77 Hitmen

IMO, that supports the argument that JR's bluff of the team moving is just that - a bluff and they aren't moving in the first place. It would be a different story if the Sox played in a dilapidated stadium that was simply awful like the Expos and A's. Do I think the Sox franchise would be much better off with a well-designed stadium at The 78? Absolutely. But GRF isn't so bad such that MLB would approve a Sox move to Nashville or Charlotte. Plus I don't know why MLB would want to go through some convoluted scheme of letting the Sox move and pissing off 1/3 of Chicago only to put an expansion team here at the same GRF. Why not just keep the Sox in Chicago and keep Nashville open for an expansion bid?

Seriously. You'd think so judging by the reaction. Maybe these thoughts will bring some fans back off the ledge: The Governor said he needs to be convinced it's good for the state and hasn't seen that yet. He did not say anything to the effect of "no way, absolutely not in a million years regardless of the terms, we won't give a dime toward this project" MLB wants to put an expansion team in Nashville and reap an exorbitant expansion fee. I doubt the other owners would be keen on letting the Sox leave a perfectly serviceable stadium and the #3 TV market and take the Nashville market off the boards. The only 2 teams who have moved since 1972 played for years in a decrepit stadium and tried for years to get a new park in their current town. And the A's move to Vegas is hitting major roadblocks and isn't quite the done deal it appeared to be a few months ago. Until someone builds something on The 78, it's still available for a potential ballpark in the coming years even if nothing gets passed this year. A deal could be made in future years and maybe with a new owner. I have not seen JR say anywhere that his current funding proposal is his last and final offer before he brings in the moving trucks. All Pritzker's comments tell me is that he's not going to cave to JR's first proposal and give him everything he wants. He'd be a fool to say anything otherwise.

I agree. That debt is *only* $50M. If Jerry isn't willing to cover that, then the state should tell him no. JR is saving at least that much by slashing payroll after the rebuild crashed and burned. There are no term limits for Illinois Governor. Edgar chose not to seek a 3rd term voluntarily. Everyone else since him has been limited due to their incompetence and/or crookedness.

One of the things that makes fans and tax payers angry out building a publicly-funded ballpark at the 78 is that it will significantly boost the value of the Sox franchise, thus enriching JR's family and the other co-owners to the tune of hundreds of millions when the team is sold after his passing. I'm just spitballing here, but could a potential finance deal include a provision that any proceeds from a future team sale above the current franchise value (with perhaps a modest bump up) goes back to the state to pay off part of the ISFA debt? The Orioles just sold for $1.7 if I'm not mistaken. I have no idea if this scheme is even feasible and is a totally ridiculous idea, but it could be a way for the state to recover some of the cost for this project while preventing this from purely lining the pockets of JR's heirs.

A large amount of the money beyond the $1B for the stadium will go for infrastructure at the site. The big ticket items I've heard of are a Red Line subway stop at 15th and Clark, building a Riverwalk to connect the site to downtown, and realignment of the Rock Island tracks. So, it's not just running utilities through there. Those items alone will cost a ton of money (hundreds of millions I'm guessing), but will make the land more valuable for development regardless of whether the site includes a ballpark. IMO, realignment of the train tracks is a must if they ever want to fully realize the value of that property (even without a ballpark). Right now, you really can't access it from Clark St. due to the train line running right along the Clark St. edge of the 78 property. Moving and lowering the grade of those Metra tracks will be costly.

Yes, but if we keep repeating that it's a $4B handout directly to Jerry Reinsdorf, then it becomes true, right?

Oh, I agree that the veiled threat of the Sox relocating is an empty one. MLB wants to grant an expansion franchise to Nashville and not have that city taken out of consideration by a team who is leaving a huge TV market and a perfectly functional ballpark. I was just reacting to some fans who seem to be wishing and hoping for this team to move out of town rather than getting even a dime of public financing just like 95% of every other MLB teams do. I don't agree that being an AL vs an NL team matters anymore, though. Every team plays the all 29 other teams each year now. I wouldn't be surprised if MLB tries to push radical realignment at some point that will totally trash any semblance of an American League and National League.

And the owner they hate turns 88 this weekend. I can't stand him and what he's done this franchise either, but do people really think he's still going to be the owner in 10 years? He's not going to be around forever. But if the Sox move out of town, it will be forever. So diehard Sox fans should be careful what they wish for and also shouldn't be so eager to tell their state reps they're fine with the Sox leaving town....in fact they prefer it!

Maybe Jerry needs to hire a good PR guy to do all the talking to the public. Every time he opens his mouth, he pisses off and alienates the fan base. This is just who he is and he's been a walking PR disaster for 43 years. The man is completely incapable of showing even an ounce of empathy to the fans. I have to wonder if Related Midwest does a collective face palm every time they read another JR quote in the media. As someone who hopes this new park gets built, I just hope Jerry is better at talking to the politicians than he is at talking to the fans.

I agree, but unfortunately that's not the world we live in. The Amazons, Foxconns, etc. get huge tax breaks. Billionaire sports owners get hundreds of millions in public funds for new stadiums, some of which only last 20 years. I agree that this sucks, but that's the way things are. As a Sox fan, I don't want my team to be the one "line in the sand" that is drawn against this. That being said, JR has to concede something. If his current ask isn't just an opening bid, but his last and final bid, then he's not going to get this approved.

That's not going to happen in a million years. The Cleveland lawsuit to keep the Browns history for an expansion team was pretty much the only time this has ever happened. Also, if the Sox move away, there's not going to be any new 2nd team coming. It'll be the Cubs only in Chicago, period. Nobody is moving here to play in Bridgeport. And yes, I totally sympathize for your reason for feeling this way!

I'm simply amazed at how many Sox fans actually want this team to move to another city than even a single public dime go to what looks like a fantastic new park. This has to be the only fanbase where die hard fans are willing to tell their elected officials to let their team leave. This isn't Cubs fans saying this, it's die hard Sox fans. Are there other fan bases where the diehards are so outraged at the idea of any public funding for a new stadium to the point of hoping their team moves away? Because just about every other team gets a ton of public money for new stadiums or massive renovations. Are Brewers, Diamondbacks, Titans, etc. fans hoping their state/city tells the team to go "pound sand" and move away? What about the Cleveland Guardians and Browns fans? I could list most MLB and NFL teams. We Sox fans must be one of a kind. And to clarify, I don't want the city/state to just had over a $1B check to JR without him spending any of his own money. That's what negotiations are for. The whole issue is very nuanced too with the hotel tax money being used and the huge debt owed on Soldier Field that the city could get some relief from with this deal. Anyone who thinks that, if the Sox moved to Nashville, the hotel tax will be redirected to much-needed social programs is fooling themselves. It'll either just go away or used to go towards Bears stadium needs.

Excellent summary. It's a very complex issue. It's not as simple as telling JR to take a jump off the top of the Sears Tower (or the GRF upper deck). I don't want a $1B hand out to him so that his family can sell the team for hundreds of millions more without him putting up a huge chuck of his own money toward this, but I can imagine there's a possible deal to be had here where both sides can get something they want.

Seems like the Bears deal is much worse. The renovated Soldier Field opened in 2003 and the McCaskeys wanted out less than 20 years later with the city/state still on the hook for $600M in payments on the Soldier Field reno. And can you imagine the outrage if it was Reinsdorf who was battling school districts now over property tax money? And I'm not saying this as a JR defender by any means. He's been a horrible owner and is now playing the "relocation" card to try to get the government to pick up the entire tab on this new stadium project.

Who is this new shareholder?

That was my thought. That Soldier Field repayment is totally backloaded and the city will be on the hook to make huge payments in the near future (by 2033?) if the hotel tax can't cover it. This gives them somewhat of a break from that awful deal. The Sox Machine podcast with Justin Laurence of Crain's has a pretty good discussion on it.

At least one of the Reps was Kelly Cassidy, whose district includes the Rogers Park part of the city.

But they don't need a unanimous vote to pass any stadium funding legislation, right? Having 3 legislators saying no way in hell doesn't mean this is doomed.

The-Money-Will-Be-Spent Field Also, add these features to the park in a nod to the Reinsdorf era: SportsVision Lounge "A Seat At The Table" Picnic Area Ribbie and Roobarb Kids Area White Flag Patio '94 Work Stoppage Bar and Grill