LDF

to all thanks, it a great day to talk sox baseball. ~~~~ Sox in '15 again when is spring training???

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Jan 3, 2015 -> 03:58 AM) He is still quite young. In fact, he could repeat A+ yet again and STILL be on the young side for the level. Keep that in mind. Also, the key to me is, he fixed a LOT of things in 2014. Not all of them, but the fact that he made that many adjustments at that age is impressive, and makes it more likely in my view that he can continue improvements. I also disagree to a certain degree about a complete inability to recognize pitches. In the article I wrote in a similar vein in April for FutureSox, I found multiple videos (including one I took) where you could see him hitch to respond to offspeed and still mash. I think that particular part of Nathaniel's analysis was too strident towards the negative. He's still a T10 guy for me, though no longer T5, in this system. i forgot about this, he did indeed improve a crap load. either way, i still like his potential.

QUOTE (Greyone @ Jan 3, 2015 -> 01:37 AM) Until Q figures out a way to get rid of him. not quite the way he works. its more like, until the really young rookie pisses him off. then he will find a way to get rid of him.

i was trying to imply of some actual hard number but as you, i am going to what has been implied and said. i also remember a long time ago and i am sorry but you have to trust me on this. the sox and management has a number where they, the owners will accept as profits. it is a hard number, and if the spending is move that the budget they assign, they will considered it a lost. even though they still makes a profit. it is all based on the budget. they the owners of the sox have always made a profit base on how they work the budget. however there are hidden revenue that is not talked about or acknowledge. the sox corp has several subsidiaries companies, it is like a multi headed creature. they use it to make and diversify the profit and lose. i am all for them making money, but lets keep it honest and not be blinded. anyway, the money the is being spent, according to either the newspapers or someone, the ticket sales has taken a significant jump as well. there were more times in the past when i complained that the sox needed to make 1 or 2 more moves, instead they, the sox took the Blackhawk route. do enuf to field the team and max the profits. there were many opportunities lost b/c the sox didn't want to reach for that golden ring. instead the sox is the last fiddle in chicago, and i will not talk about the management and lousy drafting history. now the sox can over take the northsiders easily, just by fielding a playoff team. the sox should not bet on the come in this roll of a dice game they always play. if the sox make a acquire 1 or 2 really needed pieces, without giving up the ship, then do it. we as fans really don't know how much it will take. then let them walk with a QO and use the draft picks to continue drafting better players. players drafted in the 1 rd as oppose to getting lucky and hoping for a quality player in the later round. the thing is, if the rumors are true, even the sox are looking at another player for the infield. so we are not that far off, we are talking about how and different way in getting the same.

QUOTE (Knuckles @ Jan 2, 2015 -> 11:18 PM) Tuevo called up, Versteeg to miss time with injury. dang after all the good work he has been doing.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 3, 2015 -> 12:29 AM) The problem is, Viciedo literally won't be on our minor league team. For us to keep him next year costs >$4 million. He might benefit from a few months on some team's minor league squad, but we're not paying him that kind of money to be in the minors. We might not pay him that kind of money to be on the bench either. i forgot about that. so let say the sox subtract that 4 mil that will leave some extra money to spend elsewhere.

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Jan 2, 2015 -> 06:33 PM) Something about that should have made the goal not count. Who wouldn't have been distracted? there is really no way it is against the rules to distract. only if you interfere.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jan 2, 2015 -> 11:03 PM) quick shot at phonetic pronunciation: air-iss-bel uh-rue-buh-ray-nuh lol .... crap, you asking me to try to pronounce that, i can barely spell were and wear.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 2, 2015 -> 11:21 PM) Viciedo would be a great option as a backup corner OF and backup DH/1b if he could put up a >.800 OPS against lefties. Basically, if he were a decent hitter against lefties he'd fit our needs perfectly off the bench. The problem continues to be that he hasn't had good platoon splits against lefties since 2012 and he was an abjectly terrible hitter against everyone last year. He'd be an upgrade over LaRoche against lefties since LaRoche was almost Leury-bad against lefties, but that doesn't mean he'd be any good. Worse, I still think the only way Viciedo will ever amount to anything is if he gets consistent at bats. At this point that might be even in the minor leagues with someone or on a team that thinks they're out of it from day 1. Is he going to get better against lefties if he's playing 1-2 days a week? ohhh very interesting thought. i like the way you are thinking. thinking outside the box. either way, DV will not help the team if he is not traded or something.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jan 2, 2015 -> 08:33 PM) The cost has to be justified though too. I really feel that adding a good, solid mid-rotation starter would be good too, but I don't know that they have the funds available within their budget to make such a move while also maintaining flexibility to add at the deadline as well. So that leaves trading for another starter like that and I don't know that they want to give up much more than they already have this offseason. It's the same thing with Zobrist as well. Yes, he'd be a significant upgrade, but he's going to cost quite a bit of talent and you can't ensure that he is a long-term solution to the problem. The Sox are in a position where they have a good deal of talent, but not a lot of depth, and trading for marginal or even significant upgrades at this point in time further depletes that depth. Aside from a minor move or two, I do think they're pretty much done. which numbers are you and everyone is using. the previous 90-100 mil?? well they have surpass that number by a lot. as you said, the sox need to be really smart in adding any other players. it may not cost the huge haul to acquire 1 of the players i have mention before. protect the main core and trade the others prospects. some of those prospects will take several yrs to fulfill their potential. as i am saying and will continue to say, the window of opportunity is now.

thinking of what been said about other players, it got me thinking on what if Hahn doesn't do or add anyone else. what are the options. well the sox could use DV as the spare backup for the outfield. i really can imagine that the sox will let the infield be. in not addressing the backup for the infield, i can imagine Davidson being the backup. last yr the sox had high hopes and it turn into the horrible nightmare. i can envision that the sox will still think he may rebound. same sort of options that the sox were depending on last yr and everything went wrong. the point is, no matter what we say, the sox will do what they will do. we can't make them do crap. it is always like they say, show you, the fans, are interested in the team to do better. well they the sox wants the fans to pay first, why??? by paying first, it will not be included in the salary until the following yr. they the team will get 1 yr of free interest. this is a lesson that the owners learned from Dollar Bill of the Hawks.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jan 2, 2015 -> 10:33 PM) While I agree that Anderson would be lower in some systems, I think I'd be surprised if he weren't in the top 3-5 of every team in the league. I think you're underrating him quite a bit as there's enough helium in his stock right now to see him very possibly end up in the top 50. From the Giants, depending on how comfortable they are with Posey remaining behind the plate, Susac is a guy who could make a lot of sense for Tampa. Not that Tampa wouldn't have interest in Blackburn or Mella too, but I think they'd like someone who will contribute this year. They have been selling pieces off, but I don't think they view themselves as rebuilding as much as they are retooling. it will of course varies with the team listed prospects. no matter what will happen in the future, the sox can still work with TPA on the trade front.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jan 2, 2015 -> 08:33 PM) The cost has to be justified though too. I really feel that adding a good, solid mid-rotation starter would be good too, but I don't know that they have the funds available within their budget to make such a move while also maintaining flexibility to add at the deadline as well. So that leaves trading for another starter like that and I don't know that they want to give up much more than they already have this offseason. It's the same thing with Zobrist as well. Yes, he'd be a significant upgrade, but he's going to cost quite a bit of talent and you can't ensure that he is a long-term solution to the problem. The Sox are in a position where they have a good deal of talent, but not a lot of depth, and trading for marginal or even significant upgrades at this point in time further depletes that depth. Aside from a minor move or two, I do think they're pretty much done. this is a great post. too bad i really don't have time to post what i want. later...... great post.

QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Jan 2, 2015 -> 08:57 PM) Giants are rumored to be hot after Zobrist. If you wanted to find an Anderson equivalent in their system, prospect ranking-wise, I would say he's probably somewhere between Keury Mella and Clayton Blackburn. If we had a top 100 list released yet, we could find out much easier, but for now, those are my guesses to someone who would have similar rankings to Anderson. Now, if a Zobrist deal is done, then I would be guessing one of those guys would be in the deal, in which case I would say my theory of Zobrist's cost could be accurate. you see, when 1 team needs and find a fix, it will open other avenues. in other words the domino effect. keep the options open.

QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Jan 2, 2015 -> 09:10 PM) I think the only move they might still make is trading Dayan Viciedo but if they don't I won't mind. He can still play OF and DH and maybe a fill in once in a great while at 1B no matter what, DV should be on the agenda to do something with him, whether it is trading him or something. TPA can use a DH .....

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jan 2, 2015 -> 05:53 PM) i think the Sox are done with all major moves for now. They are probably going into "lets see what we've got" mode until June or July, and adjust accordingly well yeah, that is the basic SOP for them, lets get a little talent, then lets go and see if they can do it. now this is one of my main b**** about the ownership. in the situation i mention, get another pitcher, ensure thru the potential of the players talent, that the team will be undoubtedly tough to beat. after the season play both pitchers against each other to extend a contract or let them both walk with a QO. the sox is loosing 2 picks, with 2 QO pitcher, A+ pitchers. the sox will get 2 additional picks in the 1 rd with there own pick. they will also be getting a slotted money as well. next yr may not be a grand slam draft, but it will be a solid draft. getting 3 - 1 rd pick will help ease the pain of the lost pick. the prospect lost, as long as it is not anderson or rodon or adams, i can live with it. playoff and more will ease that pain.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Jan 2, 2015 -> 05:45 PM) Why the fear of rookies covering one position? you make the team as strong as possible for the playoff. again in another thread i said that the sox brass may think the same way. why are they looking for other options such as a possible Drew. mlb trade rumors/

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Jan 2, 2015 -> 04:41 PM) NO, he really shouldn't. First, he has 1 year left on his deal, not 5. Second, he will be 34 year old next year, and the numbers have already tailed off a good bit over the last 2 seasons. Over the next 5? Yes, I would take my chances on young players. Third, his high WAR, as pointed out on here, is mainly from defense and defense from multiple positions. He would be 2B only and those defensive metrics are still in the dubious category anyway. (see DeAza with a positive war). And should I point out that his splits against RHP is a .703 OPS? he kills lefties. Looks like a platoon hitter these days. Top prospects for that? No way. Trade top prospects for young talent, not declining veterans. you can trade for young talent if there was 1 avail, but if not, you can trade for a stop gap. it is obvious the sox brass may be thinking that way if the trade rumors are to be taken with a grain of salt.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Jan 2, 2015 -> 04:36 PM) There is no team in MLB that would trade Andeson + for 1 year of Zobrist. He is ridiculously over-valued here, and his value is highly likely to continue decline given his age. In fact, his numbers are down a full 100 OPS points over the last 2 years, a fact ignored hereon. i agree, i was stunned when i if mention it. the value of the rtn blew me out of the water. however it also gave me a different option, if that is what tpa wanted in return.

QUOTE (shipps @ Jan 2, 2015 -> 04:30 PM) We have gumbo every year on New Years Day from my wifes side. I have eaten so much gumbo the past couple days that I dont want anymore until next new years day...seriously. 30 dozen chi style tamales. we put a huge dent but as i said i am still hurting. we are freezing the rest. i really don't when we get to them, but i am hurting. i has 1/2 bagel and cream cheese with coffee and i an still suffering. i needed it to take my heart meds. i wonder if soup will hurt me?

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jan 2, 2015 -> 03:55 PM) I think some people are using the term "utility guy" incorrectly in regards to Zobrist. It's almost as if some people feel that him being a "utility guy" is a bad thing and makes him less valuable. Just because he plays multiple positions doesn't mean he's not an everyday starter. If a team wanted to use him exclusively at one position, he'd still be well above average at most spots. In fact, I'd argue that his versatility makes him more valuable than his individual numbers alone suggest. His presence allows for more matchup plays and provides insurance at multiple spots in the event of injury. Neither of those can be quantified very easily and his rolled into his WAR, but both make him more valuable to the team. a very good point, and let me add, a player who will play different position without the team suffering defenselessly, for whatever yrs the teams wants him.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 2, 2015 -> 03:45 PM) Seriosly, you actually have to ask? well in a way, yeah, with the way Jordon is ultra competitive, on the other, the ability to sell tickets for the Hornets. it would be a shame he becomes a circus attraction to sell tickets.

has anyone heard of this rumor. i guess in a south thing. there is a mass talked of Jordon coming out to play in a series of games...... at age 58 or something like that. i tried to read all the sport sites and nothing. is it true or crap.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jan 2, 2015 -> 04:09 PM) But the idea to build a sustainable model shouldn't be based on the premise that, because they have struggled to develop hitters, they will never develop a hitter again. That's overly simplifying the subject and is not a good organizational philosophy. that is a good counter, but their are several problems at play here. 1. using whatever talent in the system to obtain a player that is needed esp if he can help in the playoff run. ~~~ KW philosophy was to use that talent to get players who can make the team better. he always thought they were 1 player short. 2. not developing the farm system. ~~~ use some of the talent if the system has an abundance of talent ~~~ not use the talent in trades or anything, unless the team is very close to competing. to give the team the final piece. this system was totally screwed up, but that window of opportunity is now, not 4-5 yrs from now when those prospects have the time to develop, if they do develop.

i have been ruminating about this long and hard, for the last several weeks. over the holidays, again how Wash would love to move several key players to have enuf financial flexibility in their payroll to invest what they need. i still can't understand why they will be willing to move these players, only they was a long term major player. so my thought would be, sign them to an extension. well they want to move Ian Desmond, Doug Fister, Jordan Zimmermann and Span. the other part of the article is they would like to make the move rather quickly. these players all have 1 yr left on their contracts and finding someone to take them on may be hard, that is if the price would be right. they really want Max Scherzer, so what would be a price for of Zimmerman / Fister / Desmond. remember 1 or 2 of these players will give them the instant room to go after Scherzer, and they have a history of dealing with his agent. all have the same agent. these players are and will still be good enuf to offer a QO and get draft picks back. fix and provide other options that imo need to be address. it will be a great stopgap to get to the playoff next yr and then let the farm start producing. in order of what i would like to offer. Hawkins, Beck, Adolfo, Sanburn, May and if needed Webb.