LDF

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 28, 2015 -> 06:47 PM) If teams are going to "offer a crap load" to get a pitcher...there's a problem for us. Actually 2. Hamels and Cueto...both are better pitchers than Samardzija and both are likely available if teams are willing to make a major offer. very true, but you are also not including other soon to be FA pitchers who will be available. that is why this talk of selling players on the majors team, and not the minors is not really doing it for me. btw. excellent point.

QUOTE (Tex @ May 28, 2015 -> 01:31 PM) That sounds subjective. It is easy to say anything about the Waco shooting in favor or against. The Waco shooting shows how the laws worked. With more guns, more ammo, more higher power weapons people in neighboring businesses would have been killed. With higher capacity more people would have been killed. Those weapons were not present making this a lot better than the horror it could have been. for the most part, i have been staying out of this. but come on. there is always going to be a source to acquire weapons, even if it is going out of state. it is part of the illegal activity that thrives in the US. if you need proof, see how the government is dealing with yrs of strict laws concerning drugs.

QUOTE (Soxfest @ May 28, 2015 -> 07:23 PM) Send Avi to DL let him rest the knee. excellent opinion,

QUOTE (StRoostifer @ May 28, 2015 -> 07:32 PM) If you were the GM of a contending team, just how much would you give up for an aging/declining SS or a starting pitcher that got off to a bad start and will only be a two or three month rental? IMO, I would not be willing to give up much for either one of them if I were a GM looking to upgrade. Let's also keep in mind that fans almost always over value their teams players. re a team that needs a pitcher. now that is the wild card in this discussion. many teams, contending teams do trade for a pitcher for that playoff run. the intangible is, how good of a chance will that team will do in the playoff? lets look at Hou, they do have a chance to do nicely, right now, it not even mid season. but they might offer a crap load to get a pitcher like Shark, now that, his beginning of the season constant problems is over.

QUOTE (ptatc @ May 28, 2015 -> 07:04 PM) I have no idea. I have not been in the clubhouse with Ventura to judge these things. The point isn't that he will stick with it. The point is that the HOF managers you listed had worse records than Ventura in the early years. So if you think Ventura is awful and should be out of the game, these HOF managers should have been in the same scenario and wouldn't have had the chance to grow into the managers the became. I'm not saying Ventura is a great or HOF manager. He has a number of players that are not playing to their previous levels. Could this be on Ventura? Sure. Could it be that they are just having bad years? Sure. Players have bad years. Either way the team has underachieved so far and if it continues Ventura will be gone at the end of the year, mostly because the front office really can't do anything else. not at this time, but my problem is, if the sox org will still keep him here next yr, i don't want to waste another yr for this experiment.

this is not meant for blasting the owners group. the thing is, this was, maybe a failed experiment. they really didn't do RV nor the org any favors by getting RV to coach. RV was always a good guy and he is still one, but now with this managing fracaso is not going to help. i really feel bad for RV to put up with this

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 28, 2015 -> 05:19 PM) Martin Scorcese's HUGO is a much better version of Tomorrowland, fwiw. i never saw hugo. but tomorrowland is a great family movie. the kind that i would see in the 60's with a disney hype and a huge family event.

QUOTE (gatnom @ May 28, 2015 -> 05:26 PM) If the Sox end up selling, I'd be shocked if they traded Alexei. Anderson looks to be more than a year away, and since I don't think Alexei has much value, there's no point in trading him away for a prospect that doesn't have much of a chance of impacting the team. They're not going to be completely tearing this thing down no matter what happens this season. excellent point. i agree.

QUOTE (SCCWS @ May 28, 2015 -> 03:31 PM) But it can be But again, you move Sanchez to SS, which was not his primary position in the minors, when he pretty much has shown he needs time in AAA as his bat and walk/SO ratio is horrible. If that is what Hahn is thinking, they should have stuck w Johnson and played Sanchez at SS in Charlotte until Alexei could be moved. Then you have to bring up another infielder to play 2B or play Gordon full time. Playing young players when they really belong in the minors can cause long-term problems for some kids. exactly, for how bad Alexei is on offense, at least right now, he stabilize the defense right now. there is no one in the farm that can come up and replace him.

QUOTE (gatnom @ May 28, 2015 -> 03:34 PM) I'd say they're being held back by their decisions prior to the Hahn era, but they seem to be moving in the right path nowadays. Now if only they could develop some positional prospects... i agree, with this and this bring to mind, something just does not fit. not with what you wrote. but to me, it feels like a shift is going on in the front office. i can't put my finger on it. it goes back to when KW was looking at the GM post in Tor. i think Hahn is slowly winning in that dept. we as fans has to suffer with this. but this team is so freaking close to being something special. they are stupid to burn its fan base.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ May 28, 2015 -> 03:28 PM) Sometimes I feel like I'm witnessing a different reality than half of this board. We're in year TWO (2)(!) of the Rick Hahn rebuild, the farm system is stronger than it's been in ten years, we've got a relatively clean set of financial commitments going forward despite a huge bump in payroll, attendance is up, and the White Sox continue to increase their revenues every single year. How can an argument be made that the fans or city of Chicago is holding the team back? Is the team being held back at all? By what? a voice of reasoning and well played. nice.

QUOTE (gatnom @ May 28, 2015 -> 03:17 PM) Are our options limited? I mean, we've gone through a whole lot of losing in the past few years, but the team remains profitable. For years, I've read on this site that we need to rebuild on the fly or else we will lose the fan base. Looks like we lost it regardless. it depends on how you see it. cup is what half full or half empty. the sox did not loose their die hard fans, but it would be worst if they did a complete overall.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 28, 2015 -> 03:17 PM) Actually he didn't. He turned down multiple interviews. Houston comes to mind as one for some reason. dang, i was wrong. i remembered it differently.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ May 28, 2015 -> 01:26 PM) Hahn is the GM. He wouldn't have taken the job otherwise. yes he would, just like anything else, he will have parameters to live by, if not, he would still be looking for a job. remember he tried for several yrs to hook up with another team, and didn't get the job. btw ....... how would you know the inner makings of the politics of the sox FO??

trading Shark is seriously will not be the right move. i do not know what team will be willing to pay a king's ransom to get him. esp considering what the sox gave up for him. he is better off playing out the yr with the sox and see this team goes. ref Alexi, age and playing ability is the key word. plus will anderson be ready next yr. lets not look into hoping for the best case, like they did with Micah and Sanchez. the actually knowledge that anderson is ready to play everyday in the majors. so who to sell, i am going to be really harsh here. Davidson, Hawkin, Sanburn, EJ for whatever, May, Engel ..... i will trade them for comp picks or int'l slot money.

QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ May 28, 2015 -> 06:30 AM) At least Micah's problem is footwork and hands. I'd imagine that's got to be about the "easiest" thing to fix. He's got the speed for defense, he's got the range, he's got the athleticism. That stuff is the stuff that hard's to teach. He needs reps and instructions. excellent post.

http://www.si.com/mlb/2015/05/22/mlb-mock-...son-dillon-tate

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 28, 2015 -> 03:31 AM) No, I'm sure the entire marketing department at 35th and Shields did as well. well the sox marketing needs a kick in the arse to get them on the ball.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 28, 2015 -> 03:13 AM) Caulfield is the only person on this site that questioned the attendance that night. ok that is kool. but for all points of view on attendances. imho, the sox are lucky to be getting what they are getting, based on how they came out of the gate, this season. but i will this sing the praises of hitters on this team. they will turn it around. i have faith in that. for now, i will be eating crow for my 90 game win prediction, but oh well. pass the ketchup.

QUOTE (StRoostifer @ May 28, 2015 -> 01:35 AM) Adams 7ip 3H 1ER 2BB 4K Coats 2-3 2B HR Anderson 1-4 May 2-4 now that is Adams that i remember from last yr and his performances. to all sox prospects, keep up the great work!!!!

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 28, 2015 -> 02:51 AM) So you refuse to answer why you yourself questioned the 17k attendance Sale vs. Kluber. No one is really questioning fandom. If you only attend games when the team is a winner, it is a bandwagon fan. But when you don't show up when they do have success, it makes sustaining success much more difficult, because when teams win, their payroll jumps. Amd just for the record, the 75 win Mike Quade led 2010 Cubs drew 105,000 more fans than the White Sox did in their highest attended season. i just came back. i am a little confuse, are you questioning why more fans did not show up for Sale's game?? am i reading this right?

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 28, 2015 -> 12:11 AM) Robertson pro-positioned by Shark, blows save but bravely Venturas into uncharted multiple inning waters. very creative, better than my #96

QUOTE (Hatchetman @ May 28, 2015 -> 12:44 AM) White Sox Motto: The customer is always wrong. i thought it was more along the lines of do very little to make it show that management does care and the fans will buy it.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 28, 2015 -> 12:28 AM) 1) There were almost the exact same number of Chicagoland and NW Indiana fans at White Sox and Cubs games as recently as 2010. It's not "fan loyalty." It's better marketing, a historic park, day baseball, regional tourism and Wrigleyville that make the difference for that extra 25% the Cubs get every year. Along with that, the mystique of 100+ years without winning a World Series. 2) "It's never going to get SO bad that the team will be in danger of leaving." They're simply too profitable, and they have too many synergies with the Bulls to make it a logical move for Reinsdorf. As Balta has pointed out numerous times now, this whole idea of the fanbase not being tolerant or patient enough for a rebuild...well, essentially they have been patiently waiting for the better part of a decade now. Because they committed the same mistake as the Phillies, they held onto veterans too long and couldn't rebuild on the fly. They should have been smart enough to realize even teams like the Yankees, Red Sox, Dodgers and Angels struggle with this concept, and they have HUGE margins for error financially. What we've been doing essentially since the beginning of the 2012 season is REBUILDING, no matter what label you put on it. Would the White Sox have suffered financially if they hadn't spent all that money in the off-season? Of course not, they'd be even more profitable (this season), and attendance would be down another 1,000-2,000 rather than being up about 2,000 per game. In the overall scheme of things, is that COST really worth this whole idea we're struggling with of rebuilding versus "reloading" or whatever KW/Hahn want to call it? Spend wisely and be smarter. Don't get desperate and overpay for guys like Melky, LaRoche, Robertson, Bonifacio and Samardzija. Be patient....follow the process to its logical conclusion. Even if you don't accept the Cubs/Sox comparisons on rebuilding....then follow the example of the Astros. Were they really in a much better position as a fanbase to blow things up? They went through an RSN bankrupting itself and the worst TV ratings in MLB history, but they've come out the other side and are positioned for a 3-5 year run now if everything breaks right. We, on the other hand, might not be. The bandwagon hasn't emptied all at once. It has taken almost a decade of damage inflicted by KW to get to this point. Don't insult the fans with "patsy" managers like Ventura, either....to deflect criticism from the product you put on the field. Be honest with the fans, but then hire the very best coaching staff possible to maximize that talent. Give them the best chance or opportunity to win. Then the fans will respect you and you will start to earn their trust back again. wow, that is nice. i would like to add but i won't...... this can stand nicely by itself.

QUOTE (chitownsportsfan @ May 28, 2015 -> 12:21 AM) So, your argument is that the fickle nature of the fans caused the team to rely too heavily on veterans during the last 5-7 years, and that also because of the fans, the team spent 50 million this year "in an attempt to bring back some of the bandwagon". Correct me if I'm wrong, but basically your argument in this thread boils down to "the fans are the problem". excuse me if you can. i know this was meant for another. as his post to me was meant for another. the fickle nature of the sox is, they thought they could do the same thing twice and be successful. they went out and got the finishing touches for the 2005 ws team. no foresight and the problem was, they, the sox got extremely lucky in 2005. everything went right. the sox fans are the problem and i am proud to be one of them. i will not pay for crap, unlike the northside who create an aura of making excuses. the sox fans are smarter and they don't forgive. that is the fine line the sox owners have to walk. other than that, i agree with you.