June 23, 201510 yr QUOTE (shysocks @ Jun 23, 2015 -> 09:24 AM) He was signed to pitch well and he has. Saves are and always have been arbitrary and uninformative and I'm not that interested in a detailed discussion of why, but yes, I'll continue to ignore them. But I'm fully aware that they're a big part of how all-stars are chosen. Saves are arbitrary and uninformative... Well agents, managers, GM's, coaches, arbitrators all must be crazy (since this is how Closers get paid).
June 23, 201510 yr QUOTE (harkness @ Jun 23, 2015 -> 09:45 AM) Saves are arbitrary and uninformative... Well agents, managers, GM's, coaches, arbitrators all must be crazy (since this is how Closers get paid). Did Andrew Miller get paid for all the saves he has in his career? No. He got paid because he's awesome. Robertson is a really good pitcher.
June 23, 201510 yr QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Jun 23, 2015 -> 08:49 AM) Did Andrew Miller get paid for all the saves he has in his career? No. He got paid because he's awesome. Robertson is a really good pitcher. And it's the same reason Jose Quintana has a lot of value on the open market, despite his W/L record. He's also a really good pitcher. But he's not an All-Star either. I think we've let the pendulum swing so far to the other side where traditional statistics like ERA or RBI's or save conversions don't matter at all to some, as we can always find some statistic to throw out in support of almost any flaw. (And some have tried to do so with John Danks or Melky Cabrera's 2015 season).
June 23, 201510 yr QUOTE (harkness @ Jun 23, 2015 -> 09:45 AM) Saves are arbitrary and uninformative... Well agents, managers, GM's, coaches, arbitrators all must be crazy (since this is how Closers get paid). Pretty much. Everybody thought saves were useful for a long time; arbitration is still especially broken in that regard, but luckily most GM's today are living in reality. If Wade Davis and Dellin Betances were free agents in 2016 they would get monster crazy bucks, and they have 16 career saves between them. I'm not breaking new ground here; people have been arguing for a long time that saves are horrible. QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Jun 23, 2015 -> 09:49 AM) Did Andrew Miller get paid for all the saves he has in his career? No. He got paid because he's awesome. Robertson is a really good pitcher. Thank you. Miller is the perfect example.
June 23, 201510 yr QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jun 23, 2015 -> 10:21 AM) Sale and the Royals. They will probably all beat him up in the clubhouse.
June 23, 201510 yr QUOTE (ChiSox59 @ Jun 22, 2015 -> 10:40 PM) Ehh..Jose probably won't make it unless he gets hot the next few weeks, but even tho he has been a disappointment compared to last season, his numbers will keep him in the conversation. Jose Abreu and Eric Hosmer are going back and forth on which of them has the higher OPS from day to day and Hosmer is a better defender. Then there are Pujols, Teixeira, and Cabrera above him. Abreu is 5th in the AL in WAR and barely above Chris Davis among 1b. Abreu is no where close to being an all star and the only conversation is about how far away he is.
June 23, 201510 yr Author QUOTE (Soxfest @ Jun 23, 2015 -> 10:04 AM) Danks deserves to go, he has made a lot of guys all stars this year. Post of the week. Well done.
June 23, 201510 yr QUOTE (shysocks @ Jun 23, 2015 -> 10:04 AM) Pretty much. Everybody thought saves were useful for a long time; arbitration is still especially broken in that regard, but luckily most GM's today are living in reality. If Wade Davis and Dellin Betances were free agents in 2016 they would get monster crazy bucks, and they have 16 career saves between them. I'm not breaking new ground here; people have been arguing for a long time that saves are horrible. Thank you. Miller is the perfect example. Miller isn't a closer.... If you want to argue that Roberston deserves to go to the all star game just because of Whip/ERA and leave out saves... He still doesn't have as good of stats as a lot of guys. Call me old school though I guess.... I believe a good closer slams that door. Roberston is one of the worst in the AL comparatively at shutting that door.
June 23, 201510 yr QUOTE (harkness @ Jun 23, 2015 -> 04:11 PM) Miller isn't a closer.... I'm aware. That fact furthers my argument, not yours. You said if saves aren't important then why do agents, GM's, etc all send big money to the closers. I said that is changing and agreed that Miller's deal was evidence of that. QUOTE (harkness @ Jun 23, 2015 -> 04:11 PM) If you want to argue that Roberston deserves to go to the all star game just because of Whip/ERA and leave out saves... He still doesn't have as good of stats as a lot of guys. QUOTE (shysocks @ Jun 23, 2015 -> 09:16 AM) I think he at least belongs in the conversation, but there enough other relievers doing ridiculous things in the AL that I'd be unsurprised if he is left out. I should have also added that I wouldn't be disappointed.
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