Look at Ray Ray Run

It will be more fun for all of us to watch you make an excuse and complain about all of Nick Madrigals successes at the MLB level. Remember when he went 4-5 or 5-5 in Triple A and you said they would have all been outs in the big leagues? That was funny. The Sox should have no interest in moving Madrigal. He is what this team desperately needs - an elite defensive player who never strikes out, works counts and is as smart of a baseball player as you'll find. He is one of the key pieces this team was missing this year.

Price was no where near a 2 WAR pitcher this year. He accumulated 2.3 WAR in just 100 IP. Price has never had a FIP above 4.02. The demise of David Price has been greatly exaggerated because of his market and contract. Price and Benetendi for 32 million is more valuable than Cole for 32 million imo. I don't think it straps the Sox at all.

Why would Eloy move to right when Benetendi is, by far, the superior defender. An outfield of benetendi and robert would be electric defensively even with Eloy in left. Robert could shade eloy way and likely compensate himself for Eloys lack of range.

I know others have said this, and you don't agree, but JD is on a downward trend (the most alarming stat signifying him aging are his numbers against 95+mph fastballs. JDs production on those pitches has cratered the past two years, symbolizing a reduction in bat speed) while one could argue Castellanos is trending upward. His EVs and etc have increased. Its very possible that Castellanos could outhit Martinez in the final two years of his deal. I wouldnt be upset about Castellanos. The more I dig into his numbers the more encouraging his progress and growth appears. The kid could really be coming into his own at 28-29 years old and I wouldnt be shocked to see 900+ ops' from him for a year or two of his peak.

Price was on a 4.5 WAR pace this year. He's no longer a star, but he certainly is still a + starter who would liking get 20+ million a year if he was a FA. He's probably overpaid by about 30 million so Benetendis surplus value would negate that difference and the sox should only have to give up a middling prospect.

I believe the theory is if the White Sox take on salary they wont need to surrender any real assets. Benetendi would be required for Boston to shed those contracts. How funny, 2 years ago some sox fans were crying that the Sox got Moncada instead of Benetendi. I think we can all thank Hahn for picking the correct prospect.

Not positive on this calculation, but I believe Abreu actually got a small amount of defensive value at 1st last year compared to being a full time DH. The WAR penalty for being a DH is greater than the penalty he received for his first base defense.

And, the only data we have ever had on this has been taken from facebook and other social media platforms. What that told us was the split was about 55-45 within the Metro area of Chicago. If you include Iowa and down state the Cubs have a big advantage. If you include NW Indiana the Sox recover some. That said, the Chicago Metro area (suburbs and city) shows about a 55-45 split with the West Suburbs being nearly 50/50, south Suburbs being slight edge to the Sox and the N and NW suburbs being about 65-35 Cubs. When the Sox were good and the Cubs bad, that number probably swayed in the Sox favor more than the 55-45 as the casual fan will change interest based on success. By all means, if the Sox can have a decade of sustained success - or even 5 years - they could recapture some of the fans they have lost with a decade of failure. When I was a kid in the 90's, the split felt much closer to 50/50 than it does today.

I know Sox fans don't want to admit it, but the risk of a Cole or Stras contract is massive. I know people say arm contracts have been moveable, but if Cole or Stras goes down with a serious arm injury that sets the franchise back as they can't really afford to eat 250 million or 200 million for anyone. They just don't have that kind of financial flexibility. Mookie, as you pointed out is a much more sure thing than the arms. It's hard to rationalize investing 25-20% of your payroll on one pitcher when you're a non-premium revenue franchise.

The club has at least two premier talents right now. They need to not be stars and scrubs.

Keuchel was worse this year in the NL than Buehrle ever was in his career but for 2006. Keuchel is a poor man's mark buehrle. Keuchel would have to pitch 14 more seasons at his exact production level to date to come within Buehrles career WAR. You're right to be pessimistic about Keuchel. He's simply not good. Mark Buehrle was awesome.

Agree with you in regards to your last point. The only agent who should have his license stripped is ozzie albies agent. The Braves should be embarrassed for working with him to take advantage of ozzie.

Yeah, it would be because the White Sox arent desirable not because Cole is from Southern California or anything. I'm going to see my way out of this thread; no one is budging from their opinions regardless of evidence provided. Have a good one.

I said the above refuting Jack's post saying the Sox dont get players because no one wants to play for them. You said Jack was absolutely right. Now you're back tracking and acting as if I put words on your mouth and as if i derailed the thread and conversation. Its nonsensical.

How can you claim you never said it when here is the exact quote of you saying it.

For the record, the cardinals pushed back against the notion once it leaked as they should have; you dont want your fans of team thinking you offered more but someone did not want to play for you. All the reports immediately following the signing said the White Sox didnt offer the most. How accurate that is, I'm not sure as I dont have first hand knowledge.

This is true, but I'm not sure it opens up his market to teams who weren't interested. Grandals $ value offers were less because of it, but the interested teams shouldnt change all that much.

Pitchers always draw more interest in FA than position players - this is nothing new. Teams need 5 starters and 8 relievers; they only need 1 third baseman or 2nd baseman. This leads to more interest for pitchers than hitters. Grandal had just as much of a market last off season as he does this off season. The only thing that has changed is hes a year older.

Yes it is under dispute. This entire conversation started because you and Parkman have insinuated that the Sox arent desirable so they have to offer more than other teams just to get the same player. Its complete nonsense. The sox are no different than every other team. They dont have to pay some fictitious white sox tax to convince a player to come.

Admit? You guys cant name a single example of your ignorant claim yet you cite it as gospel. It's absolutely comical.

Why are there more teams in the market? What leads you to believe this?

Can you link the quote? All I have seen is the following: There have also been reports that the St. Louis Cardinals may have offered slightly more money, but that the personalized presentation and approach by the White Sox (including a video featuring Rick Renteria, Jose Abreu and Yoan Moncada, in Spanish) may have made the difference - see this report from Dan Hayes. it was also reported the cardinals weren't the only team that may have out bid the White Sox. I never said the sox can consistently get away with offering less. I have said I cite an example in which they offered less and still got their guy; dispelling the notion that they have to offer more because players dont want to come here.

What inside information have I ever pretended to have? Do you see me calling you a douche? What you'll notice is I reply to the post not the poster. You might want to give that a try. When I start calling people names and referring go them as idiots or douche bags, I'll go ahead and surrender as substance is clearly not something I can argue.

It tends to leak - as was the case with Robert - when this happens. I just cited an example that supports my claim - luis robert. Why cant you cite a single claim that supports yours? You dont think a team would leak that they made the highest offer for a guy?

Got it, so Scott Boras should not be allowed to be an agent ever again.