greg775

QUOTE (iamshack @ Sep 30, 2011 -> 01:48 AM) I never said anything of the sort. Evan Longoria is a monster player, and most-likely would be regardless of who had the pleasure of drafting him. What I said was that Martinez has been part of a culture that has handled several young players extraordinarily well. This probably occurred as a matter of necessity more than anything, but the fact is that Tampa managed to make the playoffs in a division where the two biggest superpowers in baseball reside with an abundance of young players coming through their system. Not to use a college basketball analogy but Roy Williams at Kansas had a winning "culture" to the tune of about an .820 win percentage. Virtually all of his assistant coaches were huge flops when they became head coaches including Matt Doherty who just about killed Carolina's program he was so bad.

Hope the Blackhawks take us thru the offseason cause the Bears look average with Cutler getting killed back there and the Bulls may never play. I guess we'll know after this weekend whether the NBA will play before January. Let the offseason begin. It'll be quiet til after the WS. My guess is we'll find out soon on Alomar, but Sox can't name him or anybody else til after WS, right?? One good thing, for me the only good thing, about getting rid of Ozzie is the fact the team shouldn't be as dysfunctional like it was the past year and a half. We can look forward to Opening Day without fearing a lot of weird s***, like ... - Leading 12-0 and almost losing the opener. - Inability to win Central Division games even tho our division sucks. - Inability to win at home. s***, even bad teams go .500 at home. - Inability to have a blowout win, but have a ton of blowout losses and close-game victories. - Inability to lay down a simple bunt. - Inability to have one simple winning streak (did we get one all the way to 7 games this year? Or was it 5?) The crazy dysfunctionality should end or better end. GO SOX! (of course we could turn into the Royals or Astros and lose, lose, lose, dysfunctionality be damned).

QUOTE (Soxfest @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 11:33 PM) From the desk of JR Organizational plan 2012 White Sox 1. Raise parking up another $1.00 being highest in majors already is not enough. 2. Raise ticket prices and make all games premium games no more half priced Monday's, it worked so well in 2011! I love mid 20,000's for Yankees & Boston 3. Lower payroll ASAP. 4. Offer 13 games Kenny Williams is back again and again plan. 5. Spend even less in 2012 draft and player development, being last now is fun and makes our minor league system the envy of MLB. 6. Sign no free agents this winter, but check waiver wire weekly. 7. Have Kenny b**** about attendance each month starting in May and having no money at the trade deadline, put focus on the fan's rather than Kenny's performance. Excellent post. If Cowley wrote this he'd prolly get a raise. Good stuff.

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 08:48 PM) And what if that does happen? We'd all be happy. If Dunn starts hitting the ball over the outfield walls regularly and Rios hits .300 and slugs like he did 2 years ago, our new manager likely will be the face of the franchise quickly.

QUOTE (Cali @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 08:39 PM) Huh, I always assumed a team's relevancy was dependent on you know the PLAYERS, not the manager... QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 09:14 PM) I think some are deluding themselves about the appeal of the managerial job for the Sox. The good side of working for the Sox is that you have a really long leash and the organization is loyal to a fault. There is some nice young talent on the roster between Viciedo, De Aza, Beckham, Sale, Stewart, Reed, and Santos that are all pre-arb players so will likely be around for a while. The other side of the equation is that JR is still owner so the GM is handcuffed to select signable talent in the draft. There will be no Boras clients (often the best players in baseball). Secondary team in the media market. Payroll will be getting slashed and Sox will enter a rebuilding phase. The Sox are on the hook for overpriced vets like Dunn, Rios, and Peavy. You are likely losing the top two-three pitchers in the rotation going into next season. I just dont see any top candidate taking a look at that and thinking that is the situation they want to put themselves in. Dave Martinez is going to get to pick his job when he leaves TB. Tito would sit out and lick his wounds before jumping in with the Sox. The Sox are going to have to roll the dice on someone. While I like Sandy Alomar, the more I think about it the more Sandberg makes sense. He has experience in player development as he has coached at every level of minor league baseball. He has a little competitive fire in his belly as a manager. I think that the Sox should look at someone who has worked in the minors if they are serious about going into rebuilding. QUOTE (chw42 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 10:05 PM) So dull manager = bad team? 1.) I agree players win games, so I guess Alomar could be great if everybody has career years. 2.) Nice post IMO. I agree they are rolling the dice on Sandy. He'll come relatively cheap and be calm if we suck next year. 3.) No, but I think if you have a chance to get a personality who has won a WS like Francona, you'd be stupid to not take him over what, a couple million dollars? Pay the money, steal the headlines. I just have this gut feeling that Sandy will be the calm guy who is in charge as our team takes over KC's role as doormat in the division.

QUOTE (Kalapse @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 09:31 PM) Jon Heyman doesnt sound like #chisox would be legit landing spot for francona. folks think they may go younger 2 minutes ago via web KW should be fired if he doesn't go after the best available guy. I have this weird feeling some guys may turn the job down, though. You got a pretty boy GM with an ego and an owner who at any moment might go on the cheap again. And you got the Dunn problem.

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 09:29 PM) Trust me. No matter who the manager is, until the end of time or the MLB goes belly up, any manager for any team will be b**** and argued about... Exactly. Next season a few people might wait a few games before leveling the new manager, cause it'll seem like they are praising Ozzie or something, but the second guessing will be strong if the team stinks. Or maybe everybody will turn on Kenny and he'll be the whipping boy. I'll be able to take part in that as I despise him even though I give him credit for 05.

QUOTE (chw42 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 09:30 PM) This is considering we don't acquire anybody that will contribute to the ML roster next year. Lineup 1. De Aza CF 2. Ramirez SS 3. Dunn DH 4. Konerko 1B 5. Viciedo RF 6. Pierzynski/Flowers C 7. Rios RF 8. Morel 3B 9. Beckham/Lillibridge 2B If Dunn and Rios actually play like they're paid, then that won't be such a bad offense. You can trade Quentin for prospects for all I care. This is considering we don't trade Danks away and Buehrle won't be brought back. Rotation 1. Danks 2. Floyd 3. Peavy 4. Sale 5. Humber/Stewart/Axelrod Bullpen LR Stewart/Axelrod MR Filler RP MR Ohman MR Reed SU Crain SU Thornton CL Santos If things go right next year, this team still has a chance to succeed. There is still a decent amount of talent on this team, it just has to perform. That's why I want Francona. BTW rightfield is crowded in your scenario and left is left vacant.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 07:31 PM) Dunn will not walk away from $28M under any circumstances. Foolish to think so. The new manager will properly motivate him and it's 45 homers again from Mr. Dunn! And .325 from Rios!

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 07:23 PM) FWIW, Terry Boers just said his source told him there is only one name on the list: Alomar. No offense to Sandy, but this truly is our return to irrelevance. Francona would be making a statement. Sandy? Nice dull man to manage a dead team as it rebuilds and hopes the rebuild isn't Royals or Pirates like.

QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 07:50 PM) I didn't realize that 2010 was a contract year. You got me there, but Rios' career stats scream "average player" to me. 21 homers, 88 rbi's last year, good slugging percentage, nice year especially for him. 17, 71 the year before 14, 62 the year before 15, 79 theyear before 24, 85 in 2007. His other "good year." I guess conceivably he could bounce back next year at the age of 31. I don't think it'll have anything to do with the manager. It'll have everything to do with what's in that guy's head. I wonder if he has performance bonuses in his contract. He's the guy who needs some.

QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 06:46 PM) Rios had a good season in 2010. I don't know how Ozzie's supposed to get him to play harder. I'm not a manager. But I do know that it's his f***ing job to get his players to play hard. If they don't, it's on the manager and he will be let go. The only way to get Rios to play hard is with money. If it's a contract year, look for him to perk up.

QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 06:36 PM) He had a good season last year. The talent is there. The guy just didn't give a rat's ass this year, and it's on the manager to get the most out of him. As much as you hate me, this is why I hate your posts sometimes. That's just insane reasoning. The manager has to try to get something out of a bum like Rios? History of sports on all levels show that a turd is a turd. Polish it all you want it's a turd. You hate Ozzie, fine. But to put Rios on Ozzie is unfair and in my opinion, totally unfounded. What's Oz supposed to do to fire him up? Put $10,000 in his locker and say he can keep it if he hits .280 and actually hustles? You get on me for not posting stats or things to back up my arguments that are based on theory. This theory of yours blaming Ozzie for Rios is so off base. Do you stand by this post of yours?? Good luck to the next manager in "getting the most" out of Rios. It's a miracle a manager can get Rios to show up to the park every day. Oh wait ... Rios wouldn't get paid if he didn't show up and might get suspended which would affect his pocketbook. So he shows up.

QUOTE (whitesoxfan101 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 08:18 AM) 1. Tito 2. Martinez 3. Sandy Considering the fact that La Russa is likely no longer in play, anybody else besides the above 3 would almost guaranteed be a shocking hire. And by shocking, I mean bad. Seems like the right order to me. I wonder if Francona would want the Sox job though. Is he buddies with Jerry? Sox are a few salary dumps away from being a last place team on paper.

QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 08:11 PM) No I mean they should keep Danks if they can finally sign him to an extension. If not, then trade Danks and (ugh) keep Buehrle. Didn't Mark have some insane amount of quality starts in a row to start the season? Tough crowd.

Not really. I saw some of the Florida interview and he referred to Chicago as "home." The stuff Ozzie says has never bothered me. I truly chalk it up as "Ozzie being Ozzie," and also the fact he is a former spoiled ballplayer who is now a manager. I think it's funny to see an egomaniac manage a team, I really do. I'd probably eventually have tired of his act had I thought he was a buffoon as a manager as you guys do. I had no problem with his moves for the most part. I don't give a f*** if he lost his passion. I think that's bulls*** again of Ozzie being Ozzie. You ever watch dugout shots when his team wins or does something good? He's into the game. He wanted to win. It was the inevitable divorce. Managers are hired to get fired. Yes, I guess, Jerry would have let him stick around the final year of his deal which is pretty damn gracious cause it would have been a disastrous year with Oz's mouth and the fact he has to do a pregame dugout chat with the media as well as postgame every single gameday. He wanted his extension and payday. As a loudmouth, Ozzie couldn't let that slide by. Only way to keep him happy is keep making sure he has a minimum of 2 years left on his deal. I am a Sox fan more than an Ozzie fan but this is tough for me as a fan cause Ozzie did win me over especially in 05. I think the guy was funny and even a good manager. He probably should have told his kids to quit acting up, but whatever. This Loria guy is truly bizarre, appears to be an asshole, so I don't know what will happen in Florida. There's something to be said about bosses like Jerry who apparently doesn't meddle too much (in terms of day/day strategy, etc). Loria seems like a prick. I don't think Sox fans will support a rebuild, at least attendance wise, so I don't know what will happen in Chicago. I can't even think of a former Sox manager I truly liked, so I would guess after the new guy is named, I won't defend him or even care about him much. I'll just want to win.

QUOTE (Wanne @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 04:08 PM) If we're rebuilding how could anyone see Francona as a real possibility? Hoping it's Alomar. How is it rebuilding when you have AJ, Lexi (33?), Konerko, Quentin, Rios and Dunn as everyday players? What are we rebuilding? Our pitching staff? Bring in Francona, keep Buehrle and see if the new regime can win a pennant.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 08:08 AM) Oh right, exactly... Honestly, people need to stop equating talented Managers and FO executives with winning a title in the previous three years. That basically means there are only about 10 people in the entire industry that have a clue what they're doing... And if that were the case, do you really think their current employers would ever let them go? Great great post. Post of the season.

QUOTE (Papa Tru @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 07:10 AM) Its just funny that the Red Sox won a world series and have 1 playoff appearance and a huge September fade since and that's pretty much what we've seen here recently.. and now people want that manager I wanted to keep our manager, Ozzie Guillen. But since he's gone, it's a no brainer. Francona is available. GET HIM! I'd take their regular season record in the Central Division any day.

QUOTE (knightni @ Sep 28, 2011 -> 11:09 PM) Buehrle getting saluted yesterday. The Pierre walk off extra innings hit earlier this month. Viciedo and Flowers going on a tear after they came up. Soxtalk getting Paulie in the All Star Game. Lillibomb's great OF plays vs the Yankees in April. Humber coming out of nowhere to pitch well. Santos and Sale helping a beleaguered bullpen after the blown saves of April and May. Morel picking it up at the end of the year - hopefully carrying that into 2012. QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 01:07 AM) here is an honest one for you guys: my favorite part was Hawk and Wimpy reuniting in the booth and letting bygones be bygones. it was very nostalgic for me listening to those two again 1.) Good post. I was going to say Opening Day as the only highlight but you pointed out some good moments. 2.) Hawk with Wimpy was the best. You are right there. I heard it and it was great. Wimpy even joined in on the home run call which Stoney won't do. Which is cool of Stoney but it was neat to hear Wimpy say, 'Yes.'

QUOTE (Papa Tru @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 07:04 AM) The only thing anyone talks about here is how this team always falls on its face late in the season, so naturally we should sign a manager that just had one of the worst fails in baseball history.. What exactly have the Red Sox done since their last World Series? The exact same as we have pretty much.. He's a proven manager. s*** happens. Why do people think Martinez is so great? Oh I know why. He's the unknown again. The sexy unknown. He's never been a manager so we want him as the sexy choice. Just because things fall apart doesn't mean Francona isn't a baseball god! He's experienced and should be our next manager IMO. If Sox are too cheap that's just crap. Have fun drinking your $10 beers next season at the Cell and paying a ransom for parking as we rebuild with a rookie manager.

QUOTE (Papa Tru @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 07:00 AM) Yeah I know he has been pushing for that, but I think that was more about wanting to be wanted here than just about getting more money.. He wanted to have security of being manager here for the foreseeable future.. He didn't need to plead for anything as the Marlins job was waiting for him regardless.. Once he knew that he was no longer welcome here, he pretty much left on the spot.. He got a 4 year deal in the $12 million dollar range, that cant be substantially better than what he was already making here.. A four year deal? I was mocked for suggesting he'd get one. That's the last time I'll mention it, but since nobody congratulated me so I had to take credit myself since a lot of people on here think I am a moron who does not know baseball at all.

QUOTE (chw42 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 05:24 AM) I would love to see a well-written and well-thought out essay on this matter by one of the Ozzie supporters on this board. But that will never happen... I don't think you guys want to read another essay on why I love Ozzie. Milkman approved of my long post in the other thread. I love Ozzie Guillen. You really want more of my reasons why??

Francona. It'd be asinine to not take the best available guy. Sox are too cheap to hire him??? Then the fans should not pay the outrageous parking prices and ticket prices AND BOYCOTT THE f***ING TEAM! We can get Francona. Get him!

QUOTE (iamshack @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 05:13 AM) So let me get this straight...if you are tasked to work with some complete asshat at work, and you cannot, that means that you should be fired along with the asshat? What the hell kind of sense does that make? It makes a lot of sense. KW hired that asshat. He did. Or Jerry did. Whatever. Kenny technically hired Ozzie and said publicly he was his "boss." Jerry told the two late last season or after last season to do better and make it work. It takes two to not tango. KW is just as much to blame of the fallout with Ozzie as Ozzie. You are totally taking KW's side on that??