LDF

QUOTE (Coach @ Sep 29, 2015 -> 12:21 PM) There are a number of factors why attendance is down. I am a true baseball fan and love the Sox but here is my opinion for what its worth. We all work hard and to pay money to see crappy baseball is not worth my time and money. It takes me 2 hours each way to get to the ball park. Now, all teams go through periods of rebuilding periods but when you don't see any improvements, why should anyone bother? Ventura has been managing for 4 years now and I have seen enough of him to say he needs to go. Let's save that for another post. Over the last several years, I have seen bad fundamentals that I can't believe. Starting with base running. I can't tell you how many times I have seen runners get doubled off because they break on contact instead of seeing the play develop. Isn't this what minor league is suppose to do? Teach? How many chances doe LaRoche need? He K's about 33% of the time and Shuck does about 10%. Why not have Shuck DH? It's called playing to your strengths not weaknesses. How about the lack of offense over the past several years? How many games can the Sox win if they do not acquire enough bats? The bottom half of the order is lousy and the entire team's lack of situational hitting is horrible. How many times can the Sox leave men on base or not have QABs? And my last point is the location. It sucks. No other way around it. They should have built the new stadium by circle campus. They could have created an atmosphere outside the ball park because they would have had room. There could have been things to do with kids outside of the game. I will not spend an entire day traveling to and from the game to watch bad baseball when I can watch it on tv for free and not pay $9.00 for a beer. Wake me when the Sox start to play better. the owners and again, my rant on the owners, they have done nothing but screwed up in a majority of the things they tried to max their money investment. moving or the offer to move, they failed, charge outrageous prices after the WS in 2005. pricing at the concession stand ..... really outrageous. maybe if the product on the field that wouldn't have been a major hit. but they have failed to really adjust the prices overall on how the idea of economics have change. instead of max the prices with is already high, but to lower the price and they will sell more. i don't know, i honestly have always felt the the owners biggest problem over the yrs has the person they see in the mirror.

QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Sep 29, 2015 -> 02:04 PM) If this is what you're referring to, then it was me yeah..... that was great. funny!!!!

QUOTE (ewokpelts @ Sep 29, 2015 -> 06:40 AM) He asked about the location. Please keep track of where the conversation is going. why it still comes back to winning. location aside, put a winning product on the field and 2.8+ will be seen again. last yr, 2014 attendance was 1,650,821, per espn. 2015 with games left, it stands at 1,661,541 per espn.

QUOTE (VAfan @ Sep 29, 2015 -> 04:34 AM) Here's what I think the Sox WILL DO, not what I want them to do. 1. Keep Ventura another year. As I said in my post above, this would be a very big mistake. He really hasn't brought anything to the table. No one can make even a shred of a case that he's helped the team win more games than it would without him. He doesn't manage pitching well, is a bad in-game tactician, and the team is HORRIBLE at fundamental baseball. It's this last part that should get him fired. But it won't. 2. Keep Adam LaRoche and hope he rebounds. With Trayce Thompson, the Sox may have the right-handed platoon for LaRoche, but otherwise, I think the Sox aren't going to eat his $12.5M contract, and no one would take him off our hands on the trade market. 3. Keep Avisail Garcia in RF. Like they did with Viciedo, the Sox will reason that this was Garcia's first full season, and will hope that he still has upside. This is really a futile exercise, but because he's still so cheap, the Sox will talk themselves into it. 4. Pick up Alexei's $10M option. This is a tricky one. They might try to get him to sign a cheaper deal, but to do so they have to cut him loose, at which point he can sell his services to anyone. I expect he'll think he can get the $10M (or more) from somewhere else, and/or more years at the same time. Knowing this, the Sox will cave and keep him. 5. Keep John Danks. Again, no takers on the trade market for Danks' last season. Sox will see him as a bridge to Fullmer, and will keep hoping he gets slightly better. 6. Plan for 2B to be the same contest it was this year -- Sanchez v. Micah Johnson. Sanchez had only one good month, and the rest has ranged from crap to awful crap. But he plays good defense, and like Garcia, the Sox will hope for his hitting to improve. Johnson's fielding still won't be good enough to displace Sanchez. 7. Keep Flowers at C. The differential between Flowers and Soto for certain pitchers will persuade the Sox to keep Flowers rather than look for a free agent replacement. Sox might also bring Soto back. 8. Tender the Shark, and let him go. The Sox will likely fill this rotation spot from within, with Eric Johnson in the lead. But I expect we'll also sign a cheap starter to have competition for this spot. 9. Keep Quintana. Sox will realize if they trade Q, it will just create a hole in the pitching staff. 10. Sox will do something at 3B, and this will be their "big splash." In short, I think the Sox will not be hugely active this offseason. Instead, they will hope for rebound years from LaRoche, Cabrera, Ramirez, and improvement years from Garcia and Sanchez or Johnson, plus perhaps more from Abreu. And they will hope that the pitching will have a better result with a little more offense. In 2017, LaRoche, Ramirez, and Danks will be gone, which will free up money for the Sox to make another free agent foray. The pitching will be led by Sale, Rodon, Quintana, and Fullmer, and a solid bullpen. If the Sox have somehow fixed 3B this offseason, their focus will be on RF, DH, 2B, and C, with Anderson coming up to play SS. If they don't jettison Ventura, it won't really matter. after reading all this.... i am really depress. .... esp the 2 bolds.

QUOTE (AustinIllini @ Sep 29, 2015 -> 03:55 AM) It's probably not that bad, mostly for the fact that this team will be exiting its window by the time this contract is up. The only thing this contract does is really emphasize that this "dynasty" has a definitive expiration date. you know, you brought something up, i wonder how long Q can keep that excellence of what he brings out in the players going without getting burn out.

QUOTE (AustinIllini @ Sep 29, 2015 -> 03:55 AM) It's probably not that bad, mostly for the fact that this team will be exiting its window by the time this contract is up. The only thing this contract does is really emphasize that this "dynasty" has a definitive expiration date. yeah you are calling it. i kind of sad now.

QUOTE (thxfrthmmrs @ Sep 28, 2015 -> 06:11 PM) I don't think we have much of a shot at Heyward, but we're talking about our/other people's plan in this thread, not the most likely scenarios here. If we are going after Heyward, a 2nd round pick is least of my concern someone mention and brought out an interesting set of additional numbers that many probably didn't account for. i know i didn't. it was the additional salary that players are going to get for bonuses and contract extensions. wasn't that around 15 mil additional ???

QUOTE (shysocks @ Sep 28, 2015 -> 06:17 PM) Good stuff, thanks for pulling that together. One additional thing I want to point out is that even though his K/9 dropped in the second half, it's really just because the innings that made up his personal "/9" got shorter. The percentage of batters faced that he struck out remained effectively identical, from 23.0% to 22.8%. I think I also saw a stat somewhere that he went from using 19 pitches per inning to 15. either way, with all the stats that are out there, everyone should be able to see, it was improving. the sox did a hell of a job with him this yr. i really had my doubts with all the other BS happening. nice to see the great work done by the sox coaches.

QUOTE (Tony82087 @ Sep 29, 2015 -> 03:42 AM) Thank you for teaching me about the NHL salary cap, appreciate it. And if it was for 5 seasons, the average cap hit would have had to of been much higher. But you already knew that... this was an excellent conversation going on. i really hated to jump in.... but now it seem to be coming to end. i will say, i am in the group who thinks that he deserves the value of that contract. but i also agree it is too long. it should have been a 4-5 yr extension starting at the end of this season. i just hope it is not another bickell contract ....

QUOTE (Sox Fan In Husker Land @ Sep 29, 2015 -> 02:56 AM) How in the hell could Quintana be undervalued? In the last years these are the pitching leaders in fWAR: 1. Kershaw 22.7 2. Price 16.9 3. Scherzer 16.7 4. Sale 16.2 5. Kluber 15.4 6. Hernandez 14.4 7. Lester 13.7 8. Quintana 13.3 9. Greinke 13.3 10. Bumgarner 13.2 And then when his contract is this for the next possible 5 years he is not undervalued. 2016: $3.8M 2017: $6M 2018: $8.8M 2019 Team Option: $10.5M ($1M buyout) 2020 Team Option: $10.5M ($1M buyout) If Quintana is traded he better bring a hefty return. excellent research. and look at the salary of those in the list and compare it to Q....... that in itself is the selling point.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Sep 29, 2015 -> 01:39 AM) And I'd bet you are wrong. Name value still means something even at the highest levels. Just ask the Padres for an extreme example. it is really simple. the sox will ask for a pkg and if the other teams kind of balks.... then the sox will walk away. i wish i remember 1 or the posters came up with a call example that was extremely funny on something like this. damn from now on, i am going to do a cut and paste. does anyone remember who was the poster???

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Sep 29, 2015 -> 01:03 AM) It should be both, to be honest. Like, the Hamel package + Gallo is what it should have been. i like the potential of a nice rtn for Q, if Q is indeed on the trade list. dang, i wish the WS is over and we the fans can enjoy the arz league and the cap league and the black hawks and of course the off season with the managers mtg and all. how is that with the and.....

QUOTE (Jerksticks @ Sep 29, 2015 -> 12:58 AM) I feel the opposite. I trust our FO to fleece somebody. The White Sox rarely lose trades these days. lets say, i trust Hahn.

QUOTE (Hatchetman @ Sep 29, 2015 -> 12:54 AM) Now that I have a family, an MLB game is the only one I can afford to take them to! the best family outing for family quality time is going to games.... games of any kind, nhl, nba chi white sox and yeah even the bears. it doesn't matter how many games you go to, just make it a best family outings you can make. trust me, now in my old time, i can remember the good time.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 28, 2015 -> 11:48 PM) I really feel like it is how we get our cornerstone 3B. or catcher.

QUOTE (ewokpelts @ Sep 28, 2015 -> 10:55 PM) 2006: 2.96 million 2007: 2.68 million I don't recall 2013, but it outdrew 2014 and possibly 2015. many thanks

QUOTE (ewokpelts @ Sep 28, 2015 -> 09:45 PM) the sox had two of their best attended years ever when the Dan Ryan was completely shut down. And 2007 they lost 90 games! The red line project had little impact in 2013 as the green line station served all riders from the red line. And the sox reduced parking fees as a buffer. Your argument is invalid. there is no right or no wrong. i don't understand why it is important to prove anyone wrong. now the whole point is, unless the sox build a team that a can compete and b. stop blaming the fans for not coming out, nothing may get done. it is as SS2k5 stated, the owners may not invest in the team unless the fans comes out..... or so the owners believe in that. in all this, what were the actual attendance numbers of the yrs you stated???

QUOTE (raBBit @ Sep 28, 2015 -> 09:28 PM) Not sure if you could say that without seeing how the rotation actually shapes out. For me, it's not as cut and dried as "Yes, I would trade Quintana" or "No, I wouldn't trade Quintana." It's "I would trade Quintana for players X, Y and Z" or "I wouldn't trade Quintana for players A and B." i agree. esp if trading Q will give the sox a hole in the pitching rotation .... i don't think Fulmer will be able to step in right away. 2nd bold. excellent.

QUOTE (bmags @ Sep 28, 2015 -> 09:11 PM) We probably will trade Q because he's the only one I don't think we should trade anymore. he is the only one that can be played into the trade game. however i rather not trade him either, but he will bring in the biggest rtn of assets .

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Sep 28, 2015 -> 10:10 PM) New videos posted to the YouTube channel, including Zangari, Zavala, Stephens, Feliz and others from the AZL. Here it is. AZL footage is hard to come by - MLB Pipeline asked our permission to use our videos and pictures from AZL for this reason. We are fortunate to have these, from Kim Contreras. One of the videos is the last out of the AZL Championship series. Nothing interesting prospect-wise, but kind of fun to watch the celebration. You can subscribe to the channel as well, and get an email whenever new stuff goes up. We should have some stuff from Great Falls soon as well. We now have video up of over 50 current White Sox prospects. very good.

reading the article, the only thing i can get is, this is a long explanation on answer the "maybe Q can be traded". in other words, i didn't get a real feeling one way or the other, but i get the feeling of a hedge toward the no.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Sep 28, 2015 -> 09:05 PM) A few things to keep in mind... 1. Trey was 20 years old this year, making him 2+ years younger than the average player at his level 2. His K rate went down from 27.8% last year to 21.4% this year, a substantial drop 3. Power generally develops later, especially for prep signees like Trey, and he hit 35 doubles this year in 532 PA (vs 27 in 579 last year) so he's hitting the ball hard 4. His walk rate went up too, to a nice 9.4%. That's a good sign for a hitter who is quite young for his level. 5. Trey had just 56 games of rookie ball despite being a teenager and hitting just .236 there 6. I think you are significantly overestimating a major league average 3B. The average dude is somewhere around .750 in the majors, or a little below. He's been very challenged assignment-wise, yet he has improved pretty much across the board against much more mature competition. I am not saying he's a definite starting 3B in the majors, but indications are quite positive so far. very nice..... again, like i said i want to be wrong. but i still want another option at 3b. i do not want to put all the eggs in one basket. many thanks.

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Sep 28, 2015 -> 07:15 PM) Ok now, there were about 5,000 active, regular Blackhawks fans prior to $ Bill dying and McDonough being hired. Now, it sure helped they had dynamic, young talent and a whole lot of easy fixes (they had 2 people in their marketing department the day $ Bill died, for f***'s sake, and they didn't air home games), but to act like the Hawks had any sort of fanbase prior to McDonough and getting good is silly. The Sox have a couple nice, young, dynamic arms in the minors and two assets that could super charge their rebuild in Sale and Abreu should they consider blowing it up. most are really missing the point. when McD took over, there was a new owner in place.... if there was ever a chance for McD to take over the sox..... it will not happen. the owners would have to relinquish alot of their power and decision making.

QUOTE (Lip Man 1 @ Sep 28, 2015 -> 07:04 PM) Have never been to Wrigley Field (literally) so I don't know what the neighborhood is like. Have heard it's more young, upscale, yuppie-like. I do know that historically the Sox have been fighting perceptions about the area since the social unrest of the 1960's. That's unfair to be sure but perception becomes reality in the mind of the public over time and that's something of a reality for the Sox. I personally know of many Sox fans who are older who simply refuse to go into the area around U.S. Cellular Field. Mark when i had my season tickets all those yrs ago, it was bad. it is more rougher in the northside. why, b/c the parking at the sox games are secured. unless if they park outside the area. but i wouldn't know. i always thought it was the mystique of the area, plus the idea of continue to party in around the area. i never like the team up there, but there was a bar called wild hair right across the park. yeah i went up there and have a hell of a time. but that was in the 80 and early 90's. there is that same climate around the sox park.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Sep 28, 2015 -> 07:52 PM) What makes you think that? i don't know, and i hope i am wrong but at this time, if it was a decision i had to make today, i would question the prospect of Trey being a everyday 3b at the majors. 2015 - avg 259 hrs 7 hits 123 k's 114 total ab's 474 http://www.baseball-reference.com/register...id=michal000tre but with his total ab, compared to hits and k's. plus add his homerun total not a good formula of what the fo expects from a everyday 3b.