understand that. Edited February 11, 2014 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Feb 10, 2014 -> 07:05 PM) And you do know why they might have signed above slot, they signed for less than the Sox gave guys like Honel and Broadway and McCollough, or maybe you don't. Samardzia got $250k.the White Sox couldn't recognize talent. It is truly amazing you can't understand that. Ah, and there the change in argument is. You got names, so you moved on to the next non sequitor. The lazy mans argument at its finest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 10, 2014 -> 07:11 PM) Ah, and there the change in argument is. You got names, so you moved on to the next non sequitor. The lazy mans argument at its finest. No change in the argument. You said the reason the Sox picked bad players was because of money. Then you mention players they could have signed that in reality cost less money than the bad players they did pick. I am done with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Feb 10, 2014 -> 07:13 PM) No change in the argument. You said the reason the Sox picked bad players was because of money. Then you mention players they could have signed that in reality cost less money than the bad players they did pick. I am done with you. And you are just making stuff up now anyway. Jeff Samardzija got a $2.5 million signing bonus, as a part of a 5 year $10 million contract when he signed, plus team options that put the contract out as much as $16.5 million, or damned close to what the Sox paid for ALL of their draft picks from 2007 to 2011. http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2736354 Great job making stuff up though. I'd walk away now too, if I got busted lying like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 QUOTE (Iwritecode @ Feb 10, 2014 -> 03:29 PM) DA and SS2K, I think you two are arguing past each other. I think both of your points are true. It’s not an either/or situation. Yeah, clearly there were multiple items contributing towards our draft struggles (prior to recent years). First, refusing to go overslot and passing on all Boras clients. We passed on a lot of talent over the years because Reinsdorf refused to break the "rules" or work with the agent that f***ed him over on Bobby Seay & Jeff Weaver . Second, a sustained run of solid success prevented us from getting any top 10 picks for a long ass time (18 years to be exact). Those top picks have a much higher probability of working out (relatively speaking), which put us at a major disadvantage to begin with. Not going overslot only worsened the problem. Third, our talent evaluation was incredibly poor an extended period. People can try to blame this on the lack of money, but here is the list of 1st round picks between Alex Fernandez (1990) and Chris Sale (2010), which represents a 19 year span: 2009 Jared Mitchell OF LSU 23 2008 Gordon Beckham SS Univ. of Georgia 8 2007 Aaron Poreda LHP San Francisco 25 2006 Kyle McCulloch RHP Texas 29 2005 Lance Broadway RHP TCU 15 2004 Josh Fields 3B Oklahoma State 18 2003 Brian Anderson OF U. of Arizona 15 2002 Roger Ring LHP San Diego State 18 2001 Kris Honel RHP Providence HS, New Lenox, 16 2000 Joe Borchard OF Camarillo, CA 12 1999 Jason Stumm RHP Centralia, WA 15 1999 Matt Ginter RHP Mississippi State U. 22 1998 Robert Wells RHP Baylor U. 16 1997 Jason Dellaero SS U of South Florida 15 1996 Bobby Seay LHP Sarasota, FL 12 1995 Jeff Liefer 3B Long Beach State U 25 1994 Mark Johnson C Warner Robbins, GA 26 1993 Scott Christman LHP Oregon State U 17 1992 Eddie Pearson 3B Bishop St JC 24 1991 Scott Ruffcorn RHP Baylor U 25 That list is absolutely pathetic. Doesn't matter how bad your player development is, you're bound to hit on a couple of your 1st round picks. I mean for f***'s sake, Kip Wells & Gordan Beckham were the best pitcher and position player we drafted in the 1st round during a 19 year period. That's almost impossible to believe. This leads me to the final reason for our struggles which is poor draft philosophy. For a period of time under Duane Schafer, we were wasting high picks on "safe" college arms like Ring, Broadway, & McCulloch with the intention of possibly flipping them quickly to help the major league club. That was a terrible idea from the get-go, as these players offered limited upside and eventually all sucked and brought back very little in return. Then after this period of time, the Sox switched to targeting raw, toolsy guys like Jared Mitchell, Trayce Thompson, & Keenyn Walker that had impact player potential but extremely low floors. While this was somewhat of a step in the right direction, the White Sox front office failed to have a development staff in place that could actually turn these raw prospects into major leaguers. Not understanding the strengths and weaknesses of the organization or simply overlooking them contributed to this poor draft philosophy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 Spring Training can't get here soon enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 QUOTE (Marty34 @ Feb 10, 2014 -> 06:29 PM) I think any GM in Hahn's position would have dealt the players he did I really don't think this could be further from the truth. Why didn't Terry Ryan deal Glen Perkins then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iwritecode Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 10, 2014 -> 07:20 PM) And you are just making stuff up now anyway. Jeff Samardzija got a $2.5 million signing bonus, as a part of a 5 year $10 million contract when he signed, plus team options that put the contract out as much as $16.5 million, or damned close to what the Sox paid for ALL of their draft picks from 2007 to 2011. http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2736354 Great job making stuff up though. I'd walk away now too, if I got busted lying like that. Wasn't he drafted by the Cubs in 2006? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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