LDF

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 27, 2015 -> 02:45 PM) What is the White Sox "brand" right now? What does being a White Sox player represent...to the players, and to the fans? What are they trained in from the very beginning, the first day they sign and go to rookie ball? Most other organizations now have their own version/s of "Cardinals' Way"...but we've never developed a book/system, and it's 1) because not enough of our minor leaguers make an impact on the major league results, or 2) we've never taken the time to map out a strategy of instruction from Point A to Point B with all the scouts as well as major/minor league coaches working in collaboration. or c) we the fans are not privy to that info. damn i hate being so negative today. sorry.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 27, 2015 -> 02:33 PM) Then you pass on him and let him fall costing him slot money with every team that passes on him. That is the risk for Aiken. you are 100% right. in the next CBA, that is going to be address. i think its for the top several rounds or less.

QUOTE (StRoostifer @ May 27, 2015 -> 02:35 PM) Lmao, good one LDF! I have been staying away due to my own high emotions and to be honest, I have the same complaints and concerns as everyone else so it would be redundant for me to post my frustrations. You're right, every little thing is magnified right now due to an overall bad performance and elevated expectations going into this season which just adds to the difficultly in keeping the emotions in check. Trying times for Sox fans indeed. again a nice post. the thing is everyone here is a sox fan, no one thinks the same and everyone has opinions. loosing brings out the worst in people and fingers start to point. i know, b/c i am one of them. but i point my fingers to the ownership. i backed RV esp going into this season, but i also said, this will tell if he can manage. i will let the posters decide that.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 27, 2015 -> 02:24 PM) Yeah, I wouldn't do it for full slot because of the risks, but if he checked out, and he would be willing to give a good discount to prevent falling into the 20's like the new mocks are showing, I would do it. the thing is, the teams really can't look too deeply into the medical rpt unless the players gives it to them....

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 27, 2015 -> 02:23 PM) So you really think the manager is why this team isn't in first place? If you think that, maybe you should lay off ownership as apparently they have put together a baseball team you think should win a lot of games. the buck stops with the ownership. they are the ones that dictates policy. ~~~ edit, don't get me wrong, i really do hope i am wrong, i wish someone could show me that i am full of crap, but this is how i see it,.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 27, 2015 -> 02:18 PM) This is his 4th season as a manager. The lack of experience complaint window has long passed. and as a default, when does one end the experiment??

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 27, 2015 -> 02:13 PM) By that argument, no CEO or manager or coach should ever be fired, except for gross negligence. Unless you accept the fact that the White Sox actual or real "mean" is 0-5 games under .500 (and last place in the division) and are contented with that level of performance....then we'll be stuck in that same pattern of continual and consistent mediocrity for another 20-30 years. you made in interesting point here. the org appears to be contented, it is the fans that are not.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 27, 2015 -> 02:02 PM) How much does anyone here have, but they all claim to know everything Robin supposedly does incorrectly. It's not rocket science, and he played the game and was a leader for a long time. true, but not all players can coach or coach well enuf. but you can not denied they had experience in coaching.

QUOTE (StRoostifer @ May 27, 2015 -> 02:09 PM) This thread has been an interesting read to say the least. Lots of emotions and its understandable. Going into last winter everyone knew of the many holes the Sox had and the front office did the best they could to fill as many of those holes as possible. For many reasons things have not worked out in the first two months and I blame the organization as a whole and not just certain individuals. From JR to the fricken towel boy are to be held accountable. All have failed to do their part and have contributed to this mess of a so called baseball team. The emotional part of me wants to tear this motha apart and restock the farm but that's just frustration on my part and do not really want to see a full scale rebuild. IMO, it would be a viable option with the right front office but this is not the right FO. In the end, all I can do is to continue to support the Sox with blind fandom because there are no realistic options for me. I just cannot bail on a team ive been cheering for so many years and go searching for a new favorite because they are currently better than the Sox. For me, all I can do is hope the "core" players improve and the rest play well enough to have some trade value should another GM come calling. To those that might be considering finding a new team, I wish you well and hope you find what you seek. To those sticking it out, let's pull up a keg and tap that b**** because its looking like we have a long four months ahead of us. when did you get any intelligence??? bravo real nice. the other thing is when things goes bad, every little nick gets magnified.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 27, 2015 -> 01:56 PM) I remember the same things being said about Ozzie. he was also a coach...

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 27, 2015 -> 01:54 PM) Why don't you look at how those guys started out. they all had some king of coaching job before the managers job. how much did RV had in coaching??

QUOTE (harkness @ May 27, 2015 -> 01:46 PM) I don't blame Ventura for very game... but. 1. Some of you are forgetting that Ventura didn't WANT to be a manager - they had to talk him into it. 2. The team (especially in the past two years) just makes a bunch of sloppy non major league level mental errors... at this level where everyone a professional this really looks like coaching - I don't know why Ventura doesn't work but he doesn't. He just doesn't get through to these guys. Its glaringly obvious. nice.... 1. hawks team, Savy is coach, was he good, will he become better, he was a chi org guy. Q became avail and the org made a daring move, fired Savy and hired Q. the sox need to be this daring, they already screwed up in the offseason on 2 coaching fronts. 2. this team has an expiration date.... this team can not waste another yr seeing if RV could become the manager that the FO hoped.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 27, 2015 -> 02:39 PM) And yet everyone still gives Hawk the GM hell for firing Tony LaRussa even though after 83 the 84 team sucked, the 85 team was decent and they were playing horribly in 1986 when he was fired. Fregosi had a 40 point higher winning percentage as the White Sox manager that year. Yeah, firing the manager makes many fans happy, but it doesn't fix things. Robin is fine. If your closer is going to get rocked, and it happens from time to time with every one of them, you are probably going to lose. this is a philosophy that goes back a long way. this cliche of a manager will find ways to motivates his team, i don't see that in him. but then again i don't live in chicago.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ May 27, 2015 -> 02:37 PM) My pick would be Don Cooper. I don't think he'll be part of the next managing regime, unless he is the manager himself, so might as well give him that chance now. He deserves it after all these years in the organization There's a good chance he's a disaster, which is fine by me. No different then what is going now. At best, his fiery personality could light a fire under this team. His personality will be good to grab some much needed headlines even when we stink. Keep us somewhat relevent. Similar to Ozzie in that regard. fiery temper sure, but wouldn't he be closely recognize with RV???

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 27, 2015 -> 02:21 PM) Which ones doomed the White Sox? They gave up 10 runs. They all were earned. There was an error but that meant nothing. If Carlos Sanchez bobbles a ball or Jose Abreu drops a pop up, as much as you think it is Robin's fault, they still would do the same thing if someone else was sitting in the dugout. We might as well start a thread about acquiring Bryce Harper and Mike Trout. The chances are just as good that happens. This thread was created to hopefully generate more Robin bashing. Last night was not on the manager. last nite game, 5-26, was a first time i truly saw this team score like i thought they could. but lets go further, Roberson loosing a lead??? how many times is that going to happen. when it rains it pours. can't get a freaking break. somebody must have really pissed of the baseball gods.

QUOTE (oldsox @ May 27, 2015 -> 02:31 PM) LDF, I think the comment was said/written with tongue in cheek. thanks for the heads up. i think it was mention something about green. on a side note, i know what he said was just not him. i am glad i was extremely wrong.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ May 27, 2015 -> 02:18 PM) Well then, it won't hurt the franchise canning Ventura. the owner's rep of not firing their cronies comes to mind. but this discussion, who is a good candidate to replace him in the interim.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 27, 2015 -> 12:49 PM) WHY DON"T YOU POOR PEOPLE JUST GO GET A JOB THAT PAYS BETTER! while i was truly staying out of this, this comment is sooo condescending that it sound like a person whose way of thinking is imperialistic. i know what i said is NOT true of your character, its what you wrote. oops i made a mistake on the bold.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 27, 2015 -> 08:20 AM) http://www.baseball-reference.com/leagues/...ttendance.shtml White Sox have the 9th highest attendance (per game) increase in the majors so far in 2015 despite being the 2nd worst team in the AL, and the worst statistically. Seattle and San Diego have had very active off-seasons in the last two cycles. Oakland, Cleveland, Washington and Pittsburgh were either playoff teams or had strong playoff aspirations. Finally, the Mets had all that young pitching, and Harvey returning back from TJ surgery. Interestingly enough, the Rangers, Phillies, Braves, Rockies, Rays and Twins were all in the 2nd-5th year of rebuilding cycles. Can we say that all of them, along with Angels (they made the playoffs, were expected to win the division again, have the best player in baseball, etc.) and Yankees fans....are "fairweather/bandwagon" fans? Are Miami and Arizona fans too impatient for winning teams? this is a great find on attendance. maybe it will add to the mix that of the attendance argument.

this is my rant and in all fairness meant for no one on this site. this is based on my personal opinions. the fans for the most part, and like i have always said, are not like the northside. the sox fans are, for the most part blue collar workers and as Veeck said work hard for a living. the fans of the sox do not want to waste their hard earned money on a crappy team, does this make them less of a fan? the sox fans are intelligent and do on occasion come out to see the games, maybe not as often as some would hope or for that fact, the owners want. but again whose fault is that??? the blame is solely placed on the owners shoulder for this state of the sox and the lack of interest in the team. just b/c they spent money, doesn't mean they spent money wisely, there is still a huge reak of mismanagement in the front office. spend the money you are spending for baseball smartly, good coaches, for starters. i can say more on this, but i have said it before, even yesterday. the fans will come out and support this team or the sox in general, do not have the expectation that the attendance will rival the northside, that road was never taken when the owners had a chance to do it right. the sox can easily draw 2.25+ mil. again, the time to take over chi as the main baseball team was wasted. will it ever present itself again, prob not. it is not the fans faults, we will not endorse a crappy team??? this team does has the ability to do much better.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 27, 2015 -> 08:43 AM) http://sports.yahoo.com/news/10-degrees--t...433447-mlb.html Wonder if we'll be able to draw any conclusions from the new "spin rate" data on our pitchers... Top-end exit velocity, like spin, isn’t always a proxy for the best players. Mike Trout, Bryce Harper and Miguel Cabrera appear on one top 10 list. Pedro Alvarez, Melky Cabrera, Mark Trumbo, Howie Kendrick and Joc Pederson appear on two apiece. And while none of them is a slouch – particularly Pederson – they’re not among the best players in baseball, either. i wonder if something like this data is available for the upcoming FA pitchers next yr? btw.... nice find

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 26, 2015 -> 09:41 PM) Or nothing at all. nice one. good come back. with that, all is good and i am done here.

QUOTE (raBBit @ May 26, 2015 -> 10:27 PM) You're trying to create a narrative. Resigning your own players and one big acquisition isn't looked at as a "big offseason" by the industry. The Sox have nothing to compare with this past offseason really. '04-'05 brought in a big influx of players but it was veteran scrap heap pick ups and moving on from very productive hitters in Maggs/Lee. These are unchartered territories for the Sox. I know I'll get a lot of a hate but I don't think a lost season this year deters the Sox from their path. Almost all of our past productive players are going to play to their ability once again. No eight week sample is going to change that. DH LaRoche 1B Abreu SS Ramirez LF Cabrera CF Eaton RF Garcia SP1 Sale SP2 Quintana SP3 Rodon SP5 Danks CL Robertson LHP Duke LHP Jennings RHP Jones We'll have some money to spend despite what Balta thinks ( ) and we will be more insulated in depth. Almost all of our better prospects will be in the higher ranks of the minors so not only can they fathomably help the big league team, they have more perceived value in trade. All of the following will be at AA/AAA. INF: Sanchez, Johnson, Michalczewski, Anderson, Saladino (depth) OF: Thompson, Hawkins, May, Engel (outside chance) Pitching: Danish, Montas, Fry, E. Johnson, Webb, Beck, #8 pick. We haven't had depth like that since 2000. Holes will still exist at C/3B/2B/ and we'll need a starter (Samardzija or whoever) but long term the team's state hasn't changed much. this should have gone in the The Optimism Thread. btw, nice post.

QUOTE (fathom @ May 26, 2015 -> 09:19 PM) Dan Hayes @CSNHayes · 3m 3 minutes ago Chris Beck will start Game 2 of Thursday's doubleheader. #WhiteSox oh yeah!!!!

QUOTE (fathom @ May 26, 2015 -> 09:17 PM) Hard to tell, right now it's just a worst case scenario in basically every aspect. Every possible question mark coming into the season has been a negative: - Abreu avoiding soph slump - LaRoche/Alexei avoiding history of bad starts - any question marks about Melky hitting without help - Johnson's defense at 2nd - Sanchez not being able to hit enough - Conor's defense - weak catching tandem - 4th/5th starters (Danks/Noesi) a great list and i am sure there are a couple more to add. for me, it would deal with the coaches and / or if this team has lost faith in them???